Tuning in…
Tuning in…
Castaway
1 appearance
Former President of Ireland and UN rights commissioner, first female Irish president and a lawyer who championed controversial causes.
On the island
Eight records
In conversation
Presenter asks
1:45Explain what you mean by moral leadership.
Moral leadership interests me because it's the most difficult, I think. You've got to be speaking out of your own experience that you've lived, and you've got to be listening to those who most need to hear the voice. ... I do stress that I'm one of the younger elders, and that is what we engage in. We think about the terrible issues of conflict, discrimination, for example, against women and girls, but there's no big stick, there's no political power. It's all about a kind of moral leadership.
Presenter asks
3:09What changed your mind about running for President of Ireland?
I wasn't attracted because it was an office that was very high, very important with the red carpet, but not actually making a difference in Irish life. Ceremonial, really. ... And then it was my husband, Nick, who said, Look, Mary, have you actually read the provisions of the Constitution about the Presidency? And I went back and I looked and I saw that the President is directly elected and takes an oath to serve the Irish people to the best of his or her ability. And I thought to myself, a President could do so much more.
Presenter asks
10:14How else did being the only girl among four brothers shape you?
I think it made me quite competitive, too, because I had to be as good as my brothers and hopefully better. And it made me comfortable in a male world in a way. ... Actually, the thing that I found remarkable in both my parents, they were both doctors, was that they imbued in me that I had the same potential, the same opportunities, the same right to be whatever I wanted to be as my brothers. And that was not the environment that I grew up in in the West of Ireland, because the place of the women was in the home. Girls were instinctively second class.
The keepsakes
The book
The Field Anthology of Irish Poetry
Edited by various
I'd like to take the Field Anthology of Irish Poetry. I actually launched it when I was President, but there was a row when the anthology was published because women were not sufficiently represented. So there was a further volume of women's poetry. I'd like that as well.
The luxury
Not recorded.
Presenter asks
14:39How was your inaugural address on the relationship between the State and the Catholic Church received?
It was strong stuff, and I felt very strongly about it. I felt that we needed to open up and not always equate sin and criminality. ... Interestingly, there was a moment of complete silence in the examination hall, which was packed when I finished. And then the applause started, and actually there was a lot of applause. And there was no real criticism at the time. But a few years later, when I was elected to the Irish Senate, I was elected on a platform which included legalising family planning through introducing a private members' bill. And when I introduced it in late 1970, early 1971, that's when the heavens opened with being denounced from pulpits by bishops having hate mail that actually affected me. I was 25, going on 26, and I remember walking down the main street in Dublin, Grafton Street, and feeling that people were going to jump out and say, I hate you, you're the devil incarnate. It was really heavy.
Presenter asks
17:50Is it true that you used to be shy?
Yes, very much so. So much so that I was determined to try and overcome that shyness by debating, and I remember going blank. I remember losing my thread because I was so shy, and I went absolutely blank several times. And so I really did have to train myself, and then I found lecturing was a great help because you had to speak for the best part of an hour and keep ... But even now, when I'm giving a speech, I do have that moment where the adrenaline is beginning to start and I I'll never be not nervous.
Presenter asks
31:02Do you feel that you have left the world a better place than you found it?
Well, I hope I've made some contribution. And indeed, what encourages me is when young people come up and say, you know, I've been following what you've been doing and it helps me and it inspires me. What I find is that my agenda keeps moving on. I had no idea that in March of twenty thirteen I would get a phone call from the Chief of Staff of the Secretary General asking me would I take on a very heavy responsibility as the special envoy for the Great Lakes and the Democratic Republic of Congo. And I couldn't say no because I actually know that problem for nineteen years. I was the first head of state as President of Ireland to go to Rwanda after the genocidal killing in 1994, in September. I will never forget the scenes that I saw.
“I joke that it's because I was the only girl wedged between four brothers, too older and too younger. So of course I had to be interested in human rights and equality, etc.”
“I remember walking down the main street in Dublin, Grafton Street, and feeling that people were going to jump out and say, I hate you, you're the devil incarnate. It was really heavy.”
“I decided to get up earlier in the morning, come in, work harder, work later, started taking sleeping pills. And by the first Christmas in 1997, I was a wreck. I was exhausted.”
“I had no idea that in March of twenty thirteen I would get a phone call from the Chief of Staff of the Secretary General asking me would I take on a very heavy responsibility as the special envoy for the Great Lakes and the Democratic Republic of Congo. And I couldn't say no because I actually know that problem for nineteen years.”