Edmund Rubbra

Speaker 10:00

Hello, I'm Kirsty Young and this is a download from the Desert Island Discs archive. This edition may be slightly different from what was actually broadcast, but it's the only version we have. It comes from the British Library's radio collection. It was archived without the music, so although the Castaways choices are introduced, they're not part of this recording. Full details can be found on the Castaways page on the Desert Island Discs website.

Speaker 10:26

The programme was originally broadcast in nineteen eighty one.

Speaker 10:30

And the presenter was Roy Plumley.

Presenter0:33

Our castaway this week is one of our major and most fertile composers, Edmund Rubber. Now, Dr. Rubbre, we are celebrating your 80th birthday today. Happy birthday to you. Thank you very much. And this seems a good time to look back at your long career, and it has been a long career, hasn't it? Yes.

Edmund Rubbra0:51

Yeah, isn't it?

Presenter0:53

Possibly a little unfeeling to have you spend your eightieth birthday on a desert island, but you will have eight discs to make things a little better. Do you play records a lot? Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra1:03

I used to, but not so much now. Somehow I uh

Edmund Rubbra1:08

Don't like to be influenced by other people's music now. I didn't mind at one time, but nowadays I don't listen to them so much.

Presenter1:19

Well, you have your little pile of records there.

Edmund Rubbra1:22

What's the first one you've chosen? The first one I've chosen is by Monteverdi, a composer whom I didn't know of, and I think the majority of people didn't know of until the late 1930s, when Orfeo was published, his opera Orfeo was published in piano and vocal form.

Edmund Rubbra1:44

This I liked very much, and was very excited about it, and when The Madrigals appeared some few years later by a group of singers conducted by Nadia Boulanger, I was captivated by the sound of them, and I've never forgotten the first impression I had of them.

Edmund Rubbra2:06

And that's why I would like one of these magicals now. Which one should we have?

Edmund Rubbra2:12

The Lamento della Nympha, the lament of the nymph.

Presenter2:22

A Monteverde madrigal directed and conducted by Nadia Boulanger.

Presenter2:27

The lament of a nymph.

Presenter2:29

Now, Doctor Rubber, you were born in Northampton. Were you born into a music-loving family?

Edmund Rubbra2:35

Yes. My mother was an amateur singer, soprano singer, with very good voice, and if she had had the means to do so, would, I think, have developed into a very good singer. And my father was uh an opera lover primarily. He was a clockmaker, I believe. Well, he was apprenticed to a clockmaker and a jeweller.

Edmund Rubbra3:01

But there wasn't much work about at that time, so in my childhood he worked at a

Edmund Rubbra3:10

Last factory, last being Boots and Shoes, which was near to us.

Edmund Rubbra3:16

Did your mother give you your first

Presenter3:17

Music lessons? Yes.

Edmund Rubbra3:19

Uh

Presenter3:19

Uh

Edmund Rubbra3:19

The

Presenter3:19

BAP

Edmund Rubbra3:20

Age of about About eight, I think. Uh

Presenter3:22

Uh

Presenter3:22

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra3:22

You composed a school hymn, I believe, at the age of twelve? I was asked to write a hymn for the school.

Edmund Rubbra3:30

But I don't remember a note of it.

Edmund Rubbra3:33

but I was now as very excited to be asked to do so.

Edmund Rubbra3:37

But what became of it, I don't know. You never heard it sung? Never.

Presenter3:41

Oh shit.

Edmund Rubbra3:42

Oh shit.

Presenter3:44

Was it in those early school days that you decided that you wanted music somewhere or other to be your career?

Presenter3:52

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra3:52

You see, my mother and father.

Edmund Rubbra3:55

were very helpful, although they're so poor.

Edmund Rubbra3:59

They wanted to help me to do whatever I wanted to do.

Edmund Rubbra4:03

But my mother's ambition, oddly enough, was for me to be a clerk. And I did become a clerk at the age of fourteen, of course.

Edmund Rubbra4:13

The London and North Western Railway Company Permanent Way Department. What were your duties? My duties were a correspondence clerk.

Edmund Rubbra4:23

because I breached the standard of seven, which was the highest in the school at that time, at the age of twelve.

Edmund Rubbra4:32

and they didn't know what to do with me for two years, until I left at the age of fourteen.

Edmund Rubbra4:38

So they suggested I took a Pittman course of shorthand and typewriting, which I did.

Edmund Rubbra4:46

and it was very satisfactory at that time, and I got disposed because of that. I did music in the spare time, of course. You used to get up early in the morning to do your music, I believe. I had to, you see, because I had to be at work at eight o'clock in the morning.

Presenter4:51

I

Edmund Rubbra5:02

and do a bit of music before even that.

Presenter5:06

Well, we'll carry on with the story in the moment. Let's have another record. What's your second one?

Edmund Rubbra5:11

My second record is a Vitalis forty part motet.

Edmund Rubbra5:18

Now I saw the score of this in a curious way. In in about nineteen thirty or thereabouts, I was reviewing for the Monthly Musical Record,

Edmund Rubbra5:31

Uh I loved writing, by the way. It was uh second nature to me in a way.

Edmund Rubbra5:37

And uh

Edmund Rubbra5:39

In my reviews came an enormous parcel one morning.

Edmund Rubbra5:45

containing the score of the forty part motette of a composer I didn't know anything about, Talis. I was so enthralled by it.

Edmund Rubbra5:54

But uh I would like you to hear it now.

Edmund Rubbra5:57

and get my first impressions if possible.

Presenter6:00

Just a short piece of it.

Presenter6:06

A short excerpt from Thomas Talis's Forty part Motet Spermin Alium, sung by the Cambridge University Musical Society Chorus Now He was slogging away in the permanent way department as a clerk

Presenter6:21

I think you were only seventeen when you became an impresario for the first time. Oh, yes.

Edmund Rubbra6:27

Oops.

Edmund Rubbra6:28

I was very fortunate I consider myself as very fortunate anyway in having an uncle in Northampton who kept a well stocked music shop. It was supposed to be one of the best in Northampton.

Speaker 16:33

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra6:41

I had a free run of it.

Edmund Rubbra6:44

And there I found the music of Cyril's cart.

Edmund Rubbra6:47

and loved it from the moment I saw it.

Presenter6:52

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra6:57

and I spent every spare penny I could on buying copies of Sor Scott's work as they came out.

Edmund Rubbra7:05

songs and piano pieces. And I decided at the age of seventeen to organize a concert.

Edmund Rubbra7:13

In Northampton of his music. Who was to take part?

Edmund Rubbra7:17

There was a singer, there was a violinist, there was a cellist, and myself at the piano.

Presenter7:23

and I believe Cyril Scott heard about this enterprise.

Edmund Rubbra7:26

Much to my surprise, the minister of the local church to which I went, the Congregational Church,

Edmund Rubbra7:35

sent it without my knowledge, sent the programme to Cyril Scott, and he was so intrigued by it at a young man of seventeen daring to do a thing in a provincial town like Northampton, that he wrote back and said, I'll take him for lesson.

Edmund Rubbra7:54

It's quite expensive, of course, to travel from Northampton to London. But here's the point. I was on the railway. Therefore I had quarter fare tickets every fortnight. So I used to travel.

Edmund Rubbra8:08

Up to London every fortnight on a Saturday.

Presenter8:12

Was it Cyril Scott's idea that you should try to get a musical scholarship somewhere?

Edmund Rubbra8:17

Uh I don't think so uh originally, no. He wasn't a teacher in any real sense, but he took me on because he was so interested in me, you see, and it only dawned upon him gradually that possibly I ought to have fuller tuition.

Presenter8:35

So you took a scholarship to Reading University?

Edmund Rubbra8:38

Yeah.

Presenter8:39

Who taught you there? Was that where you met Holst for the first time?

Edmund Rubbra8:42

Host, yes. Host was a teacher who

Presenter8:42

Oh shit.

Edmund Rubbra8:46

travelled to Reading University College, as it was then.

Edmund Rubbra8:51

to teach one day a week.

Edmund Rubbra8:53

There was no room for him to teach in, actually, so he taught in the great hall, and we sat down to the pile of printed music and studied the counterpoint, because host wouldn't use text books.

Edmund Rubbra9:08

And I've never used them myself either, or tried not to.

Presenter9:12

I believe he conducted an

Edmund Rubbra9:13

Uh

Presenter9:13

Uh

Edmund Rubbra9:14

Early tone poem you've composed. Oh yes, there's a funny story attached to that.

Edmund Rubbra9:20

I uh

Edmund Rubbra9:22

As I wrote this for piano and orchestra while I was at Reading.

Edmund Rubbra9:28

In the first place, he wasn't quite satisfied with the beginning, and it shows something of Holt's nature that he couldn't think of anything at the time of the lesson to say about it. He couldn't

Edmund Rubbra9:41

find a solution of the problem.

Edmund Rubbra9:45

But I did receive a postcard from him from London about it. He'd been thinking about it all that time. And I accepted his solution of it. But the funny thing about it is that I innocently called it

Edmund Rubbra10:00

Nature's Calls without realizing the dual nature of the title.

Presenter10:10

Well then you moved on to the Royal College. Was that through Hullst's influence? Yes.

Edmund Rubbra10:14

Yes, Holst thought that I wasn't getting the tuition, the all-round tuition, that I needed.

Edmund Rubbra10:21

As a musician at Reading.

Edmund Rubbra10:23

So he suggested that after a year I should try for the open scholarship for composition at the Royal College of Music.

Edmund Rubbra10:33

So although I had three years actually at Reading to do, I only did one year before getting the scholarship at uh the Royal College of Music. Did Holst teach there too? Yes, he taught there too, you see. I had the same teachers, and uh I was the private pupil of Evelyn Howard Jones for piano, and I kept that on. Uh

Presenter10:57

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra10:57

I believe you also Came into contact with Vaughan Williams. Yes, he took Host's place when he wasn't able to be there.

Edmund Rubbra11:05

I had several teachers like that, Eugene Goosens and Belfort Gardner all took host's place when host went I think when he went to America for some time.

Edmund Rubbra11:19

Let's have your third record. What's that to be?

Edmund Rubbra11:22

A third record is of the Forae Requiem.

Edmund Rubbra11:26

which I heard in the nineteen thirties.

Edmund Rubbra11:31

I was impressed by its utter simplicity.

Edmund Rubbra11:35

And

Edmund Rubbra11:36

It's directness of expression.

Edmund Rubbra11:39

The words of the Requiem usually suggest something very dramatic and rather fierce in a way in some parts of it but in the Foray Requiem this is not so. It's peaceful, serene, and sometimes critics have said it's over sweet.

Edmund Rubbra11:59

But I don't mind that, because all French music tends to be sweet.

Edmund Rubbra12:04

Even the most modern.

Presenter12:12

The opening of In Paradisum from the Fore Requiem

Presenter12:16

The Choir of King's College, Cambridge.

Presenter12:20

Now, doctor Rubber, you had left college, you had the problem of earning a living, and you weren't, alas, going to do that straightaway as a composer.

Edmund Rubbra12:27

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra12:27

No, I got into the bad books of Sir Hugh Allen for something I did at the end of my time. He was head of the college.

Edmund Rubbra12:37

And uh

Edmund Rubbra12:38

I think it was about Easter time. I had a telegram.

Edmund Rubbra12:43

From the Arts League of Service Travelling Theatre.

Edmund Rubbra12:48

asking me if I'd be a pianist for them for a tour they were doing in Yorkshire, because their own pianist was ill.

Edmund Rubbra12:56

It's a six week tour, and they had to know immediately. This telegram came when I was on holiday at Easter at home.

Edmund Rubbra13:05

So I said yes.

Edmund Rubbra13:08

because the money and the experience would have been intangible.

Presenter13:12

Damn.

Edmund Rubbra13:12

But I couldn't consult to Huan.

Presenter13:15

And it was a crime to do a paid job while he was still a student in those days.

Edmund Rubbra13:16

Or without asking permission.

Presenter13:21

Yes.

Edmund Rubbra13:21

But I did this and very glad I was to do it because it led to many other things too.

Presenter13:28

But when you left the college you did a lot of musical journalism and teaching.

Edmund Rubbra13:33

Yes.

Presenter13:34

Uh

Edmund Rubbra13:34

And played for ballet too, all sorts of things. I did it did everything possible to earn a living. You wrote some incidental music for the theatre. Yes, I did.

Edmund Rubbra13:46

For a anti-war play by

Edmund Rubbra13:49

Velona Pilcha.

Edmund Rubbra13:51

and the anti-war play was called The Searcher.

Edmund Rubbra13:55

with a with a motley collection of instruments.

Edmund Rubbra13:58

There was a piano, a double bass, a flute, a violin and timphany. But when they'd built the theatre, they'd forgotten, seemingly so, to provide a pit for the orchestra. There was no room for anybody except in a long line in the wings.

Edmund Rubbra14:20

So there was I, seated at the piano, one end, trying to conduct, and the instrumentalists spread out in one long line. And to cap all the first performance of the play,

Edmund Rubbra14:36

The lights all fused in the middle of the performance, so there was pandemonium.

Presenter14:44

Now you gave as much time to composition as you could. What was the first work which made an impact?

Edmund Rubbra14:50

Uh

Edmund Rubbra14:50

The first symphony, conducted by Sir Adrian Bold,

Edmund Rubbra14:55

It was in the B B C

Edmund Rubbra14:58

Contemporary music concerts.

Edmund Rubbra15:00

when my companion in it was uh Benjamin Brenton.

Edmund Rubbra15:04

So often he has been my companion in you in my new works.

Presenter15:08

Now by the time the war had broken out you had you had written more than one symphony.

Edmund Rubbra15:11

Fourth, yes. And the fourth symphony uh was still being scored when I was called up at the age of forty. So I took the piece with me.

Edmund Rubbra15:23

and scored it when I was in the army. In a hut? In a hut, yes, surrounded by noisy soldiers.

Edmund Rubbra15:31

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra15:32

Let's have your fourth record.

Edmund Rubbra15:35

My fourth record is of Stravinsky, because Stravinsky was a particularly

Edmund Rubbra15:41

Favoured composer of Holst.

Edmund Rubbra15:44

When I was at the college, Holst several times took me with him to the Diagilef Ballet.

Edmund Rubbra15:54

who were in Druidain at that time, and uh a lot of Sravinsky's about it were included.

Edmund Rubbra16:01

including the rite of spring.

Edmund Rubbra16:04

which I saw as a belly, and very fine it was too.

Edmund Rubbra16:09

So that uh I knew Stravinsky from that moment and Gordon Jacob, who was uh who was also at the college,

Edmund Rubbra16:17

and I was so thrilled by a piano

Edmund Rubbra16:22

duet version of Stravinsky's Rite of Spring that whenever we met we borrowed the score of it and were pounding away at it at the piano.

Presenter16:32

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra16:32

Uh

Edmund Rubbra16:33

much to the annoyance of various students, to whom the work was completely new at the time.

Presenter16:39

Now you've chosen a section from Stravinsky's Symphony of Psalms. Why?

Edmund Rubbra16:43

Yes, for two reasons really. It's directness of expression.

Edmund Rubbra16:49

It's a lack of over-sentimentality and romanticism, direct expression of the words. Also because the part I've chosen is the psalm beginning Praise Him with symbols.

Edmund Rubbra17:04

Well, usually that's uh given, if it's set at all, with music that's full and loud.

Edmund Rubbra17:12

But somehow

Edmund Rubbra17:14

Strovinsky invests it with a hush of awe, and that immediately attracted me. That's a wonderful part, I think, of it.

Presenter17:28

An excerpt from Stravinsky's Symphony of Psalms, The Choir of Christ Church Cathedral, Oxford.

Presenter17:35

No, Doctor Rubbra, the war interrupted everything for everybody, but there you were, Gunnar Rubra, sitting in a hut, scoring your Fourth Symphony.

Presenter17:47

It was eventually decided that you would be better employed doing your own job in the army, wasn't it?

Edmund Rubbra17:53

Yes, it was, but I I didn't expect that to happen. I was uh at a remote camp, a cadet training camp.

Edmund Rubbra18:04

on the coast of Wales at the time, doing an office job because they'd found out that I could do shorthand and typing.

Edmund Rubbra18:13

And one day I re I received a message to uh go and see a Colonel Temple at the War Office to discuss the matter, and I was uh to form a trio.

Edmund Rubbra18:27

to do nothing and nothing was uh underlined apart from chamber music of the classical type because so many soldiers were starved at that kind of music at the time. So I

Edmund Rubbra18:42

said, Of course, I would take it.

Edmund Rubbra18:45

My companions were William Pleith, the cellist, Joshua Glazier, the violinist, who was in an orchestra at the time, before the war.

Edmund Rubbra18:56

And, of course, we had to get a repertory together.

Edmund Rubbra19:00

We hadn't done this sort of thing before. W I I hadn't played chamber music, for instance, and I didn't know anything of the repertory.

Speaker 119:06

Uh

Edmund Rubbra19:08

So we had months of preparation.

Edmund Rubbra19:14

first in Salisbury Plain

Edmund Rubbra19:16

where we practice in an innocent hut.

Edmund Rubbra19:19

And then later one two places in London.

Edmund Rubbra19:23

After about six months we'd amassed sufficient.

Edmund Rubbra19:28

Repertory

Edmund Rubbra19:30

to go out on tour.

Edmund Rubbra19:32

And we started at chess.

Presenter19:33

Now chamber music concerts were a

Presenter19:37

shall we say, a minority interest in the army. Your your concert had to be sold to the troops, I presume.

Edmund Rubbra19:44

Well, it did, and there's a certain number were were very interested and knew about it.

Edmund Rubbra19:50

For instance, uh entertainment officers wanted, for their own sake, to get a good crowd to come, and believe it or not, one entertainment officer

Edmund Rubbra20:03

Advertisers and big posters

Edmund Rubbra20:06

As Ed Rubb and his seven-piece band.

Edmund Rubbra20:10

Because by then we'd expanded into seven people.

Presenter20:10

Because by

Presenter20:14

Paypal. Yeah, who's yeah.

Edmund Rubbra20:17

And when the army was... And of course, when the audience came in, it was a marvellous audience, of course.

Presenter20:18

Exactly.

Edmund Rubbra20:23

With this preparation and I

Edmund Rubbra20:26

It announced that I'd begin with a Haydn trio or something of that nature. I think it was a Haydn trio.

Edmund Rubbra20:34

Most of the audience stumped out.

Edmund Rubbra20:37

And that that residue who were interested in hearing

Edmund Rubbra20:43

Table music.

Edmund Rubbra20:45

So it defeated his own purpose, really. Well that's a lovely story. Well now Ed Rubb, what's your fifth record?

Edmund Rubbra20:54

It's of Gregorian chant, I've always been interested in this.

Edmund Rubbra20:59

I don't know why or how I uh first of all met it.

Edmund Rubbra21:04

But the simplicity of it always caught my musical imagination.

Edmund Rubbra21:10

and particularly when, as in this record, the Gregorian chant is coupled with bell sounds. Now bell sounds have been in my music and with me since my youth.

Edmund Rubbra21:24

I remember going for a walk with my father one hot summer evening.

Edmund Rubbra21:30

outside Northampton, and then resting and looking over a stile at Northampton in the hazy distance.

Edmund Rubbra21:37

and suddenly hearing distant bells.

Edmund Rubbra21:41

And I've never forgotten the impression they made on me.

Edmund Rubbra21:45

And so the combination of Gregorian chant and bells captivate me in this record.

Presenter21:57

A Gregorian chant, Te Dem by the Benedictine monks of the Abbey Saint-Maurice and Samur at Clerbeau in Luxembourg.

Presenter22:06

Now, Dr. Rubber, before we move on, I know you've got another celebrated war story of the Army Classical Music Unit. Would you let us have that?

Edmund Rubbra22:17

Well, it concerns the piano. You see, we used to travel round with our own grand piano, and then when we got to the camp, we used to unscrew the legs and unscrew the pedals, and we used to sit on the top of the piano in the lorry which conveyed us from camp to camp.

Edmund Rubbra22:39

We were told when we were, I think, at Chester, we were told that the next camp had a wonderful piano, a nine foot grand, and we needn't take ours. It was a pioneer camp some miles away, so we didn't

Edmund Rubbra22:53

There it was on the stage, wrapped up.

Edmund Rubbra22:56

you know, looking a a marvellous piano.

Edmund Rubbra23:00

So the keys were sent for,

Edmund Rubbra23:03

And it was due to be unlocked.

Edmund Rubbra23:05

And uh

Edmund Rubbra23:07

Then we sat down to rehearse. When we did so, I found that twenty keys wouldn't play at all At least twenty.

Edmund Rubbra23:17

So the sergeant in charge of the piano was sent for, and the officer said, Why is this in this condition?

Edmund Rubbra23:28

And his classic reply was, Well, sir,

Edmund Rubbra23:32

There were only six this morning.

Edmund Rubbra23:35

Yeah.

Presenter23:36

Okay.

Presenter23:38

Good.

Edmund Rubbra23:39

As if six were all right.

Presenter23:39

His six was all right. So the war was over. Had your music been kept alive, had it been played while you were in the army, or was it a case rather of out of sight, out of mind?

Edmund Rubbra23:54

Well, I think it was out of sight, out of mind. At least, if it was played, I knew nothing about it, because you were travelling so frequently, you see.

Presenter24:04

Well, with Peace you threw yourself back wholeheartedly into composition. When you weren't teaching at Oxford or at the Guildhall, did you resent having to teach as an interruption in your work, or was it

Presenter24:17

Always rewarding to be working with young musicians.

Edmund Rubbra24:19

I think teaching is a rewarding occupation, because one learns, particularly at a place like Oxford University, one learns so much from one's pupils.

Edmund Rubbra24:32

And the post at Oxford was entirely unexpected. One day I had a letter from Professor Westrup, who was in charge of the newly formed Faculty of Music, asking me

Speaker 124:47

Oops.

Edmund Rubbra24:48

Uh if I would become a lecturer in music at Oxford two days a week and uh do some teaching as well.

Edmund Rubbra24:57

But I was so nervous at the prospect of teaching in a university which I had no experience of,

Edmund Rubbra25:06

and no experience of lecturing,

Edmund Rubbra25:08

to students at such a place, that it was a month or two before I replied.

Edmund Rubbra25:15

Professor Westrup couldn't understand that, and he uh wrote again.

Edmund Rubbra25:22

So I had to make up my mind hurriedly.

Edmund Rubbra25:24

And uh very nervously I said yes.

Edmund Rubbra25:29

Uh but when I'd got into the swing of things, I thoroughly enjoyed it and was at Oxford University for twenty one years before I retired, yes.

Presenter25:40

In the main, you've remained unshaken by musical upheavals. Your your style has remained constant through the years. Yes. And your output has been impressive. How many opus numbers are to your credit now?

Edmund Rubbra25:47

Junior

Edmund Rubbra25:53

Well, towards a hundred and sixty.

Presenter25:56

All twice your age. A viola concerto, a piano concerto, a violin concerto, and symphony after symphony.

Edmund Rubbra26:03

Symphony after symphony. May I give you a good story about the Vietnam church?

Presenter26:08

Yes.

Edmund Rubbra26:08

In nineteen

Edmund Rubbra26:12

I think it was fifty nine, I was asked to go to America, to New Jersey anyway, to hear William Primrose, the famous viola player, do my concerto in four different towns in that state.

Edmund Rubbra26:28

and I was excited to go, because I'd never been to America, but it was only for six days. So if you imagine that what I saw was nil, and what I remembered was nil. Anyway, I went.

Edmund Rubbra26:43

and landed at New York

Edmund Rubbra26:46

At four AM Tired out.

Edmund Rubbra26:50

My hostess.

Edmund Rubbra26:51

Met May?

Edmund Rubbra26:53

And uh she said that whereas Panam

Edmund Rubbra26:57

was paying for the fare, she thinks I ought to be carrying a Pan Am case advertising them. And but I hadn't got one, so I hastily borrowed a bag from someone who lent it to me, to be photographed as I came out of the airplane holding this bag.

Edmund Rubbra27:17

and I hadn't noticed that out of the top of the bag

Edmund Rubbra27:21

were sticking some knitting needles.

Edmund Rubbra27:27

A reporter was there as well, me to say something.

Edmund Rubbra27:31

He said, I notice you've got knitting needles sticking out of your bag. Do you knit?

Edmund Rubbra27:37

I said, I only knit my music, I don't write it in the normal way, I knit it.

Speaker 127:37

I I

Edmund Rubbra27:44

And I don't know whether he took that seriously, but I've never heard the result.

Presenter27:49

Well, you you've knitted a lot of music in your time. Let's have your six.

Edmund Rubbra27:58

Record that

Edmund Rubbra27:59

The sixth one is of the bird five part mass.

Edmund Rubbra28:03

Bird was incidentally the teacher, apparently, of Talis.

Edmund Rubbra28:09

And I used to lecture in Oxford University on all the English well, a lot of the English school, and I went through the three Masses of Bird and was most impressed by this five-part Mass. So that is one of the records that I would choose.

Presenter28:33

The Curie from Birds, Mass for Five Voices, The Choir of King's College, Cambridge, conducted by David Wilcox.

Presenter28:42

Now, I believe you've now composed eleven symphonies, is is that right? Yes. And of course, your ninth had to be choral. Yes.

Edmund Rubbra28:47

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra28:50

Yes.

Presenter28:52

How do you work now this I'm sure must be a a a difficult question. Do you have a musical idea and develop it through to the end? Or do you sometimes have an idea for a finale or a scherzo and then you work either side of it?

Edmund Rubbra29:09

How does it usually happen? Sometimes the symphonies have started backwards, as it were, doing what I think is going to be the first movement, turning out to be what I feel after it's finished, to be the finale and nothing could follow it. That's happened twice. But usually I begin at the beginning and go on to the end.

Edmund Rubbra29:31

following the line of thought. Yes. Right through to the end.

Presenter29:35

Uh

Edmund Rubbra29:35

Uh You

Presenter29:35

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra29:36

Yeah.

Presenter29:36

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra29:36

Uh

Presenter29:36

Compose at the piano.

Edmund Rubbra29:36

Piano?

Edmund Rubbra29:37

I like to have a piano with me to test the sounds.

Edmund Rubbra29:42

Because I think if

Edmund Rubbra29:44

You don't. Music's not alive. Ernest Newman yu always used to say that uh reading a score is as good as hearing the music. Well, I don't believe that.

Edmund Rubbra29:56

Record number seven.

Presenter29:57

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra29:57

Record number seven is a complete change, it's called The Chieftains.

Edmund Rubbra30:05

I was told when I went to examine for the universities of Dublin and Cork one year, well I did it for three years.

Edmund Rubbra30:15

That there was a movement in Ireland that would show Irish music as not the sentimental.

Edmund Rubbra30:24

Victorian music that we'd got the impression of from arrangements like Herbert Hughes' arrangements.

Edmund Rubbra30:32

but it was much more akin to Bartock's roughness.

Edmund Rubbra30:37

But I had no examples of this because apparently research was going on about it.

Edmund Rubbra30:44

Until the Chieftains appeared on a record and I thought here they are, the real Irish people playing real Irish music in the real Irish way.

Edmund Rubbra30:56

and I was immediately attracted and held by it. I don't believe I shall ever feel differently about it.

Presenter31:09

The chieftains, give me your hand. You've always liked to be a countryman, haven't you? You've liked to live outside London.

Edmund Rubbra31:15

Always, yes, since my post-Royal College days when I was in London for a few years.

Presenter31:23

Well, that's a an advantage in this desert island case, because uh as a countryman you should be able to look after yourself rather better than a townsman.

Presenter31:32

You could build somewhere to live, I've no doubt.

Edmund Rubbra31:35

Well, I'm not very practical, if that's what you mean. You're not? Not good with your hands. Not particularly, although my father was, and my younger brother took after him, but not myself.

Presenter31:38

Your note?

Edmund Rubbra31:48

Unless it's come out in piano playing. I d I don't know. Would you try to escape?

Edmund Rubbra31:54

No, I d I might be tempted if I saw a passing vessel.

Edmund Rubbra31:59

and hail them and go back, but I'm not sure. Of course the island would be warm, wouldn't it?

Presenter32:05

Oh yes, warm, it's got everything you need.

Edmund Rubbra32:07

Everything you need

Presenter32:08

A climate.

Edmund Rubbra32:12

Right.

Edmund Rubbra32:14

Well, that's fine. I don't think I would try to escape.

Presenter32:18

What's the eighth record you'd have with you?

Edmund Rubbra32:20

Schubert's Great Symphony number nine in C major.

Edmund Rubbra32:26

which is sometimes called the seventh, by the way.

Edmund Rubbra32:29

and which wasn't played until I think about ten years after his death, so he never heard it. But for me

Speaker 132:36

Me.

Edmund Rubbra32:37

It contains not so much of the intellectuality of Beethoven's symphonies.

Edmund Rubbra32:43

But is far more

Edmund Rubbra32:46

Lyrical, spontaneous.

Edmund Rubbra32:50

And contains everything for me.

Presenter32:53

Who would you like to conduct?

Presenter32:55

Sorry remote.

Presenter33:01

The beginning of the second movement of Schubert's great C major symphony, Sir Adrian Bolt conducting the London Philharmonic Orchestra.

Presenter33:09

Now, if you could take only one disc out of the eight you've chosen, which one would you hang on to?

Edmund Rubbra33:15

I think, on the whole, the great C major symphony of Schubert, because it contained everything one would like.

Edmund Rubbra33:24

Uh

Presenter33:24

And You're allowed one luxury.

Presenter33:27

On the island, one object of no practical use.

Edmund Rubbra33:30

Well, I did at one time think of asking for a piano, but then of course the difficulty is that in a hot climate they tend to quickly get out of tune and uh I've no experience of tuning a piano, although I could uh at a pinch. So I think a composer's kit and all it entails would be useful.

Presenter33:54

Meaning a lot of manuscript paper and pencils. Yes, yes. Write. And one book apart from the Bible and Shakespeare, which are already on the island.

Edmund Rubbra33:57

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra33:58

Yeah.

Edmund Rubbra34:04

That is a very great problem because one wants a book that will continue to amuse or

Edmund Rubbra34:12

Whatever.

Edmund Rubbra34:14

And uh I've found that Winnie the Pooh and the house at Pooh Corner fills the bill.

Edmund Rubbra34:22

Always when I read it, I've been entertained vastly by it, and it never paused.

Presenter34:29

Right, we'll have those two bound together for you. And thank you, Edmund Rubber, for letting us hear your Desert Island Discs.

Edmund Rubbra34:37

Thank you, Roy. I've enjoyed it very much.

Presenter34:40

Goodbye, everyone.