Sir Alec Guinness

Sir Alec Guinness0:01

BBC Sounds, Music, Radio, Podcasts.

Sir Alec Guinness0:05

Hi, I'm Lauren Laverne. Welcome to this archive edition of Desert Island Discs. The programme was broadcast in december nineteen seventy seven. The castaway was the actor, Sir Alec Guinness, and the presenter was Roy Plumley, who was presenting his five hundredth edition of the programme.

Sir Alec Guinness0:20

What you're about to hear was recorded off air, so it isn't of broadcast quality, and the opening is inaudible. You can find the complete list of the tracks chosen on his Castaway page on the Desert Island Disc's website. The music has been shortened for rights reasons. We hope you enjoy listening.

Speaker 20:39

Desert Island Disc

Speaker 20:50

Each week, a well-known person is asked the question, if you were to be cast away alone on a desert island, which eight gramophone records would you choose to have with you?

Speaker 20:59

As usual, the castaway is introduced by Roy Plumley.

Presenter1:03

How do you do, ladies and gentlemen?

Presenter1:05

It was my 500th programme in the Theatre Desert Island Gift.

Presenter1:09

Well there are days when I think I could stand up to fight me with kids.

Presenter1:14

Mm-hmm.

Presenter1:15

Um and I think that's about all. I have a

Presenter1:18

Creepy thing about reptiles, very foolish, very silly, I'm sure fun snakes are charming, but uh I don't want them.

Presenter1:25

Have you studied music though, do you play in school? No, I used to um

Presenter1:29

I had to learn the piano when I was a small boy, but everyone begged me to give it up when I'd reached the age of ten, and I was quite willing to abandon the whole thing. You play the gramophone a lot. I play the gramophone pretty constantly, all the weekend, anyway. What is your plan of campaign for choosing these eight records that might have to last the rest of your life? Is it a nostalgic choice? I suppose so, in a way, but I um...

Sir Alec Guinness1:51

So in a way, but I

Presenter1:53

I didn't look at my grammar record. I thought the best thing to do would be to uh remember half a dozen records or so which I played constantly and I'm fond of and uh do those without and coming through others. What's the first one you joke?

Presenter2:09

I've chosen um

Presenter2:11

Some Gregorian chant, three Compton hymns sung by the monks of Saint-Pierre de Salaime.

Presenter2:20

in the centre of France. I'm very fond of Gregorian chant and about three or four years ago I had a chance of going to Salaim and hearing monks sing. There's also an off-branch in the Isle of Wight which sings with the same purity that they do.

Sir Alec Guinness2:27

Thank you.

Presenter2:37

And so my first choice is uh

Presenter2:39

These three hymns, which are evening hymns for all the

Presenter2:44

Setting sun and for protection during the night.

Presenter2:52

Lively I don't know.

Speaker 33:05

The mass of the landscape took place good ones.

Sir Alec Guinness3:05

The mess up every day to

Speaker 33:11

Three days were in the way of the sun was feeling

Sir Alec Guinness3:11

We're going to be

Sir Alec Guinness3:14

They not good sight was me.

Speaker 33:19

I am

Speaker 33:26

I am not a man of the world.

Sir Alec Guinness3:26

See what they say.

Sir Alec Guinness3:34

We got a grand bed.

Speaker 33:43

When somebody wants people

Sir Alec Guinness3:43

Yeah.

Presenter3:44

Somebody

Sir Alec Guinness3:45

That was a really good question.

Presenter3:51

three contain hymns sung by the monks of the Abbey of Saint Pierre de Solemn.

Presenter3:56

What's your second choice?

Presenter3:58

A piece by Foray

Presenter4:00

Sonata number two in G minor, the second movement.

Presenter4:04

I've uh chosen this.

Presenter4:07

Because I find him very civilized and gentle and soothing and cool, all of which I might uh

Presenter4:15

Find it necessary either to remind myself of the past or to uh

Presenter4:20

Quieten my spirit.

Presenter4:22

on my desert island.

Presenter5:26

The beginning of the second movement of Foray's Sonata No. 2 in G minor, played by Monique and Guy Fallo.

Presenter5:33

Some biographical questions, Sir Alec. You are a Londoner, aren't you? Yes, I was born within the sound of Bobel.

Sir Alec Guinness5:35

Yes, I

Sir Alec Guinness5:37

Yeah.

Presenter5:38

Was there any precedent for the theatre in your family? None at all. Did you see a lot of theatre as a child? Well, I think the first show I went to when I was about five was Chu Chin Chao.

Presenter5:47

And then I started going to the theatre from about nine or ten on.

Presenter5:51

And I fell in love with everything I saw when the curtain went up, you know.

Presenter5:55

Was the theatre your first job when you left school?

Presenter5:58

Uh no, I went into an advertising agency as a copywriter and layout man. What sort of products did you write about? Razor blades.

Presenter6:07

And um

Presenter6:09

Radio valves and lime juice, as far as I can remember. They stick in my mind mostly. Looking back, do you think you were good at it?

Speaker 36:13

Marking back.

Sir Alec Guinness6:14

Okay.

Presenter6:16

No, I know, I was very bad. And as a layout man, I very firmly remember the day when I ordered a

Presenter6:22

A four foot by four foot block instead of a four inch square one. They didn't sack me for that, but they might easily have done it. Why did you give it up?

Sir Alec Guinness6:28

Yeah.

Presenter6:32

Well, I got a scholarship to the

Speaker 36:32

Well, I've

Presenter6:33

Fay Compton Studio of Dramatic Art and I'd always wanted to be an actor so um I said goodbye to advertising and

Presenter6:40

What was your first professional appearance?

Presenter6:43

Um

Presenter6:44

Virtually a walk-on and understanding a line.

Presenter6:48

In a play called Libel at the King's Theatre, Hammersmith, which then transferred to the Playhouse, for which I was paid.

Presenter6:54

Twelve shillings a week.

Presenter6:56

And your next engagement? Then I went into a play by Noel Langley called Queer Cargo in which I understudied.

Presenter7:02

The six leading men.

Presenter7:05

And um

Presenter7:06

Walked on and had a line to say, as a Chinese coolie and an English sailor and a French pirate, and I think I picked up three pounds a week for that.

Presenter7:14

And after that?

Presenter7:15

Uh then I

Presenter7:16

Um

Presenter7:18

Got my first proper job with Gielgud playing Osrick in his Hamlet of the New Theatre.

Presenter7:23

And stayed with him for about four plays and then to the old Vic for a season and then back to Gielgood for another four plays. In fact, I.

Sir Alec Guinness7:29

It's intact.

Presenter7:30

Owed my proper start to Guildford entirely. I believe you played Hamlet at the Old Vic when you were only 24. Yes, in 1938, in Tyrone Guthrie's Modern Dress Production.

Presenter7:41

So you alternated between the Gielgood seasons and the Elvic until the war came along. Yes, with one or two other things thrown in. Yeah.

Presenter7:48

Well let's have record number three now.

Presenter7:51

I've chosen uh Schumann's piano concerto in A minor.

Presenter7:55

with La Patty.

Presenter7:57

I first heard this during the war in Algiers.

Presenter8:01

In fact, I think it was the only concert I was able to get to during the war. I served in the Navy.

Presenter8:06

Uh

Presenter8:08

And I went to the concert hall and they dubbed the French had doubly sold the seats. I mean they'd I had a ticket there, but they'd sold twice as many seats.

Presenter8:16

That fighting broke out.

Presenter8:19

In the middle of the concert. So it's always stayed in my mind very firmly.

Presenter9:26

The opening passage of Schumann's piano concerto in A minor, played by Dino Lepati, with the Philharmonia Orchestra conducted by Herbert von Caria.

Presenter9:35

We're picking up on your career, Sir Alec.

Presenter9:37

You spent the war years in the Royal Navy. In 1946, I remember you went back to the old Vic and you made your first film, Great Expectations. How was it you'd never worked in films before? Well, I'd never wanted to.

Presenter9:47

I was in love with the theatre and rather turned up my nose at films, I think.

Presenter9:52

And I'd also, some years before, done a couple of days as a crowd artist and

Presenter9:58

Hated that.

Presenter9:59

And I thought, well, I'll wait for the film to come along with a part which I know something about, and that happened to be Great Expectations. Yes. Th that film was more or less based on a stage adaptation you'd written yourself some years before, wasn't it? I wrote uh an adaptation of Great Expectations in which I appeared in which David Lean saw and he finally made the film.

Sir Alec Guinness10:11

I wrote a

Presenter10:18

It was the first of many memorable screen performances. We remember Fagin and Oliver Twist, the eight or was it ten parts in Kind Hearts and Coronets, the Lavender Hill Mob, The Bridge on the River Quiet.

Presenter10:30

Which of your films have satisfied you most? Which were the most rewarding?

Presenter10:34

Well, I don't think I get much satisfaction out of any of them. Once I've uh appeared in them, they're dead as far as I'm concerned. But I suppose The Bridge on the River Kwai was the most successful, in fact easily the most successful of the films I've appeared in. And

Presenter10:48

Therefore I have a regard for it.

Presenter10:50

Despite obvious financial blandishments, you've never allowed yourself to become a film actor. You've always insisted on time off for the theater.

Presenter10:57

But I think it's good for an actor to contact a live audience and also for him technically to fill his lungs with air and do some shouting now and then. We remember particularly since the war T. S. Eliot's The Cocktail Party.

Presenter11:10

And your own production of Hamlet, which was perhaps rather too unconventional for some of the critics. You're talking about my disastrous one in 1951. I'm not going to follow that.

Presenter11:19

follow that up. It was my own fault. Will you have another go at Hamlet? No, I'm too old. Oh, surely not. There are many precedents. Well, I know that some actors of seventy have creaked onto the stage and done it, but it's it's a young man's part and a young man's ambition and uh

Presenter11:33

I'm certainly retiring from the list on that. Are there any parts you particularly want to play for which the opportunity hasn't yet arisen? No. I wouldn't mind uh trying on the quiet to play Macbeth again, which I once played at Sheffield Repertory when I was about twenty five, and I'd quite like to play Ulysses in Troilus and Cressida, but I have no

Presenter11:53

Particular ambitions, really? Well, we wouldn't mind seeing let's have record number four.

Presenter11:58

This is a bit surprising, Buddy Rich drumming Barney's Bugle.

Presenter12:04

I first heard of this when lunching with David Niven in Hollywood.

Sir Alec Guinness12:07

Yeah.

Presenter12:08

And uh Fred Astaire was with us and he they got to talking about drummers.

Presenter12:13

And Frederistair said that in his opinion, this was the finest piece of drumming he knew.

Presenter13:22

Buddy Rich drumming Barney's bugle.

Presenter13:25

So Alec, when playing a classical part, Shakespeare, for instance, do you like to read back, to read what commentators and critics have written about the play and the way it's been performed in the past, or do you like to build up from scratch?

Presenter13:36

Well, I always have read. I think this is a a fault of

Presenter13:39

Most English actors, we read too much about the classics.

Presenter13:43

If ever I played them again, I think I would try and avoid it. Hm. What about an historical character like Lawrence, for example? Um did you build up your portrait from the literature about him and talks with his friends, or or build up your own conception from the text of the play?

Presenter13:57

Well, I'd read quite a bit about him before I read um mister Radigan's play, so I had a a conception of the man there. I would say that most of uh what I'm doing in Ross i is of

Presenter14:08

A result of talking to people who knew Lawrence well.

Presenter14:13

You've always managed to avoid typecasting.

Presenter14:17

Well, if you've got

Presenter14:19

Large ears when you're very young, and obviously going to go a bit bald. You're not the glamorous.

Presenter14:27

You know, juvenile lead, and you're forced into trying to find all sorts of other faces to put on yourself. As one of the critics pointed out, you have a liking for playing men of genius and obsession. You like to play the the lonely man, the odd man out.

Presenter14:41

And you don't often get the girl in the end.

Presenter14:44

Well, I've been married for 22 years. I've got one girl in the end.

Sir Alec Guinness14:47

Yeah.

Speaker 314:47

Yeah.

Presenter14:48

But again, you can't expect the public to expect kind of elephant ears to be the.

Presenter14:56

The sex symbol in pictures and plays. To what extent do you believe you have to enter into a character at performance in the theater? Do you believe, as some actors do, that all the emotion can be expended at rehearsal and the performance given on technique? Or must you feel with the character at every performance? Well, I wouldn't like to expend all emotion during rehearsals. I think that's the way most of us work, is to.

Presenter15:21

experiment emotionally and then try and

Presenter15:24

you know, tack it down for performance. But on the other hand, anything can spark off a piece of emotion in a performance. But playing eight times a week

Presenter15:34

A large role which the economics of the London theatre demand.

Presenter15:39

Means you can't.

Presenter15:41

Feel your way, I don't think.

Presenter15:43

Throughout a whole evening.

Presenter15:45

Um on the other hand, I do like to try and be in

Presenter15:49

The mood of the character as I see it. Yes. Have you any plans for the future when Ross eventually ends its run? None at all. No, I've I've got a film contract to finish off, which involves me doing one film, but I've got nothing planned. There are rumors about a film of Ross.

Presenter16:04

Well, I keep reading about them in the paper. No one's asked me. Maybe they're thinking of someone else.

Presenter16:09

Well let's have record number five, what next?

Presenter16:11

Um

Presenter16:13

Haydn Symphony number ninety four, The Surprise.

Presenter16:17

Well, I think on my desert island I'll need to uh keep my sanity and I find um Haydn very clear and soothing and uh sweet minded.

Presenter17:24

Closing passage of Haydn's Symphony No. 94, The Surprise.

Presenter17:28

The Berlin Philharmonic Orchestra conducted by Fritz Lehmann.

Presenter17:32

What's number six going to be?

Presenter17:34

Some guitar music to relax with.

Presenter17:37

A piece by Turega played by Almaida.

Speaker 317:47

Yeah.

Presenter18:38

Caprico Arabi by Terega, played by Lorinda Almeida.

Presenter18:44

So Alec, how do you feel about yourself as a castaway? Could you look after yourself?

Presenter18:49

Well, I've been a castaway. You have? Um.

Presenter18:51

More or less. I was wrecked during the war in a hurricane, 120 mile an hour wind and 40-foot waves. From what? And uh from my little ship I was captaining.

Presenter19:00

And I was blown from the island of Vice in Yugoslavia to the Italian coast. So, admittedly, I wasn't a complete castaway because.

Speaker 319:04

Yeah.

Presenter19:07

You know, I was able to wave to people on shore when I eventually

Presenter19:10

Crashed up against the rocks.

Presenter19:12

There was no question of taking grammar phone records.

Sir Alec Guinness19:12

Yeah. But

Presenter19:19

Um but I took an unexpected choice for me anyway.

Presenter19:23

What do you take? Well, I I had all the kind of classical books there. Um

Presenter19:28

I rather prided myself on my library I had on board.

Presenter19:31

But uh w knowing that I could only slip one book into a duffel coat pocket, I took a little cheap paperback thriller, which I was rubbish, absolutely.

Speaker 319:40

Awesome.

Presenter19:41

And delighted I was I took it, because it kind of absorbed me when I did get a chance to read more than anything else.

Presenter19:48

Could you build a shelter? I'm sure I could, yes. Can you fish? Uh that's my well, river fishing is my only sport. Mhm. Uh can you cook?

Presenter19:58

simple things. You know, I can scramble eggs and um make one or two.

Presenter20:03

Rather odd puddings. Have you any other hobbies apart from fishing that you could indulge on the island? Well, I collect tropical birds at the moment. I have been for about the last four years or so.

Presenter20:15

So I suppose I could do some tropical bird watching, I know I'd want to collect them there.

Presenter20:19

Well, you're going to be all right on this island. The 500th castaway badge to be awarded is a first-class one.

Presenter20:24

Let's have record number seven.

Presenter20:26

Um the Annus Day from Verde's Requiem Mass.

Presenter20:31

Uh I think I've chosen this because I find it very lovely.

Presenter20:35

And it's a constant reminder to me of

Presenter20:38

My religion.

Sir Alec Guinness20:48

Yeah.

Speaker 321:02

Yeah.

Speaker 321:04

Holy Spirit of Lord We

Speaker 321:22

Oh no.

Presenter21:40

The beginning of the Agnos Day from Verde's Requiem Mass, the recording conducted by Victor de Sabata.

Presenter21:47

Now we come to your last one, what's that going to be?

Presenter21:50

The Ray Conniff singers in The Talk of the Town.

Presenter21:54

Uh this is rather the equivalent of my paperback uh thriller.

Presenter21:58

in in choice, I suppose. But I think it would remind me of uh

Presenter22:03

Oh, all sorts of things. I like the skyscrapers of New York and uh.

Presenter22:09

A kind of life in the theatre which I've enjoyed.

Speaker 322:12

I can show my face, can't go anyway.

Speaker 322:19

People stop and stare, it's so hard to bear.

Speaker 322:27

Everybody knows you left me It's the talk of the town Every time we meet

Speaker 322:42

My heart is a beat.

Speaker 322:45

We don't stop to speak, though it's just a bleed.

Speaker 322:53

Everybody knows you let me it's the top of the town

Speaker 323:05

We said our invitation

Sir Alec Guinness23:06

Yeah.

Speaker 323:09

To break and relation, but not take on away.

Presenter23:16

The Raycon of Singers, it's the talk of the time.

Presenter23:20

Well, there are your eight records, so Alec, if you would only take one, which would it be?

Presenter23:24

Leverde Agnius Day.

Presenter23:26

And every castway is allowed one luxury.

Presenter23:29

I think I'd take a bottle of apricot brandy.

Presenter23:32

That's a very modest request. You shall have a case. Thank you.

Presenter23:36

In fact, you shall have two cases.

Presenter23:38

One book. Another paperback this time? No, I take Milton's Paradise Lost. I've always meant to learn it by heart.

Presenter23:46

And never really got beyond about 100 lines. I have the opportunity. Right.

Presenter23:52

Well, thank you, Sir Alec Guinness, for letting us hear your choice of Desert Island discs and for being my 500 castaway.

Presenter23:59

I also want to thank our producer, Monica Chapman, who's worked with me on nearly 400 of the programs.

Presenter24:04

And I want to thank you, ladies and gentlemen, for listening.

Presenter24:07

Well, next week we start the next 500. Until then, goodbye everyone. Goodbye.