Dwayne Fields

Presenter0:00

Hello, I'm Lauren Laverne and this is the Desert Island Discs podcast from BBC Radio 4. Every week I ask my guests to choose the eight tracks, book and luxury, that they'd want to take with them if they were cast away to a desert island. For rights reasons, the music's shorter than on the original broadcast, but you can find a version with longer music tracks on BBC Sounds. Listeners will also get access to episodes 28 days earlier than everyone else. I hope you enjoy listening.

Presenter0:47

My castaway this week is the explorer and the UK's chief scout, Duane Fields. His expeditions have taken him from the deserts of Oman to the rainforests of Gabon via the Arctic. He's the first black Briton to reach the magnetic North Pole, has made T V programmes charting his adventures all over the world, and co-created the We Too Foundation to take young people from challenging backgrounds like his on life-changing adventures. He was born in Jamaica, where he spent his early years happily exploring the countryside under his granny's care.

Presenter1:21

But when he was six, he found himself uprooted and unhappily replanted in Hackney, wondering where the trees had gone. He found refuge at his local Cub Scout troop. As a teenager, growing up on a North London estate, he was exposed to gang violence. By his mid-twenties, he'd been robbed, stabbed, and shot at. The natural world became his escape route, and in 2010, he signed up for an Arctic adventure. It was a decision that changed his life. He says, I want to demonstrate that there are no limits to what you can achieve. That doesn't mean that climbing Everest or crossing Antarctic or on foot are the be-all and end-all. It's not about planting flags, but about planting seeds. Dwayne Fields, welcome to Desert Island Discs.

Dwayne Fields2:03

Thank you. What a speak up. Now to try and live up to all the things that you've just said about me.

Presenter2:06

Now it's

Presenter2:10

Well, it's literally just a list of things that you've done. So, I mean, I'm excited to get into it too. Let's start with that idea of not planting flags, but planting seeds. Tell me more about that.

Dwayne Fields2:19

Generally speaking, we see Adventure as this place where you challenge yourself to get to a point on a map.

Presenter2:24

Mm-hmm.

Dwayne Fields2:24

Or, in some cases, a place on a map that hasn't been drawn yet. I actually think adventure should be about inspiring people. So, you talk about a place you've been to, or a place you'd like to go to, in the hopes that you plant that seed of inquisitiveness, that seed of determination in young people in particular, but anyone who hears your story and gives them that idea, the notion that they can actually go on and do something. So, it starts to grow. It's a spark of an idea that you've given them, as opposed to planting a flag, they see you do it.

Dwayne Fields2:54

Planting a seed means they think they can do it.

Presenter2:56

So you know, on these expeditions, as we've heard all over the globe, what is it like going back to everyday, ordinary life?

Dwayne Fields3:05

Well, it's a mind switch, isn't it? When you're out there, you are in what feels like sometimes, and I don't like it to feel like that. What can feel like survival mode? You're worried about what the conditions external are like. You're worried about is your kit the right kit? Have you got the right foods? Are you moving in the right direction? How's the team doing? How are your energy levels? Is the terrain what you expected? If it's not what you expected, is it because you're going in the wrong direction, or is the information you had beforehand correct? So, there are lots of things going on, and you're on hyper-alert all the time.

Dwayne Fields3:39

When you come back to day-to-day life,

Dwayne Fields3:42

The worries are still there, but they're very different. It's right, are the kids going to be in school on time? Have they all woken up? Have they all brushed their teeth? What's for dinner tonight?

Presenter3:50

We've got f five kids, we should

Dwayne Fields3:51

Five little kids.

Presenter3:53

The admin must be extensive.

Dwayne Fields3:55

You can imagine it's non-stop, and they're all different ages, so their needs are all very different as well.

Presenter3:59

Yeah.

Speaker 34:00

Uh

Dwayne Fields4:01

But equally, when I come back to regular life, I'm just Dad.

Speaker 34:05

Mm-hmm.

Dwayne Fields4:05

I'm the taxi driver.

Speaker 34:05

Uh

Dwayne Fields4:08

I am the walking wallet. I am the one that ties shoelaces. So it's completely different worlds, but both as demanding as the other.

Presenter4:17

And is that good for you, do you think? It's like a a check on your ego or something. I don't know. I'm thinking, you know, when you've when you've dusted off your shoulders and said, Okay, you know, I'm the first black Briton to reach the magnetic North Pole and then you come home and it's like, Dad, stop doing that. Don't tell them

Dwayne Fields4:30

Absolutely. Kids are great because they don't let your ego grow. But equally, just touching on the North Pole thing, I never thought of the North Pole and thought to myself, oh, I'm the first black brute. It almost makes me cringe a little bit. And any time I try and tell my kids about something that I've done, it never impresses them.

Dwayne Fields4:52

I have no chance of there's no risk of me growing an ego, especially within the household.

Presenter4:59

Well, Dwayne, you've been working very hard to map out your disks. I know we've got eight to here, so I think we should get started. Tell us about your first.

Dwayne Fields5:06

My very first song is one that takes me back to a place in my life where I was a little kid in Jamaica and Bob Marley's and the Wailers, Three Little Birds, is the song that brings me back to that place. The wording reminds me so much of my great-grandmother and she was probably the most special person in my life. And what reminds me most of her in that song is, you know, baby don't worry, everything's going to be alright. I remember going back to my great-grandma crying from time to time because I'd fallen and scraped myself, been bitten by some animal I was trying to catch or, you know, just injured myself somehow. She would dust me off and say, I'll be fine. You dust me off and send me back out there. And I think as a young person, the best thing you can have in life is a safety net, a person who makes you feel safe, feel loved, feel supported, but they won't keep you from the risks in life. They'll expose you to risks in a safe way.

Speaker 36:09

I don't see

Speaker 36:13

There we go.

Speaker 36:15

Gonna be alright.

Speaker 36:19

Can you no more

Speaker 36:22

Honestly.

Speaker 36:26

Never lose

Speaker 36:28

Gonna be alright.

Speaker 36:32

Rise up this morning.

Presenter6:35

Bob Marley and the Whalers and Three Little Birds. Duane Fields, you were born in Linstead in Jamaica in nineteen eighty two. It's a rural part of the island. And as we've heard, your great grandmother Loretta, who you called Granny, brought you up. How did you come to be in her care?

Dwayne Fields6:50

The way it happened is, and I've been told this by my mum, she had a really difficult time when she found out she was pregnant with me. And my great grandma being the person who she was, she stepped in and said, hey, listen, have this child.

Dwayne Fields7:05

When the child is born, I'll take care of the child. And from that moment on, I was in my great-grandma's care.

Presenter7:12

And tell me about her. What kind of person was she?

Dwayne Fields7:14

My great-grandma was a beautiful, beautiful person. I remember running up to her and I have this image in my head. I'd run up and I'd hug her and I'd say, Granny, and I'd ask her a silly question. And she wasn't an educated woman. So when I'd say, you know, Granny, what's a star? She'd say, in a really strong Jamaican accent, I'm not going to try and do it now because I'd sound silly. She'd say, I don't know, you'll have to go and find out and tell me. And I think that was really empowering to me to go out there and seek out answers so I could come back and deliver them to my great-grandma, my granny.

Presenter7:47

Oh, so you you wanted to kind of explore the world together with her. Was she was she strict? Was she um thinking, you know, she's was she tough, tough and loving, like what kind of parenting style?

Dwayne Fields7:57

My great-grandma was the softest human being in existence. She, now, that said, she didn't spare the rod. She was a church-going woman. She didn't spare the rod when she needed to, but she was just so loving. She would give me a spanking and then hug me afterwards and say, Listen, I did tell you not to leave the house at that time, or I told you not to do this and you did it. Come here.

Dwayne Fields8:21

Don't let me have to do it again. And we'd hug and make up. And I remember the kind of person she was. Every morning, she would take her small bench when we lived down the lane off the main road, and she'd put it just outside the gate on the opposite side of the lane. And as people walked past, it could be the farmer, it could be the person who lived amongst the bushes at the end of the lane. And she would speak to every single one of them in the exact same way. She wouldn't treat you differently because of what you had or what you didn't have. And I think my ethos on life now is treat everyone fairly. And I think I get that from my great-grandma.

Presenter8:57

Well, thank goodness for your granny Loretta. So your mother, meanwhile, had come to London, but your father lived locally to you. Were you in contact with either of them?

Dwayne Fields9:07

My dad lived just up the road from me and every day he would ride his motorbike down the road to get to work and ride it back. And for a very long time I would run out to the front when I heard the motorbike coming, hoping

Presenter9:18

He would have known who you were, wouldn't he?

Dwayne Fields9:20

He knew exactly who I was. He knew that I was his son. He knew where to find me. Every single day he passed our house.

Presenter9:22

He knew it.

Speaker 39:25

Oh.

Dwayne Fields9:26

As soon as I heard the motorbike coming, I'd run out to the front thinking, gosh, my dad rides a motorbike. I hope today he'll wave at me, or I hope today he'll wink at me, or just give me a gesture to know, acknowledge me, to let me know that he knows I'm alive. And no, he never did. And I think my great-grandma watched me go out to the front gate every single day.

Presenter9:37

Technology

Dwayne Fields9:48

and watch this man ride past every single day. Sometimes he'd ride past with both hands on the on the handle bars. Other days he'd ride past, he's got his prize fighting cock in his hand because cock fighting was a thing back then.

Dwayne Fields10:02

And he would never acknowledge me. And on this particular day, she followed me out and she grabbed me and she had tears in her eyes when she was you know, she was shaking me, saying, Stop coming out here Can't you see the man doesn't like you and can't you see he's not paying attention? And I remember in that moment

Dwayne Fields10:17

All the pride that I naïvely had for my dad, because here's a popular man who rides a bike.

Speaker 110:23

And he looks good and he's cool and he's

Dwayne Fields10:24

And he looks good and he's cool and he's my dad.

Dwayne Fields10:27

That was the day all the shine disappeared from my dad for me. And it disappeared because he made my grandma cry, as far as I could tell. So I stopped going out to the front. So, in short, no, I didn't have any contact with my dad, and I had no contact with my mum. In fact, up until the time I came to the UK, I only remember seeing my mum maybe three times. I think conversations with my great-grandma, my great-aunt would be, oh, your mother's coming up, go and put on some, you know, nice clothes. I think also that I brought a little bit of shame because I was quite a feral kid.

Dwayne Fields11:02

I was completely happy, like most kids should be, running around with no shoes on and torn shirts and, you know, dirty shorts and

Speaker 111:06

And

Dwayne Fields11:10

You George of the Jungle. I was absolutely Mowgli or George of the Jungle. And that didn't...

Speaker 111:10

Yeah.

Presenter11:10

But

Speaker 111:11

Uh

Presenter11:11

It's a jungle.

Speaker 111:11

was absolutely Mowgli or

Speaker 311:13

Do you want to do it?

Speaker 111:14

The jungle.

Dwayne Fields11:17

seemed to chime with what my mum expected of her kids. And um we've never had a mother-son relationship. And in fact, I call her by her name. And I didn't recognize her as my mum until much later in life.

Speaker 111:19

Okay.

Presenter11:24

And in fact

Presenter11:31

I think we'd better go to the music, Dwayne. It's time for your second piece today. What's it going to be and why have you chosen it?

Dwayne Fields11:37

This song is one that almost brings a tear to my eye. It's a song by Luther Van Dross and it's called Dance with My Father.

Dwayne Fields11:48

It reminds me of the love I had for my father, which is something I still struggle with. Deep inside somewhere I I feel like I love him. I feel like I shouldn't, but the truth is I feel like I do.

Dwayne Fields12:01

It hits quite close to home, because I want.

Dwayne Fields12:04

I want my kids to feel about me the way Luther Van Dross talks about his father in this song.

Presenter12:10

It's emotional for you, I can see.

Dwayne Fields12:11

It is.

Presenter12:12

Uh

Dwayne Fields12:13

Uh

Presenter12:13

Let's hear it.

Dwayne Fields12:13

Uh

Speaker 312:14

Back when I was a child

Speaker 312:20

Before life removed all the innocence.

Speaker 312:26

My father would lift me high

Speaker 312:32

And dance with my mother and me And then spin me around till I fell asleep

Presenter12:43

Luther Van Dross and Dance with My Father. So, Duane Fields, you'd been very happy in Granny Loretta's care, but I know that when you were six, life changed. What happened?

Dwayne Fields12:54

When I was six, my grandma got a letter saying, Right, it's time for him to come and live in the UK now. We're ready for him to come and live in the UK. And I left everything that I'd known, all the things that I loved and felt confident doing, and a place where I felt like I belonged. And I came to the UK to live with my mum. And again, this is somebody who I hardly knew.

Dwayne Fields13:19

I am now living in this new world with this person.

Presenter13:22

And and what did you make of it? I mean, what do you remember about arriving in North London from rural Jamaica? It must have been such a culture shock, physical shock, everything.

Dwayne Fields13:31

I remember we arrived at a house and initially I think it was in archway and because I hadn't seen any trees or many trees, no hills, no fields, no forests, no woodlands, I thought, right, that must all be out back. And I remember running through this masonette, down four or five steps and I opened up the the curtains that that was to the window of the back door and I remember seeing a brick wall and thinking, oh my god, this is a completely different world. It just felt like my entire world had collapsed and everything that I'd known, everything that I'd become accustomed to, everything that I felt like I was the master of had been taken away and I was in this completely foreign place.

Presenter14:09

Doin, I think it's it's fair to say that your relationship with your mother didn't improve. Tell me about your experience in this new world that you were living in. Did you make friends easily?

Dwayne Fields14:21

Again, the things that I knew in Jamaica and experiences I had in Jamaica, many of them weren't transferable.

Dwayne Fields14:29

I'd never watched T V. We didn't have a T V, we had a small radio, and that was it.

Dwayne Fields14:36

When you meet kids at the age of seven or thereabouts, what they love to talk about are their favourite TV characters, their favourite cartoon characters, their favourite shows, their favourite action figures, their favourite toys. I had none of those things. I struggled to make friends. And in fact, for a long time, the only friend I had was the child that the teacher put me next to on that very first day. And I remember trying to make friends or recognizing the need to make friends.

Dwayne Fields15:06

and I went into the school gardens one day.

Dwayne Fields15:09

And I thought, right, my passion is the natural world. I love wildlife. I love animals. I'm going to teach them about insects. And I remember picking up a handful of wood lice and some centipedes and some other creatures, creepy crawlies, some worms and other things, anything I could find. And I ran over to a group of kids in a class who I really wanted to be friends with. And I opened my hands and I was going to tell them about the female wood lice who keeps her young on her stomach.

Dwayne Fields15:36

And every single one of them ran away screaming and pointing at me and saying, You're nasty. And I remember standing in the middle of that playground, and this was probably one of my lowest points at that age. And everyone ran away, and they were just calling me nasty and dirty, and uh, look at your hands, and uh, you like bugs. And in that moment, I decided.

Dwayne Fields15:56

Maybe, Duane, maybe don't be you. If if they're doing something, just fit in with what they're doing. And actually, that pattern of behaviour I carried on for quite a long time.

Presenter16:07

Well, I want to hear more about that, Dwayne, but I also want to make room for the music. It's time for your third piece. Tell us what we're going to hear next.

Dwayne Fields16:14

In 1998, my great-grandmother passed.

Dwayne Fields16:19

And a while later I heard this song from D M X, and it's about his grandmother, someone who meant a lot to him, and it sounds like she meant exactly to him what my great grandmother meant to me. And it's a song called I Miss You and it's with D M X and Faith Evans.

Presenter16:38

How did you cope with the grief when when your granny died? I mean, it must have been so difficult for you and and obviously you were in a an unhappy home, you know, an unhappy situation here.

Dwayne Fields16:49

I remember I didn't cry because my great grandma and I we spoke about death just like we're ch speaking about Tuesday. You know, it was just a thing that she was happy for us to talk about and loss was something she was happy for us to talk about. So in many ways I feel like she was preparing me.

Speaker 317:04

Yeah.

Dwayne Fields17:05

I've never cried about it, I've always felt sad about it, but I do try and focus on what she did for me and with me and how she has prepared me. It's a sad song nonetheless, and I miss her dearly.

Speaker 317:19

Grandma, I really miss you, but it ain't been the same. I drop a tear when I hear your name. Mariella Holloway, why you gotta be so far away? Used to say, don't worry, it's gon' be okay. But it ain't, it's like when you left, you took the Lord with you. Why couldn't I come when he came to get you? Damn, I really miss you. I had to say it again. I remember the time when I was like ten. Crept up in the neighbor's y'all. Yeah, being hard-headed. You told me I would get it. You said it. And boy, did I get it? But after you spanked me, you hugged me. Kissed me on my forehead.

Presenter17:49

I miss you, D Mx and Faith Evans.

Presenter17:53

So Duane, we were talking before about you starting to learn to fit in. And you'd enjoyed school in Jamaica, I think. How did you get on when you came here? Because I I know that you're you know you're dyslexic now. Did anybody spot that then?

Dwayne Fields18:08

I love school as a kid. When you're a child in Jamaica in school, it's lots of repetition. It's not so much a focus on you working alone. When I came to school here in the UK, I remember sitting in English, and this is something that I've learnt that lots of people feel and maybe suffer from.

Dwayne Fields18:25

When it was time to read, I would count how many people would be coming before me so I'd know what sentence I would have to read, and I would recite the sentence in my head multiple times.

Dwayne Fields18:35

To the point where, when it got to me, I could just look at the teacher and say the words. And I recognize now that it was because of fear.

Presenter18:43

Mm-hmm.

Dwayne Fields18:44

And it was fear that would

Presenter18:44

Well that's a cooking strategy. That's very clever.

Dwayne Fields18:45

It is

Dwayne Fields18:47

Coping strategy. Oh God. I mean, it really was a coping strategy. To compound that.

Dwayne Fields18:53

I had an incident when I was really young, and it was again when I first came to the UK. My mum saw me read in, and there was a concept in the book. It was a book about a superhero. And if you imagine, again, I'm a child from rural Jamaica. The word super was never part of my vocabulary. I'd never heard the word before. But the word supper I had. I got to the word and I had a purr, supper. It didn't quite make sense to me, but I recognized it was making my mum angrier and angrier.

Speaker 319:21

Yeah.

Speaker 119:21

To me

Dwayne Fields19:25

And eventually she grabbed the book and sent me upstairs and don't come back down until you know the word. And as a result of that, I stopped reading in front of her. I avoided, I enjoyed reading. We had some books in the house when I first came to, when we first came here. And I loved flicking through the books and I loved trying to figure out what was happening when I was looking at pictures of lions and tigers and animals and whether it was a water system, whatever it was, a science experiment. I loved trying to figure it out by reading. And I stopped doing all of that when, after that incident.

Presenter20:00

I do know that the Cub Scouts was a place where you felt comfortable, though. T tell me about finding your way there.

Dwayne Fields20:07

I love talking about scouts because I remember the first day and for me it was something that presented itself at the time that I needed it most.

Presenter20:17

So this is you and your bestmate Stavros?

Dwayne Fields20:19

Yes, Stavros. Who you have made friends with? So, Stavros is the boy who the teacher put me next to on day one.

Presenter20:19

Stampros.

Dwayne Fields20:25

And Stavros was late for Cubs one day. His mum was busy and we were playing, and she said, Oh my god, Duane, I'll take you home once I've dropped Stavros off. And we jump in the car, and Stavros gets dropped off, and he runs inside. And still playing, I chase him. And I remember chasing him to the door, and this man stood at the door, and he says, Ah, great, a new starter.

Speaker 120:32

Uh

Speaker 320:32

Yeah. Uh

Speaker 120:32

Bye.

Dwayne Fields20:46

And I freeze because I'm terrified. I've never met a man who looks like him before. He's tall. I'm still quite new to the country.

Dwayne Fields20:54

And I freeze and I look at Stavros' mum and she looks at me and looks at him and she says, No, no, no, no, no, we're just here to drop off Stavros. And he says, Nonsense, let him come inside and stay And they were building bridges across the two benches, those old PE style benches that you had in in the the hall in in school. And I remember we were challenging ourselves

Dwayne Fields21:14

To walk across planks of wood, and they'd showed us how to tie things. I thought I knew what I was doing, so I'd tie some because, again, in Jamaica, when I wanted a toy or a swing or whatever it was, I'd make it myself. So I felt at home and I felt like I had something to offer in this environment.

Presenter21:31

Well, we'll find out where that took you next, Dwayne. But first, I want to hear some more music. It's disc number four, please. What are we going to hear next?

Dwayne Fields21:35

Guess you can

Dwayne Fields21:38

So this song takes me back to those really early days in school when I first came to this country. And it's Kylie Minogue and it's The Locomotion.

Presenter21:48

So wha where are you when when we hear this song, where will it transport you to in your mind?

Dwayne Fields21:52

My teacher, Miss Dimitriu, is the greatest teacher in history. Miss Dimitriu made you feel confident within yourself, and she would put this on. I remember her throwing her arms up and dancing and saying, Everyone, right, let's dance, do your best movement, do your best motion. And this was the first time I'd experienced an interaction like that with a teacher. Again, in Jamaica, you sit on your bench or you sit at your desk and you recite or you're told what to do. You're never part of any activities or any actions or any engagement on that kind of what feels like it's supposed to be fun. And this was the first time for me learning was made fun.

Speaker 122:22

Never

Speaker 322:33

Everybody's doing a brand new dance now!

Speaker 322:40

I know you'll get to like it if you give it a chance now

Speaker 322:48

My little baby says nothing to it with me. It's easier than letting your ABC. So come on, come on, do the locomotion with me.

Presenter23:02

Kylie Minogue and the locomotion. Duane Fields, by the time you'd reached your teens, you were living in Hackney where you were surrounded by gang violence. You weren't in a gang yourself, but when you were 19, you were stabbed by a group of boys for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. It was a very serious attack. You were lucky to recover from that. And then a few years later, you found yourself in an even more frightening situation. And that was over a moped of yours that had been stolen.

Dwayne Fields23:30

Yeah, so um I built this moped, spent months in a cold, wet shed with my younger brother. We built this moped and it was stolen.

Dwayne Fields23:40

And we all know that when something's stolen in a particular area, we know where it's going to end up in all likelihood. And sure enough, I head down to this estate and.

Dwayne Fields23:49

There are these guys tearing this bike apart and I I felt something I don't think I'd ever felt before.

Dwayne Fields23:55

I felt this overwhelming sense of anger. And I felt that partly because of the bike, but I also felt that partly because they'd pushed my brother off or hit him off the bike when they stole it. And I did what I think is probably the worst decision when I said, right, I'm going to go down and get my bike back. And.

Dwayne Fields24:18

I walk in the middle and I grab this bike and there's eight or nine boys tearing it apart. And um the second mistake I made on that night was once everyone had said, Yeah, take take the bike, it's rubbish, we didn't want it anyway

Dwayne Fields24:31

I should have left, but I didn't. There was one guy, one guy holding a plastic panel that had no useful function to the bike, and I should have let it go. But I felt like there was some injustice in leaving any part of what I'd worked so hard on there. And I remember I snatched it out of his hand, and as I turned to walk away, he pushed me. And the third thing that I did, which was really silly, I pushed him back. And he walked away. And he came back and he had a loaded gun. And I pushed my brother to the side as this guy raised the gun up. And I put my hands up. And before I could say the words, you don't have to, I heard a click. And he's pointing this gun directly at me, at my torso.

Dwayne Fields25:18

He cocked it back and I heard I saw a round come out the side and he pulled the trigger again. And before he could do it, he was wrestling with the gun before he could do it a third time. Some of the boys kind of grabbed him and said, Oh, don't worry, it's not worth it and and they moved on. The gun misfired twice.

Speaker 125:32

Gone.

Dwayne Fields25:36

And I had so many people saying, Mate, what are you going to do? We know where you can find him, we know where he hangs out. And I remember thinking, I don't want to do anything to this guy. I genuinely am just happy to be here. I'm happy I didn't get shot. I'm not seeking retribution. My conscience wouldn't allow me to do that kind of harm to someone, even someone who.

Dwayne Fields25:59

had attempted it to me.

Presenter26:02

Dwayne, it's all so much to go through for such a young lad that you were then. What helped you psychologically? I know at this point, you know, this is when you kind of start to.

Presenter26:12

to f get back outdoors and and find yourself again.

Dwayne Fields26:16

What what helped me in that moment actually was I I thought to myself, right, you are losing who you are in all of what's happened and happening to you.

Dwayne Fields26:26

When were you the true version? When were you yourself? When were you bold enough? When did you have the courage to say to someone, hey, no, I'm not going left, I'm going right. And actually, the only time or the first time I recognized having that courage or developing those skills, that courage.

Dwayne Fields26:44

Was as a kid in Jamaica when I'd climb those trees, or I had courage when I would wade out into a pond that formed after heavy rain to look for what life lived underneath it. I had courage when I was inquisitive and I was exploring the world around me in Jamaica. And somewhere I lost that kid. I lost all of those learnings, those lessons. And I thought, right, how do I bring that kid who actually was the last time I really liked myself? How do I bring that kid back to the fore?

Dwayne Fields27:16

And, you know, some time passed and I remember driving through Epping Forest, myself and a couple of friends were were going to a party out in Essex somewhere. Uh

Presenter27:27

And oh yeah.

Dwayne Fields27:28

Oh yes. And um I remember driving through Epping Forest and I remember thinking, hold on, there are woodlands on both sides of the car. I've never been here before. What's going on? And I remember stopping the car and getting out of the car.

Dwayne Fields27:42

and walking for no more than about a minute into the woods, and I couldn't hear any cars, I couldn't hear any sounds, and it took me back to a place that was so familiar to me, it just reawokened something that had been quiet or silenced for so long. And in that moment I decided that's who I need to go back to being.

Presenter28:04

Well, Dwayne, I want to know what happens next as much as everybody else, but I also want to hear disc number five, so let's do that now. What's it going to be?

Dwayne Fields28:12

Disc number five for me is a song that is a constant reminder that we should always lead with kindness. And it's a song called Here I Come by Dennis Brown.

Speaker 328:24

Love and hate can never be faith alone

Speaker 328:32

Oh no.

Speaker 328:36

Here I come with love and high faith

Speaker 328:43

Surely goodness and mercy shall follow my all the days of my life.

Speaker 328:49

Yeah, be no mother, no mystery with no evil man

Presenter28:55

Dennis Brown and Here I Come.

Presenter28:59

Duane Fields, by 2005 you'd found a job as a cashier in a bank, but despite your best efforts to keep going, you ended up becoming homeless at the age of twenty two. What happened?

Dwayne Fields29:12

The relationship that I had with my mum was becoming strained and actually it had become unbearable, I think for both of us and I left her house and I became homeless in that moment. And I'd walk all day or what I'd do in in the afternoons is I would put my bag and my backpack behind the bins in the estate and I would sit around with the friends I had and pretend everything was normal.

Presenter29:40

So you didn't even tell them.

Dwayne Fields29:41

I did not tell my friends that I was homeless. One of the most embarrassing things that's ever happened to me.

Dwayne Fields29:50

And it's not something I talk about a lot, but it's something that happened. We were sitting on one of my friends' mini buses and someone said, something smells. And I knew it was me. And I remember walking off the bus. And as I stepped off the bus, one of the guys there walked past me and he took me into his house and he gave me a washcloth and some soap. And I basically washed my armpits in his sink. And that night I slept on a central line train. And in the morning, I think it was the driver that got on the train and said to me, are you okay? Did you sleep there? And, you know, if that's where you're sleeping, you're not okay.

Speaker 130:24

Yeah.

Dwayne Fields30:27

And I said, Well, you know

Dwayne Fields30:29

And he said, Do you see this ring? And he points to a ring. And I didn't even look at it. I just nodded, yeah, yeah. He said, It's a beautiful ring, isn't it? And I said, Yeah, wanting to keep agreeing with him so he wouldn't get aggressive, he wouldn't call the police or call security or whoever else. I said, Yeah, it's a nice ring. He said, Well, for it to be a beautiful ring, it had to be burnt and bent and battered into shape. Maybe that's what you're going through. You should call someone.

Speaker 130:37

Yeah.

Dwayne Fields30:53

And he let me off at the very first station. And I remember walking till I found a phone box and I used the absolute last few pennies in my pocket. I think it was about 30 pence or something to make a phone call. And I phoned my cousin and I said, I'm really embarrassed. I'm sorry. I need somewhere to stay. And she just said, Oh, you're an idiot. Why didn't you call me before?

Dwayne Fields31:14

And that was the beginning of my journey back to where I am now.

Presenter31:20

So you stayed with your cousin, she helped you get back to work and get that straightened out, and eventually I know that you got your own little place.

Speaker 331:28

Yeah.

Presenter31:29

That you could live in. But just a couple of years after that, your friend Etem was shot and killed just yards from where you'd had a gun pointed at you. What was the impact of his death on you?

Dwayne Fields31:40

This was a lovely guy.

Dwayne Fields31:43

He played football for Dagnum and Redbridge. He had recently gotten a job at the Leisure Center as a lifeguard. He was somebody that had ambition and had the drive and some commitment.

Dwayne Fields31:57

And he was the kind of person who

Dwayne Fields32:00

You wanted to be because you could tell he was going to be successful. He was going to be all right.

Dwayne Fields32:06

But some random boys drove a car up to where he and another friend were, and said, Are you from around here? And they ran and this person fired a number of shots and hit him in the back.

Dwayne Fields32:21

What that did to me was it sparked that same

Dwayne Fields32:27

desire to do something now because it was very close when it was me and my brother, again, someone who I care deeply about. And now it's a friend of mine. It doesn't need to happen. How can I impact that kind of behavior?

Presenter32:42

So what did you do?

Dwayne Fields32:43

I I didn't know what to do. I raised some money for some charities, and it felt good to raise money for these charities that were m predominantly aimed at preventing street violence, but it still didn't feel like I was doing anything. I saw Ben Fogel and James Cracknell speaking about the adventure of crossing the Atlantic in a rowing boat and

Presenter33:01

So this is on Breakfast T V one day.

Dwayne Fields33:03

This is on Breakfast T V. I'm I'm watching Breakfast T V and I remember thinking, Gosh, that's a great adventure and walking out of the room. And the next thing I heard was, What's next? And Ben Fogl and James Cracknell.

Dwayne Fields33:18

Well, we're planning to walk to the South Pole and we're looking for a third person to join the team.

Dwayne Fields33:23

And it sounded like they were saying, hey, Dwayne, this is your opportunity. And again, I was so afraid. My confidence was so low. I didn't believe I would get that place. But I sent the email off or I sent the message off maybe about a month or so later. And I got a letter back or a message back saying, unfortunately, selections have started. You can't go on this expedition now because it's too late.

Dwayne Fields33:47

Would you consider going to the North Pole?

Dwayne Fields33:51

I was like, what? Great, yes, I don't care where it is as far as I'm concerned. I was born in Jamaica.

Speaker 133:51

It was like what?

Dwayne Fields33:58

North Pole, South Pole, they're both just icy and cold. It gives me, whichever one I go to, will give me a platform that I can stand on and say, hey guys, if I can go and do this thing with the smallest amount of experience, surely you can do something more than commit street violence, or surely you can aim higher.

Presenter34:18

The beginnings of your life as an adventurer. We'll find out more about that after this next disc. What's number six, Dwyn?

Dwayne Fields34:24

Number six for me is a song by Louis Armstrong and Velma Middleton. This song's important to me because again it marks another turning point in my life. It's called You're the Apple of My Eye, and it reminds me of my wife, Angelique, and our relationship.

Speaker 334:40

You're the apple of my eye. You're luscious and you're sweet. You're the apple of my eye. You're sweet enough to eat. Now, since we met, I always get that certain feeling. And furthermore, I love you for you so appealing. You're the apple of my eye. Your kisses are delish. They're tastier than homemade apple pie.

Speaker 335:15

I'll hang around your orchid till I win your heart cause you're the only apple in my apple cart. I'm gonna shake your tree until you fall for me cause you're the apple of my eye. Now look here, Velma. You know you're the apple of my eye too, baby.

Presenter35:36

I look at the mm.

Presenter35:40

You're the apple of my eye. Louis Armstrong and Velma Middleton. For your other half, Angelique. So, Duane. I think you say yourself that the stereotype of a typical explorer is not someone with a story like yours that we've heard so far. So where did you look for role models when you were embarking on these adventures?

Dwayne Fields35:58

I went onto Google and I searched North Pole. And as you go down that rabbit hole, you learn things. That's.

Presenter36:06

That's where we're starting like day one.

Dwayne Fields36:08

That's where we're starting. It's day one and extensive research on Google. As I read through that, I came across a man or an expedition by Matthew Henson and Robert Perry. And I read that he and Robert had become the first people to make it to the magnetic North Pole. And this was way back in 1909. And it went on to say that Matthew Henson was the first black person to reach the pole.

Presenter36:10

Well and I'm not sure.

Speaker 336:11

Uh

Dwayne Fields36:35

So this is the first time I'm seeing a face that looks like mine associated with the conditions or the environment I'm about to go into.

Speaker 336:38

Mm.

Dwayne Fields36:44

And I took a lot of energy from that. I thought if he could do it then, I could do it now.

Presenter36:50

So you had fire in your belly. I did. But then you found out that you had to raise £22,000 to secure your place. Did that come as a shock?

Dwayne Fields36:58

Uh

Presenter36:58

Uh

Dwayne Fields36:58

It came as a huge shock because I didn't consider the cost of doing something like this. So I I went knocking on doors. I went business to business in in Dalston, for example, asking for money and telling people about this great thing that I wanted to do.

Dwayne Fields37:14

And lots of people said things like, mate, you're from Jamaica. Walk around Jamaica. You're going to lose bits and pieces. Yeah, that's not for us. Not for us, as in me as a black person.

Speaker 337:24

Mm-hmm.

Dwayne Fields37:25

But I think also they were talking about me as in the community we were from, whether that's black, brown, white, anything in between. I think there was definitely a sense that that's middle class or upper class people, that's people with spare money or spare time and resources. And I remember thinking, this planet should be open to anyone and everyone.

Speaker 137:37

As people

Dwayne Fields37:48

So when I came up against those people and they would never give you any money, they'd tell you why it's a bad idea, but they'd never give you any money, I thought, right, now I have to prove you wrong as well, so I'm even more determined to make this happen.

Presenter37:59

And what about the training? I mean, there's loads of physical training, isn't there?

Dwayne Fields38:03

I remember in preparation for the poll, I would play football during the week, I would play football at the weekends, I would box and I would run and I would pull tires and actually the most embarrassing thing that I've ever experienced happened to me while I was pulling tires in Hackney Marshes and coming down towards the canal and there's a footpath underneath one of the bridges and as I went through the footpath I remember hearing some voices. It was maybe nine or so boys.

Dwayne Fields38:32

and I tried to walk past, pulling this tire, um, or the the two tyres, tied to a rope, and I remember them laughing at me. I'm roughly six foot tall. I remember walking past them and shrinking down to

Dwayne Fields38:47

a foot tall, and they had the ability to influence my behavior to the point where I didn't walk or train in Hackney Marshes any more. I would go to Clissolde Park late at night when the park was closed and I would just do uh relays or shuttles on the grass in a closed park in a dead of night.

Presenter39:05

So that nobody saw you.

Dwayne Fields39:06

so that nobody saw me.

Presenter39:08

So after all of that, Duane, in April twenty ten, you set off with two companions to walk four hundred nautical miles to the magnetic North Pole. Can you put into words how you felt when you reached it?

Dwayne Fields39:23

In short, the words I'm going to use are

Dwayne Fields39:26

Anti-climax.

Dwayne Fields39:29

I arrived at the point on the map and the point on our GPS that we'd been aiming for, in essence for the past two plus years.

Dwayne Fields39:37

And what I realized in that moment when we'd arrived and we'd all looked around and taken our picture, I realized that that point on the map was never the goal. It wasn't about getting to that bit of snow. It was about being bold enough to set yourself a goal that appeared unachievable or

Dwayne Fields39:55

very difficult to achieve and then working hard, being bold enough and being confident enough and believing in your teammates and believing in the training enough to go and realize it. And I thought, actually, that's really powerful.

Presenter40:08

Mm-hmm.

Dwayne Fields40:09

You need to share that message with your peers.

Presenter40:12

Dwayne, it's time for your next piece of music. Disc number seven please, what are you taking to your island next?

Dwayne Fields40:18

The next song I'm going to take to my island is a song by Katy Perry and the reason I want to take this song is it reminds me of my son in particular. He has autism and I remember one day just sitting down, I think we were in the car, my Ange and me, and he was in the back and I heard him singing this song and I thought, wow, this song is about really believing yourself and being tough. And here's my son, who has been really quiet, really reserved, singing this really empowering song. And it's a moment I'll never forget and all my kids sing it at some point as well. This is Katy Perry Raw.

Speaker 340:54

I am the tiger of my

Speaker 341:09

And a lion, cause I am a champion.

Speaker 341:14

And you're gonna hear me remove

Presenter41:24

Katy Perry and Roe. Dwayne Fields, in twenty nineteen you made a film for the BBC's Country File programme on the back of a DEFA report that addressed the issue of inclusivity in the UK's national parks. We're several years on from that now. Do you think that the countryside is an accessible space for everyone today?

Dwayne Fields41:44

When you go out now, I think you see a lot more people from far more diverse backgrounds spending time out there. And I think it's important that it happens because

Dwayne Fields41:54

The more people we get invested in the countryside to value it, to love it, to see the benefits and feel the benefits.

Dwayne Fields42:02

The more people, the bigger the cohort of people who will work to protect it. I would love when I'm 60 or 70 or 80 years old, I would love to be able to just go for a walk because we still have some of our beautiful natural spaces maintained as beautiful as they are now, if not more so. And I think we do that as a team, as a collective.

Presenter42:23

We've talked a lot about your parents today, and I wonder, you know, to what extent you've been able to make peace with your relationships with them. I think I know that your your father died in in twenty twenty one, but that you did see him one last time.

Dwayne Fields42:37

In twenty sixteen, I was in Jamaica and I was out with my brother and a cousin and a few friends, and I saw that distinctive silhouette of my dad, this time not on a motorbike, but on a bicycle.

Dwayne Fields42:52

When we stopped the car, I remember I had some dark glasses on for a number of reasons. One, it was sunny, but two, I.

Dwayne Fields42:58

I didn't want emotions to get the better of me, and I didn't want him to see emotions getting the better of me. And I remember him saying.

Dwayne Fields43:06

I know you must be you know upset with me, but I've seen what you've been up to and he said he was proud of what he's seen.

Dwayne Fields43:14

And it built up this huge ball of emotions inside me. And actually, the moment he said that, I was really glad I kept my glasses on because my eyes started to fill up a little bit. And he said, I have nothing to offer you.

Speaker 143:23

Because

Dwayne Fields43:29

The most I can do is buy you a drink at the bar down the road. I said, You know what? I'd already left some money at the bar because that's where my cousin, myself, and my friends were. I said, I've left money at the bar. You can have a drink on me. And I got back in the car and we drove away and I felt like that was complete closure.

Presenter43:46

And what about your relationship with your mother? Have you been able to make come to terms with how things were between you?

Dwayne Fields43:53

I think it's important to wish people the best and never wish anyone ill. But I still feel a lot of hurt from my mum for a variety of reasons, and I think she feels a lot of hurt as well. And I think it's best that you appreciate people from a distance sometimes.

Presenter44:08

Dwayne, you have a family of your own now and you know they are keeping your hands very, very full. I know that you met your wife Angelique while you were studying psychology at university. You've got five children. I mean lots of people who've grown up in difficult circumstances and unhappy homes, they're scared about accidentally repeating the cycles or not being able to rise to the challenge of being a parent, not having a role model. How did you feel about it and obviously it's worked out, but how did you get there?

Dwayne Fields44:37

When I first found out I was going to be a dad, I was terrified. I honestly, I looked at the experience I had and I thought, right, I don't have any experience of a good father, but I have experience of a bad father. Right, let's flip that around. All those things are things I'm not going to do. I'm going to be there. Let's start with that. I'm going to hug this baby. I'm going to change the baby. I'll wake up in the middle of the night. I will do the nappies. I'll do it all.

Dwayne Fields45:03

But that none of that stopped me being terrified because the moment that baby is born, when it cries, you have now become responsible for another human life. And what you instill in that child is going to impact how that child grows up. And at that moment, I decided I would do anything I could

Dwayne Fields45:20

to encourage, inspire, uplift, empower and

Dwayne Fields45:24

Have this child grow up to be confident and capable in a way that I didn't have.

Presenter45:31

Well, look, I'm casting you away from the hustle and bustle of family life. Uh, obviously, I'm not too worried about you on the island. I think you're going to be fine. But tell me, what have your expeditions and adventures taught you about resilience and what you'll need to survive as a castaway?

Dwayne Fields45:44

I think the one thing my expeditions has taught me

Dwayne Fields45:47

Is you have everything you need built in you. Sometimes we just need to discover it or rediscover it. And I would use all the music that I've chosen to bring me back to my happy places, to bring me back to places where I've learned lessons. And I think when times get tough, as they would do on any desert island, I think the best thing you can do is reset, take a moment, take a breath, reset, re-evaluate, and the music gives you a break, it gives you a chance to do that.

Presenter46:17

Well, on that note, I think we'd better hear your final disc today, Dwayne. What's it gonna be?

Dwayne Fields46:22

My final disc is the amazing I'm Still Standing from Elton John and I chose this because we all feel like we're battered down sometimes and I think this song is one that reminds us that actually, just like I said a minute ago, we are tougher than we think, we have more to give than we think and often we are more capable than we think.

Speaker 346:41

You know, I'm still standing better than I ever did.

Speaker 346:46

You like a juice of all the

Speaker 346:49

Feeling like a little kid

Speaker 346:52

I'll still set it after all this time.

Speaker 346:57

Picking up the pieces of my life without you on my mind.

Speaker 347:02

I'll do that.

Speaker 347:08

I'm still there.

Presenter47:12

Elton John, and I'm still standing. So, Duane Fields, I'm going to send you away to the island now. I'm giving you the Bible, the complete works of Shakespeare, and you can take one other book of your choice. What would you like?

Dwayne Fields47:23

The Untold Railway Stories edited by Manisha Rajesh. I take that book because every story in there is a further escape. And I think if you're stuck on a desert island, I think one of the most beautiful things you can do for yourself is take your mind away. The book has so many different railway stories, and there's one that actually includes me, so it's quite selfish actually.

Presenter47:46

Where does your story take where are you on the railway home?

Dwayne Fields47:48

Oh, my story takes place on the Tazara Railway, and when you read through this book every story takes you to a different place, and I think that's what I'd love about reading that book on the island.

Presenter47:57

Well, I'll definitely give you that, but you can have that one, Dwayne. What about a luxury item to make life a bit more enjoyable, bearable on the island?

Dwayne Fields48:05

This one's quite an easy one. I would take some kind of multi tool, a Swiss army knife, because, hey, if you want to survive or thrive, you need to either make tools or have a tool on an expedition.

Presenter48:19

Well, it is a little bit practical. Am I not allowed a practical item? No, there's precedent. We've checked in the archives, we've been through the annals. Yo Yo Ma took one as a companion. He travels everywhere with his. And the nurse, Dame Claire Burchinger, took one as well.

Dwayne Fields48:21

Am I not allowed a practical item?

Dwayne Fields48:24

Oh gosh.

Presenter48:35

I will let you have it.

Dwayne Fields48:36

Thank you.

Presenter48:37

And finally, which one track of the eight that you've shared with us today would you rush to save from the waves first?

Dwayne Fields48:43

Oh my goodness. It has to be Three Little Birds. I think the sentiment behind the song takes me back to a place in my life that I really enjoyed and I think that made me who I am today. The ability to feel free, the messages from my great grandma, which still live on in what I do today, what I do with my own children, how I teach them, still live on through that song and I think that's the reason I choose that one.

Presenter49:08

Dwayne Fields, thank you so much for letting us hear your Desert Island discs.

Dwayne Fields49:12

Thank you. It's been an absolute pleasure.

Presenter49:37

Hello, I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Duane. We'll leave him to enjoy a personal reset on the island with the help of his eight discs. We've cast away lots of explorers, including Steve Baxhaw, Christina Dodwell, and Anne Daniels. Former Chief Scout Bear Grills is in our archive too. The studio manager for today's programme was Sarah Hockley. The assistant producer was Christine Pavlovsky. The executive production coordinator was Susie Roylance. The content editor was Mugabe Turia, and the producer was Paula McGinley. Next time, my guest will be the Oscar-nominated Jesse Buckley. I do hope you'll join us.

Speaker 150:31

If journalism is the first draft of history, what happens if that draft turns out to be flawed?

Speaker 150:38

In 1999, four apartment buildings were blown up in Russia, hundreds killed.

Speaker 150:45

But twenty-five years on, we still don't know for sure who did it. It's a mystery that sparked chilling theories. Because these bombs, they're part of the origin story of one of the most powerful men in the world.

Speaker 151:01

Vladimir Putin.

Speaker 151:03

I'm Helena Merriman and in a new BBC series, I'm talking to the reporters who first covered this story. What did they miss first time round?

Speaker 151:13

The History Bureau, Putin and the Apartment Bombs. Listen first on BBC Sounds.