Tuning in…
Tuning in…
Castaway
1 appearance
General Secretary of the TUC, first woman in the role, and a campaigner for national minimum wage and equal pay.
On the island
Eight records
this was the first, ever and only live music event I went to with my mum when I was about nine in Bournemouth Winter Gardens and we were up in the heavens watching this tiny Tom Jones with a big voice perform. It's not unusual so it's it's my tribute to my mum really.
this is a good second generation Irish song. At the time, people sometimes forget there was a lot of anti-Irish prejudice. There was the civil rights movement in the north of Ireland in the 70s, and then that spilling into violence and conflict. It was commonplace to hear on the telly comedians telling anti-Irish jokes. You got it in the street, you know, anybody with an Irish name. So, this to me is all about being really proud of your heritage.
Double BarrelFavourite
This is the first ever club I went to in Oxford. It's a reggae and scar club. And I had bought myself a new tank top, which I was so proud of. I had self-administered a feather cut and thought I looked the bee's knees. I was an aspiring rude girl and this came on and everybody went into a long line to dance together with the same moves and I just will always remember it.
I remember going to see them at the Factory Club, and at first, it was like, what is this? It felt like a dirge, you know, after all that high-energy music. And then becoming absolutely mesmerised by them, and Ian Curtis in particular, who was just an incredible performer.
This is Tom Brown and Toni Smith, who should be credited because she co-wrote this, Funkin' for Jamaica. And I guess I've chosen this because it reminds me of the amount of dancing we do in our kitchen, have always done, and it's important to have some good dance music.
this was one my children suggested. I really loved the fact that they've chosen a track that's further back than me, even. But every time I listen to it, I kind of imagine myself in a long evening dress with a long drink. It just feels so glamorous. I love it.
And I think he writes poetically about the daily indignities, injustices that people face, the hurt and harm that's caused from unemployment, losing your job, redundancy. It's important to me because winning that job retention scheme that did save the livelihoods of twelve million workers, which was a trade union achievement, I think it explains why this is so important in a really personal, beautiful way.
because I think this is the anthem for the whole movement, really.
In conversation
Presenter asks
1:34What were your key concerns back then [when discussing the furlough scheme with Rishi Sunak]?
It was really intense and really fast-moving because we were all too aware in the trade union movement that some big companies were on the brink and about to go under and that meant job losses and misery for families concerned. So our big goal was to avoid mass unemployment. We published a report, got it over to the Chancellor's office setting out what we thought would be a fair furlough scheme, a job retention scheme, so that you would put support for business through wage packets as the best way to defend not only companies but jobs and make sure it was fair. We got mainly what we wanted. I mean, I had long conversations with him and then he called us in along with business leaders and made the announcement the following day that we would get 80% of pay with a cap, so it was weighted towards the lower paid and middle-income workers. We didn't get everything we wanted. We wanted some conditionality on employers in terms of skills training so that workers would be able to use that downtime to sharpen their skills, keep practising their skills. We didn't get everything we wanted, but nevertheless, at its peak, it saved 12 million livelihoods. So that was a real achievement for the whole trade union movement.
Presenter asks
3:51Do you think trade unions have lost their bargaining power to change that [stagnant wages]?
The evidence is clear that where people are union members, they're still doing better on pay than the average worker. So there's still that union premium if you do join up. But without doubt, you know, we've had over 10 years of austerity, wage freezes, real wage cuts. And now, of course, we've got inflation and energy bills in particular going through the roof and a lot of families really struggling. So we need the government to step up. We've been calling for an emergency budget. It's really tough. And I'm not sure every politician in government understands just how tough it is for people who don't necessarily have a lot of savings in the bank and are living week to week. And when those prices go up, it hurts.
The keepsakes
The book
Elsa Morante
It's a big book. It'll keep me busy. ... I just remember reading it as a teenager and it was about the aftermath of the Second World War and these huge upheavals of people and what it all meant for one particular woman and her children. Incredible book.
The luxury
Oil paints, brushes, and an easel (with edible paints)
This would be my time. I'd have loads of time to completely lose myself in painting, which I like doing, but never have enough time to do.
Presenter asks
7:16What kind of household was yours if we'd kind of eavesdropped on a typical night in with the five of you and your mum and dad?
Busy, crowded, four girls, one boy. My mum and dad in one room, four of us girls in the other. And my brother had a little box room that literally had the bed in. It was crowded. But lively.
Presenter asks
13:15What sort of teenager were you in terms of character at school?
I did love reading and I still love reading. But I think I went through a bit of a stage at 15 where I probably found school more difficult, I think. I think I was desperate to get on with life and to be independent and have adventures and it felt quite constraining. There was a kind of period where I was perhaps not as attending as often as I should. In terms of then moving into A-levels and things, I did have an absolutely wonderful teacher called Mrs. Stone, Scottish woman, who sort of got me by the scruff of the neck, really. And she was the one who got me to apply for university. She invited me round to her and her husband's house and did a mock interview for me. I was grateful to her. That's something I know that teachers do all the time. … Did you ever get the chance to thank her? No, so thank you, Mrs. Stone. And I don't know whether she realises that, but it was absolutely a turning point for me.
Presenter asks
21:54You've built this career while also being a lone parent to two children. I know that you've talked about your struggles with the Golden Triangle, particularly when your kids were little. What was that?
Just that whole thing that millions and millions of women, mainly women, but also men go through. Where before you even get to work, you've been up at the cracker dawn, you've got them up, you've got them washed, you've got them dressed, you drop one off at the nursery, then you have to get on the bus to drop the other one off at school, and then you have to get into work. And I'll be honest, there were times I'd get into work and I think they ought to be grateful I'm even here because I'm knackered before 8:55 a.m. So it is one of the reasons why I think how we organize work, the hours that we work, the intensity of them, that all matters alongside money because for lots of women in particular, especially if you're a single parent, the idea of even getting a job is a massive hurdle unless you've got support in place.
Presenter asks
22:41Do those kinds of firsts matter to you [being the first woman General Secretary of the TUC], and if so, why?
Well, only in so much as you think, why did it take so bloody long? You know, and it shouldn't do. And when I first got elected, I got amazing feedback and support from activists in the trade union movement who were just so pleased in a way that I suppose I hadn't really understood that it was just important. The same way I feel it in other walks of life when I do see women doing well, it gives me a lift. Symbolically, it was important, emotionally, it was important for a lot of people. I still have that thing that women, very often, we still feel we have to prove ourselves. So, that thing of working twice as hard, and that's still a problem, I think, because that shouldn't have to be that way. We all should just be able to do our best and be proud of what we do.
“It was really intense and really fast-moving because we were all too aware in the trade union movement that some big companies were on the brink and about to go under and that meant job losses and misery for families concerned.”
“I think I went through a bit of a stage at 15 where I probably found school more difficult, I think … I was desperate to get on with life and to be independent and have adventures and it felt quite constraining.”
“I hadn't found what it was that I loved doing yet until I started getting involved in the union. … I realised I enjoyed representing people.”
“I still have that thing that women, very often, we still feel we have to prove ourselves. So, that thing of working twice as hard, and that's still a problem, I think, because that shouldn't have to be that way. We all should just be able to do our best and be proud of what we do.”
“It's so shameful that a company like PO, which is owned by multinational conglomerate DP World, that makes billions of pounds in profit, said that in order to save a few Bob, it was going to sack nearly 800 workers over Zoom.”
“I am not getting out of bed until after midday. A lion. Definitely a lion. These jobs are intense and they are demanding. That's why it's good to have new blood, new energy, new ideas coming in. So I'm looking forward to a really good rest.”