Itzhak Perlman

Itzhak Perlman0:00

Hello, I'm Kirsty Young, and this is a podcast from the Desert Island Discs Archive.

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For rights reasons we've had to shorten the music. The programme was originally broadcast in 1978 and the presenter was Roy Plumley.

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Our castaway this week is the violinist Itzak Perlman.

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mister Perlman, you fly so many hundreds of thousands of miles a year that uh a spell on a desert island seems a possibility. How many miles is it you do? Have you ever worked it out? No, I never did. Uh it's it's quite amazing. I do too much. Uh

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But I just uh I'm afraid that if I stop to think about how many miles I do, I I would stop travelling'cause I I don't like it anyway. Uh but I lose a lot of bags too. You lost one just last week. I lost one just last week and uh that I remember very well. Had a lot of scores in it. A lot of scores, a lot of music, everything. I had to play a concert in my blue jeans uh

Itzhak Perlman1:01

Just last week I just

Speaker 21:02

Uh

Itzhak Perlman1:02

Bus

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in Brussels. And uh it was quite exciting. Did you have any plan in choosing these records? Are you looking back? Are they great performances? Or what what did you have in mind when you chose this eight? Well, I'll tell you, uh

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It's a combination, it's a little bit of great performances.

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and a little bit of really the music, not necessarily together. As you will see some of the great performances here are not necessarily what I would choose musically, but what I would choose because of the incredible performance.

Itzhak Perlman1:33

Nice.

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But uh the thing about living with music and just with a certain amount of music is that

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It has to be great and it has to last. Of course, uh if I would make any mistakes nobody would know about them, would they? I mean I would be stuck there. Right. What's the first one you have there? The first one is a song, a Schubert song, does Fischer Mechen. It's uh sung by uh

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Fischer Diskow and Gerald Moore at the piano.

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All these songs, they're so.

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simple in their eloquence or eloquent in their simplicity, whichever you want to call it, but they're just I I would feel that I could I could live with them forever. So I think that that's appropriate.

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Field and Meldichtim Field and Meld.

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I heard Stefanst in me, your heart has told them on flute.

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On the bottom, you should have.

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In Zeina T feroz and the mancheschene palat in Zeina T fero.

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Schubert's setting of Heine's Das Fischermeetschen from his song cycle Schwannengesang, sung by Dietrich Fischer Disker.

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Now you were born in Israel, is that right? Right.

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Where were your European roots?

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Well, my parents come from Poland.

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A musical family? Not at all. And uh they just immigrated to Israel in the nin early nineteen thirties. And uh there was nothing r seriously, there was nothing uh musical that was going on in the house except for the radio, which was on and uh and I just heard music on the radio. When did you become interested? How old were you? Three and a half.

Itzhak Perlman4:11

Old whisper

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I was three and a half when I expressed my desire to play the violin, basically.

Itzhak Perlman4:14

The way.

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And reasonably enough, for a child of three, you were given a toy violin, but that didn't please you. Yes, it didn't. It's the odd story. No, it didn't please me because um well, I'll tell you, under normal circumstances

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To make a sound on any violin is I I find the most incredibly difficult thing because there's so many things involved. You have to use your right hand properly, your left hand properly, and if you don't use one thing the other because in other words there is no mechanical any mechanical help that you get. You just have four strings and they are reasonably in tune if you know how to tune and and you just you're on your own.

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And that's very difficult. So for a for a young child, I suppose it's very frustrating, especially when you hear hyphets on the radio and you said, My goodness, it's so easy, you know, I can do the same thing. Boom, no, you can't.

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How long did it take you to to get a tier one? No, I'm kidding. But you took to it pretty smartly. No, I I took to it fairly fast, yeah.

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Now you had this great misfortune to be stricken by polio when you were, what, four? Four, yes. And that put you on crutches, so you play sitting down. Right. Apart from the violin, what were your other enthusiasms as a boy? To be interested in a violin is is enough, especially when you play two or three hours every day when you practice. I had a fairly normal childhood. I'm I'm very happy about that because I went you know, I went to school.

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And I had friends uh on the block and we played soccer. As a matter of fact, I was terrific because with my crutches, you see, I was always put at the goal because I could stop anything going by. So uh that was very, very good. They always used me for that. I was goalie. But um, you know, I I I enjoyed my my childhood. How old were you when you went to the music academy? Well, I went to the music academy with three and a half. And after I was sick,

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Uh after I recovered uh reasonably I I went when I was five and that's when I started to play. And you were giving concerts and broadcasts by the time you were in your teens. I was ten I gave a couple of recitals on the radio in Israel.

Itzhak Perlman6:20

How

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And then you were discovered, if that's the word, by Ed Solomon. That's right.

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Well, um, he um

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I came to Israel to have a talent search and I was searched and proved to be fairly talented. So I was chosen to appear on on several of his shows in America. And actually that's the way that I arrived in the United States. I've studied the violin in Israel for about seven, eight years before that.

Itzhak Perlman6:36

Exactly.

Itzhak Perlman6:50

And that's it.

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And then I continued my studies there. So anyway, that took you on the Ed Sullivan show. I'm telling you, the the power of television is is quite unbelievable. I still have people today, which is what, thirteen how old am I? Thirty-two. So how many years is that since? And they still say I saw you then in nineteen fifty-eight. You were thirteen then. Yes, right. What did you play on that first build?

Itzhak Perlman6:59

Try again.

Itzhak Perlman7:01

Lots of exposure. Oh, lots of exposure.

Presenter7:23

Oh, God, I'll never forget it. I played uh The Fright of the Bumblebee. Yes. I played the last movement of the Mendelssohn Concerto, among other things. I did, I think, a Vienovsky Polonaise.

Itzhak Perlman7:30

Yeah.

Presenter7:38

Oh, they gave you a pretty good spread. No, they gave you about three minutes. So I did the the bumblebee in about a minute and a half and then I had a very, very uh cut up version of the Mendelssohn concerto. I they didn't even let me have time to fade out. I mean, I was just straight in there and I started, I think, in the last two pages of the last movement and I finished it. Let's have your second record. What's that?

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If I were on a desert island

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I would have to have some Heifitz with me, because uh I I think Heifetz is for me really the greatest violinist that ever was, that probably ever will be, as far as I'm concerned. This is uh not a particularly uh great piece of music, but it's a piece of music that has been the curse of violin students all over the world because they always try to play it as fast, and I just thought it would be fun to hear this. This is the first movement of uh a sweet by Sinding.

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Heifit's playing the first movement of the ascending suite, and you'll be surprised to hear that it's marked Presto.

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You stayed on after your what was to have been a a short trip to play on the Ed Sullivan trip. Well, no, actually I I intended to s to remain in the United States. This was just one way of getting to the United States, getting to NATO. Was it difficult to organize that?

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No, uh because uh of this uh Sullivan business it was it was a natural thing for me to come to New York and I auditioned.

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to went to the Juilliard School and um they gave you a scholarship and I remained there.

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Now when you were nineteen you won a a very important competition. Yes, eighteen, eighteen. Eighteen I'm sorry. Oh sh one year is very important. Uh yes, I won the Leventrit Award which is probably at that time was one of the most important contests in the United States. It brought you a money prize of a thousand dollars but in fact it cost you considerably more than that.

Presenter10:34

Well, it didn't really cost me, but it it uh it was quite uh exciting. My violin I played on at Del Jesu. And after while I was waiting for the results of the contest, uh it was stolen from the green room, the backstage of Carnegie Hall. However, very conveniently, some people thought, it was recovered the next day in a pawn shop. Good. Well, I hope you're as lucky with the suitcase you lost last week. I certainly hope so too. Well, nevertheless, the the leaven trip

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Enough to

Itzhak Perlman10:55

I hope you're

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Does open doors. You were booked to play in all the the big cities. Yeah, well that was the important part of this contest.

Itzhak Perlman11:05

Yeah.

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expose me to an audience and with very good orchestras, uh with the Philharmonic, New York Philharmonic and Detroit and Cleveland and so on. So that was really what I wanted from this.

Itzhak Perlman11:16

Yeah.

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Yes. When did you make your New York debut? Was that at the beginning of the trip or at the end?

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Well, as a result of competition I I made uh New York debut uh the year after the year after I won it. That was in sixty five that uh

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This is a Beatle record. I love the Beatles and so I chose a record that I think overall is one of the best ones, and it's called Rubber Soul, and this song is called I'm Looking Through You from this record.

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I'm looking through you

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Where did you go?

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I thought I knew you

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What did I know?

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You don't look different, but you have changed.

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I'm looking through you

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You're not the same.

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The Beatles, I'm looking through you.

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When did you first come to Britain?

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I first came to Britain in nineteen sixty six, I believe. The year after your New York.

Itzhak Perlman12:26

Yeah.

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The year after your your New York City,

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And here you immediately made some good friends.

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Yes, I met some very nice friends. As a matter of fact, those were the days where.

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Uh we we used to be called the musical mafia. I don't know for what reason, and it's still sticking. Uh I became friendly with uh

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Daniel Barenboim and with Jacqueline Barenboim, Jacqueline Dupre.

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And with Ashkenazi and Zubin Mehta and all of these things, and uh it became and then uh our uh

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our film of the trout in which all of us played at Pinky Zuckerman, of course. Yes, that done for television. Yeah, done for television and that that branded us for life, I'm afraid. But you love to play chamber music.

Itzhak Perlman13:03

Yes. That done for television.

Speaker 313:09

Uh

Itzhak Perlman13:09

Yeah.

Speaker 313:09

Yeah.

Itzhak Perlman13:10

Sit down.

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Oh yes, it's it's it's uh great probably for me, uh after all is said and done, uh especially certain composers, when you speak about Brahms and and Beethoven, Mozart, some of the greatest music

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uh has been written in this form, changing music. Your three evening cycle of Beethoven sonatas for violin and piano with Ashkenazi has been an extraordinary success here in London. Well, we've really

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Enjoyed it. The music is wonderful and just to play with a friend is even more wonderful when you do music that you love with somebody j that you love. It's a double treat for you, for the artist. What about the contemporary repertoire? How important?

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Is that clear? I think it's most important. You shouldn't do it out of duty, I don't think. I think that you should do works that are very good, that are successful, that say something, that make a point. And as a matter of fact, I have a couple of concertos being written for me right now, and I'm just crossing my fingers that they're good. Oh, that's going to be exciting. By Americans, by British, by Australians.

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It's rained.

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Yeah.

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We'll look out for those. Record number four.

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Record number four.

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Is one of those

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pieces of music that I don't think that I could get tired of and that I think that every time I listen I could find more things in it. And so I would like to have uh a late Beethoven quartet. I've chosen the Cavatina from the Opus one thirty.

Presenter14:40

And it's played by the Juilliard Quartet. And there is another reason for me because I know all of them very, very well. And Robert Mann, who's the first violinist, is a very, very dear friend of mine. So this would be also having a friend as well.

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The Cabattina from the late Beethoven Quartet opus one hundred and thirty, the Juilliard Quartet.

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A very important part in your career, of course, is is recording, and you you seem to pick up awards all over the place. You take a great interest in in the technicalities of recording, don't you? How do you find that out? I have my sources. Well, I'll tell you, it's very, very simple. What I like from a recording, and I think that everybody would like from a recording, and the goal of of any recording engineer and producer, I would think, is uh

Itzhak Perlman16:15

I have my soldiers.

Presenter16:30

To really reproduce a true sound, whether it's a singer, whether it's a violinist or a pianist. And really, that's basically what worries me before I start recording anything. And I'm very I'm very um would you say I'm very picky about that? And and some people think I'm I'm a bit too picky, but I don't think so because I think that this record, if it's a good one, would would stay around forever. And and I uh

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And I think that it should be a representation not only of

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My playing, but also what my sound is like. Now, you've married a musician. How many how many children do you have? We have three children. We have a boy and two girls.

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How much time can you spend at home?

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I try very, very hard to spend as much time as I can and uh as a result I travel harder than other people. By by that I mean that if I can have a commute,

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Uh, if I can if for example, New York to Philadelphia and I have three concerts in Philadelphia, I would come after every concert I would drive back to New York so that I can be with my wife, my my children.

Itzhak Perlman17:31

New York.

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Your next record.

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What's that is inner beauty, outer beauty, just beauty all over and um.

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I think one of uh one of the great Mozart operas, Magic Flute, and I would like uh to hear the picture area with Wunderlich singing.

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These kids birth of untrained

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I know the ye get

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Yes, please.

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Fine.

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Her sweet Lord.

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That's me.

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The picture aria from the first act of The Magic Lute, sung by Fritz von der Lich.

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Where do you draw the line? How many concerts do you do in a year?

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Well, one year I did a hundred and thirty-five concert and I was too tired to draw the line even. So what happened was that I just decided to to uh to stop. So it's now I think it's now back to about a hundred, which is also pretty pretty bad schedule. But uh I tried to squeeze them sort of all together in one period so that I could have a lot of free time. For example, in the summer I don't play at all. And I spend all my time with my children, with my family, my wife. Recently you've been giving exceptional value for money by giving three concertos in a single programme. This must be something of a physical feat as well. Well I tell you, it's a question of a familiarity with what you can do in a but the first time that I've ever done it, I did, I think, two concertos and I thought that I was gonna collapse. And then the second time I did it and it was it was a cinch because I knew what was coming. I knew what kind of a feeling, w how tired I was going to be. And when I did three concertos, it for me was like a recital with orchestra, in other words, because in recital you play all evening as well. And so it's a question of reserving yourself, saving yourself for whenever is necessary and knowing what to do. But I think that I actually enjoyed it very, very much. You have an amazing air of relaxation when you play.

Presenter20:26

Well, if you're not relaxed, I I don't get nervous. I I'm very familiar with what I do and I know what I'm going to do and I know more or less what it's going to sound like, or at least I I hope I do. And uh so I try to uh you know, I just try to relax and and do my thing. Tell me about your violins. How many do you have? I have I have one violin, that's all I've got. Really? Yeah, I uh I have another one that I used to use uh when I was a student, but I don't use it. You only travel one. I only travel with one violin. It's a strand.

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Three

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What is it?

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And it's uh seventeen fourteen, which is uh I think supposed to be golden period, and it's very nice, I love it. Let's have another record. This is uh this is some Bach and uh I just thought that I would choose a cantata. This is called Ihab Genuk, and um that is with the München Bach Orchestra with Karl Richter and this is again with uh Dietrich Fischer Discar.

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Peace for the girl.

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It's a burger.

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Father in highland last love for ever on earth of light earth ye

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Art must be.

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The opening of the Bach Kantate is Habge Neug, conducted by Karl Richter.

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Now as you're

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Partially disabled, itzack. I think it only fair that we let you have a companion on the island. Who'd you choose?

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Oh god.

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I don't need a companion on the island. But if you want me to choose a companion on the island, I'll choose a companion on the island.

Itzhak Perlman22:56

Yeah, but

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You you've really gotten yourself into something.

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If you choose a companion on the island, I've got my wife and children, and you're stuck with that.

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Take your wife, take Toby Lynn, another violinist, you can't. No, no, no, no, no, the kids, the kids, what do you mean? I can't just take my wife?

Itzhak Perlman23:09

Alright.

Itzhak Perlman23:13

Not any road.

Presenter23:17

I take the kids. I take my wife and the kids. And they can have eight raised. As a matter of fact, they can stay on the island. I'm leaving.

Itzhak Perlman23:21

As a matter of fact, they can

Presenter23:23

Ha ha ha.

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Yeah.

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Would you be good at managing? You are a fisherman, aren't you? Yes, I'd be good at managing. I I I I would look, I'll tell you what, I mean, I would never starve because I could fish and I love raw fish. So I don't even have to cook. There's a book here, there's The Israeli Family Pearlman on the Island. That's right.

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Right, record number seven. This record just

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slays me every time I hear it. And uh and I just I don't think that uh I could choose any group of records without without including this. This is a a Brahms song for viola and alto.

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And forget it, I can't even pronounce this.

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It's one of two songs of Brahms for Viola and Alto with uh Marian Andersen and William Primrose and uh I think it's Frantz Rupp at the piano. And I just I just go crazy when I listen to it, so I have to have

Presenter25:27

Marianne Anderson with William Primrose, the Brahms song Geistliches Veganlied.

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Now, what have you saved till the end? What's your last one?

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Well, my last one

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Is

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something very special and uh again it's special not only because of the contents of the record but because of the people who are are on the record and that is Jacqueline Dupre and Daniel Barnboim both wonderful friends and uh both with whom I've played and performed a lot of chairman music I've done chairman music with Daniel and with Jackie

Presenter26:05

This is the Al Garcello concerto.

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The Elgard Cello Concerto, the opening, Jacqueline Dupuis with the Philadelphia Orchestra, conducted by Daniel Barenboim. If you could take just one disc out of the eight you've played us, which would you hang on to?

Presenter27:05

I suppose I will take

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I will take the Bach. The Bach. I think so, yes. It's uh I could live with that.

Itzhak Perlman27:09

And right.

Presenter27:12

And one luxury to take with you.

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I'll take my fiddle. Your fiddle? Yes, I'll take my fiddle. But the thing is that it has to come with a with a little shade.

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Oh, there are trees on the island, yes.

Speaker 327:23

Oh there are

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Palm trees, we assume.

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Yes. And we even have a shade.

Itzhak Perlman27:29

Have it.

Presenter27:29

You can have a sunshade, especially for your fiddle.

Presenter27:32

I could have that. It would protect it from the rain and everything. Yes. And a hill case with it. Yes, a a waterproof case. Everything. And strings. And one book apart from the Bible and Shakespeare, which are already on the island. And we don't allow big encyclopedias.

Itzhak Perlman27:33

It was protected.

Itzhak Perlman27:35

Yeah.

Itzhak Perlman27:37

Yeah.

Itzhak Perlman27:39

Yeah, strings.

Presenter27:51

They're on there in another world. They are already. Uh is a bookshelf and everything? Small bookshelf. Small bookshelf.

Itzhak Perlman27:52

They're on there in another way.

Itzhak Perlman27:54

They are all ready.

Presenter28:01

Um well, I I I've it was so funny. The first two books that I thought of was uh uh Brothers Karamazov or Sherlock Holmes.

Presenter28:11

I'll tell you what we'll do. We'll bind them both together. What about that? I got it. All right. And thank you, Itzhak Pellman, for letting us hear your Desert Island discs. Thank you very, very much. Goodbye, everyone.

Itzhak Perlman28:13

Locate.

Itzhak Perlman28:33

You've been listening to a podcast from the Desert Island Discs archive. For more podcasts, please visit bbc.co.uk slash radio four.