Rita Tushingham

Rita Tushingham0:01

BBC Sounds, Music, Radio, Podcasts.

Presenter0:05

Hello, I'm Lauren Laverne and this is the Desert Island Discs podcast. Every week I ask my guests to choose the eight tracks, book and luxury they'd want to take with them if they were castaway to a desert island. And, for rights reasons, the music is shorter than the original broadcast. I hope you enjoy listening.

Presenter0:43

My castaway this week is the actress Rita Tushingham. She celebrated her 80th birthday this year and continues to tackle challenging roles in film and on television. She made her debut and her name in the groundbreaking kitchen sink drama A Taste of Honey in 1961. Both critically acclaimed and controversial in its day. Her spellbinding performance won her a BAFTA, a Golden Globe, and the Best Actress Award at the Cannes Film Festival at just 19 years old. She went on to play roles in films which epitomized swinging London in the 1960s, including cult classic The Leather Boys and sex comedy The Knack and How to Get It. By 1965, she was sharing the screen with Judy Christie and Alec Guinness in David Lean's epic love story Dr. Givago. She says, I don't think I was ever that ambitious, but I love film. I need it like most people need air. Rita Tushingham, welcome to Desert Island Discs. Oh, thank you for asking me. I'm thrilled to be here. You've recently played a range of characters in some very hard-hitting dramas. You were Martin Freeman's term Leal Mother in the Responder, a watchful grandmother in the Edgar Wright film Last Night in Soho. Do you enjoy working with younger actors and talking to them about their lives and experiences and yours?

Rita Tushingham1:59

Yes, I I if they ask me, I would never go, I think you should do it like this, or you should do it and you don't want to be sitting there saying, And when I did and all that. You just sort of talk what happens on set and all sorts of things like that. And if they say, What do you think about this? or We're working something out and and you work together. But yet I do learn from them and I hope that I give them a little something.

Presenter2:23

You were just nineteen when you started shooting a taste of honey. I think it was quite close to your birthday. It was on my birthday. On your nineteenth birthday, wow. How were you able to keep up that momentum in a career that can be so challenging?

Rita Tushingham2:27

It was on my birthday.

Rita Tushingham2:34

Um I think uh luck has a lot to do with it.

Rita Tushingham2:38

And the passion never goes. You want to keep on working, but you don't want to be when you get to a certain age, you know, people say, Oh, we're not gonna you've got to that certain age or an

Rita Tushingham2:49

Yes, you can't do this, you can't do that. But if you're an actor you can, and you it it's so silly. Don't think of age. I don't want to be playing grannies in the corner, just making a cup of tea for people and things. I want something with a bit of spirit.

Presenter3:03

Yeah, absolutely. And so those challenging times, as you say, it can be more difficult for actresses than actors. How did you handle that when you got to that stage?

Rita Tushingham3:12

When you've got

Rita Tushingham3:14

You can't change yourself. This is me at the age I am and the ages that I've been through. And if it doesn't fit, then it doesn't fit. You don't have to beg for things. You just I just think there's a lot of luck. And there are times when you're not going to be working and there are times when you do and you get used to that because you also have to live.

Speaker 13:32

Yeah.

Rita Tushingham3:34

It's one of the most important things, but not the most important thing in my life. So I'm lucky to have it, but I'm also lucky to have my family.

Presenter3:45

Well listen, we'll be talking about so much of that today, Rita, but we're also going to be sharing your discs. So I think we've better dive in. Let's hear your first. What's it going to be? It's Jerry and the Pacemakers, You'll Never Walk Alone. And why have you chosen this?

Rita Tushingham3:57

Well, because I support Liverpool Football Club and it's their anthem, as you know. And I know it sounds stupid, but when Liverpool are playing, I can't really watch them. I mean, if I went to the ground, of course I would, but I can't watch them and I don't want to know what the result is until the game is finished. And then you know, you can feel your pulse going, your heart going. But I'm always so delightful, and I always ask Siri what was after I know that obviously, even if there's extra time, what was the result? And then I hooray, and I'm okay. It's stupid, isn't it? But that's the way I am.

Speaker 14:27

Uh

Presenter4:28

Yeah.

Speaker 14:28

I don't know

Rita Tushingham4:32

Woke up.

Rita Tushingham4:35

The rainforest be touched.

Rita Tushingham4:45

I'm blowing.

Rita Tushingham5:00

In your

Presenter5:04

Jerry and the Pacemakers. You will never walk alone. So Rita Tushingham. Let's go back to Liverpool then. You were born there in nineteen forty two in the middle of an air raid in Garston. What did your mum, Enid, tell you about your arrival?

Presenter5:17

She caught me with her f

Rita Tushingham5:18

Beat.

Presenter5:19

Yeah.

Rita Tushingham5:20

And I wondered if that was...

Rita Tushingham5:22

One of the reasons why I thought at one stage I might like to be a footballer.

Presenter5:25

A dramatic arrival. And you were pretty early, I think.

Rita Tushingham5:28

I was a month premature and someone once said to me, Were you a premature baby? And I said, Yeah. I said, why? she said because you're always rushing.

Presenter5:39

Start as you mean to go on. Your dad, John, ran a couple of grocer's shops in Liverpool. What what was he like? What are your memories of him?

Rita Tushingham5:46

He was a very honourable man.

Rita Tushingham5:49

If people would come in and he knew that they couldn't afford certain things, he'd always give them an extra slice of ham or an extra slice of this. He would look after his customers. You used to help him out in the shop, I think. What were your jobs? Yeah, I used to go, I think he just used to do it because we could spend some time together. And he would say to me, Put these beans on the shelf or put the tins of fruit. So I'd do them all neatly. And I'd go out on orders with him when he did deliveries. He had a grocery shop and a post office. And he had another one in a place called Speak Mackets Lane, which my brother Peter ran. And just round the corner.

Speaker 16:27

Random

Rita Tushingham6:30

George Harrison was the butcher boy, and I remember him saying to me when I met him, he said,

Rita Tushingham6:37

Did your dad have a shop in Markets Lane? And I said yes. He said, Oh, I delivered round the corner. And it is funny, isn't it? All those those little pieces of the jigsaw that funny.

Presenter6:48

And I love that that was the conversation that you had. That's classic. But, you know, two people from the same town getting together getting really granular.

Rita Tushingham6:50

Yeah.

Rita Tushingham6:53

Yeah.

Rita Tushingham6:55

Nothing to do with sort of what you're doing in the business to do with that. Well, it's more important. You've got your roots, haven't you? Yeah.

Presenter7:01

Tell me a little bit about your mum. You've described her as being lots of fun reader. What what did she enjoy doing?

Rita Tushingham7:07

Uh Uh

Presenter7:08

Um When

Rita Tushingham7:08

She would cry with laughter. She was lots of fun. She loved fashion. She loved hats. She was the one who started.

Presenter7:16

You're being interested in the theatre, I think, you're more.

Rita Tushingham7:18

Yes, because she used to go every three weeks to Liverpool Rep, where I ended up working backstage. And I remember going and for the first time and falling in love with the whole theatre and the curtain and the lights and the they're always red, aren't they, the curtains? And I remember looking at it and being entranced by the whole thing. I fell in love then. And then when the curtain went up, you could smell I don't know if everyone could knew that, but there was the smell of the theatre. It was it was intoxicating.

Presenter7:50

Time. Yeah.

Rita Tushingham7:50

Uh

Presenter7:50

Uh

Rita Tushingham7:50

Next

Presenter7:51

Yeah. Yeah.

Rita Tushingham7:51

Reese, what what are we going to hear second? I've got Little Richard's Tooti Frutti, which I love because he was extraordinary. There had never been anyone like him. And he he just had the energy and the magic. He he was just amazing.

Speaker 18:04

Amazing.

Rita Tushingham8:07

Uh Bam to the

Speaker 18:07

Yeah.

Rita Tushingham8:08

Oh room, poo-de-poo, oh roof.

Rita Tushingham8:13

Oh rude, to the food I have, oh rude.

Rita Tushingham8:17

Rooty ruler, oh rude.

Rita Tushingham8:20

Oh my babaloo ma bala ba bama got a girl named Sue Denola.

Speaker 18:26

Just what to do.

Speaker 18:27

I got a girl named

Speaker 18:30

To know that's what to do To drop to the ear

Presenter8:35

Tooty Fruity by Little Richard. Rita Tushingham, when you were four, your family moved to the nearby suburb of Hunts Cross, and that was where you went to school. Did you enjoy it?

Presenter8:46

I did it

Rita Tushingham8:46

In Joy School, I went to a school called Heather Lee and for some reason, don't ask me why, I was allowed by Mrs Winter, the headmistress, because I didn't want to go through the door. So she allowed me health and safety listening to climb through the window. So every day

Presenter9:04

So every

Rita Tushingham9:06

I climb through the window.

Presenter9:08

Were you the only one who got to go through the windows because

Rita Tushingham9:10

Yes, because none of the others, they thought I was stupid. What's she doing that for? She's going through the window. And um but the the thing that I loved was in the hallway. It was a very small school. It's been small classes. But there was a painting of Jesus

Rita Tushingham9:27

Blessing the children There was a little girl with her back she's three quarter on with a a red velvet cloak and blond hair.

Rita Tushingham9:38

And I had a sister, I didn't know her, she died before I was born, but my mum had given me my sister's doll, who I still have, and she's very carefully in a box. But she was just like that, so I would tell everyone, That's my sister, she's in heaven, and I believed it, and that was what I saw every day, and I love that too.

Presenter10:00

You were a little bit naughty as a child, weren't you?

Presenter10:03

What happened to the living room curtains, Rita?

Rita Tushingham10:05

Oh, well, I cut them up.

Rita Tushingham10:08

Because my mum had just gone down the road and misses Vaughan, who used to come and look after me, was on her way coming to to to the house, and I thought, and I saw these scissors, and I thought

Rita Tushingham10:18

I don't know why I did it, but I just cut them up. But then I pulled them back so you couldn't really see. So it was the end. And then when they were drawn, there was all these dangling. And they knew it was me.

Presenter10:29

They knew it was you. There was a family story, I think, that used to lock yourself in the bathroom and flush the toilet over and over again. Why was that? Oh, well, it sounded like applause.

Rita Tushingham10:30

Yeah.

Rita Tushingham10:34

Push the toilet over.

Rita Tushingham10:38

So I'd be going, and then I'd flush it, and then they just said, Listen, next time you flush the loop.

Presenter10:45

I can 100% imagine this. Yeah, I love that.

Presenter10:48

When you were seven, you were actually hit by a car on your way to school. Can you remember anything about what happened?

Rita Tushingham10:54

I woke up and there I was and all these people were around me. Oh, that sounds terrifying. It it was. And um so my mum and dad were when I got to the a to the age of changing schools, they said, Well, you're not going to that school, too long a journey, so we'll send you to this school to La Sargesse.

Rita Tushingham11:11

And they sent me to the school that I had to cross the very road that I was run over on. That's Liverpool Logic. And uh but I do remember it. I remember coming out and you never forget it. It it's just there.

Presenter11:21

Yeah.

Rita Tushingham11:23

My head came right out to to my shoulder. I I had concussion, but I was very lucky because the car went right over me. But it was a very high car in those days, the you know, the high wheels.

Presenter11:32

Mm-hmm.

Presenter11:35

So so that was how you ended up going to a a Catholic school, I suggest, even though your your family weren't Catholic?

Rita Tushingham11:38

Yeah, yeah.

Presenter11:41

So it was convent school pretty strict, I'm imagining. How did the nuns deal with you with you there?

Rita Tushingham11:46

They didn't deal they sort of dealt okay, but I think they thought I was a bit of a troublemaker and they didn't want me to to encourage the girls to perform.

Rita Tushingham11:56

And I remember the bon maire, the mother superior, we'd go past her window and we always have to curtsy. And I thought, I'm not curtsying to a window. You know, and there were things like that that they didn't like. But I was intoxicated by the incense and certain things of the Catholic religion. And I have a strong faith. I really do, but it's my faith.

Speaker 112:15

Yeah.

Presenter12:15

And

Rita Tushingham12:20

Pieced it together.

Rita Tushingham12:22

With the time for some more music, this is your third choice today. What's it going to be? It's going to be Penny Lane because the school, Heather Lee, that I went to was on Penny Lane.

Rita Tushingham12:35

And in my eyes.

Speaker 412:38

Uh

Speaker 412:42

They act beneath the blue, superban skies I sit, and meanwhile back in Penny Lane there is a fireman with an hourglass.

Speaker 412:54

And in his pocket is a fall

Presenter12:55

Portrait of the Queen

Rita Tushingham12:57

Uh

Rita Tushingham12:58

He likes to keep his fire engine clean

Rita Tushingham13:03

Machine

Presenter13:05

Penny Lane by The Beatles. Rita Tushingham, when you were sixteen you joined the Liverpool Rep. You were a student assistant stage manager based at the Liverpool Playhouse. So what sort of work were you doing? I

Rita Tushingham13:16

I was doing props, making tea, doing all the sort of things for the actors, and I was also playing small roles, and the first role I played was the back legs of a horse in Toad of Toad Hall.

Presenter13:28

How did that go?

Rita Tushingham13:29

over acting, I was scratching the the fellow in front who was the assistant stage manager and he said, just he was Australian, he said, don't do that. I don't like it when you're doing that. I said, but it gets a laugh. He said, yeah, but I don't like it.

Presenter13:38

Uh

Presenter13:42

It was after that scene-stealing performance that you saw an advert in the newspaper with a job offer. What did it actually say? It said looking for a

Rita Tushingham13:52

and unattractive.

Rita Tushingham13:54

Unknown

Rita Tushingham13:55

Yeah.

Rita Tushingham13:56

to play the role of Joe in a taste of honey. So I thought, I think and it's something that you do. I think fate is there. There are all the all the stars were in line. And I wrote a letter, sent a photograph to

Speaker 114:04

There

Rita Tushingham14:11

Wood for films and um they said, If you're going to be in London, come and do an audition. My mum said, We're going. And uh I went and Tony said, Right, what are you going to do for us? And I said, Well, um I'll do a bit of reading for Tony Richardson. And I so I did uh something from

Speaker 114:25

This is Tony Richardson.

Rita Tushingham14:30

They had some pages and I did that and then we did improvisation and then a few weeks went by and then they rang and said, right, we'd like you to do a film test. So I came back to London and then I went back home again and then one day when I was doing the calls, you know, half an hour please, half the all up the thing, because the tan oil we didn't have. And Bob Lee, who was a stage doorkeeper, said, hey, Rita, there's a phone call for you. So I came down, down, down, down, down. And it was Tony who said, no, it's Tony, Tony Richardson. You've got the part. And I went, and I thought, did he say you haven't got the part? Or you have got the part? But they'd also call, they had to call my mum and dad. And yes, I had got the part, but I had to wait about six months before we started shooting because the people that were going to finance it wanted a name and they wanted Audrey Hepburn.

Presenter15:27

Right

Rita Tushingham15:27

And Tony said no, which was wonderful. I mean, for Tony, I would I wouldn't be in films if it wasn't for Tony Richardson. I owe him everything. He went ahead and stuck with me, as did John Osborne, and I was very, very lucky, really lucky.

Presenter15:41

Time for some more music, Reesa. This is your fourth choice today. What are we gonna

Rita Tushingham15:44

And here next the wonderful Ella Fitzgerald.

Rita Tushingham15:48

Singing every time we say goodbye. And I don't think this is a song just for lovers. I think it's a song that.

Rita Tushingham15:55

When we do say goodbye, we say goodbye to our children. When they're going off to school for the first time, we say goodbye to brothers, to sisters. It's the word saying goodbye.

Speaker 116:06

Every time.

Speaker 116:09

When we say goodbye.

Rita Tushingham16:14

Uh I double it all

Rita Tushingham16:18

Every time we say good

Speaker 116:24

Goodbye.

Speaker 116:25

Uh

Rita Tushingham16:26

Yeah.

Speaker 116:26

I wonder why

Rita Tushingham16:30

What a good one.

Speaker 116:33

I'm too bad.

Rita Tushingham16:33

Love me no more.

Presenter16:37

Every time we say goodbye, Ella Fitzgerald. So Rita Tushingham, I want to ask you more about A Taste of Honey. In it, you play the teenager Jo who has a brief romance with a sailor called Jimmy and after he's gone back to ship discovers she's pregnant, her friend Jeff moves in with her and they set up home together. The film broke so many taboos on screen. Now bearing in mind this is 1961. You've got Jimmy played by Paul Dankwa. He's black. Jeff is gay. Your character's a teenage mother and Sheila Delaney was a teenager when she wrote the play initially herself. Were you aware of the feathers that you were going to ruffle and the impact that you were going to have while you were making it?

Rita Tushingham17:17

It didn't worry me. People would say, Well, weren't you a bit worried about being in something like that? No, I wasn't,'cause it was life, and it was all there on the page. And she just wanted love, she wanted tenderness, which she found with Jimmy.

Presenter17:31

And it's it's a beautiful relationship between them. In one scene, Joe and Jimmy kiss, one of the first interracial kisses in a feature film in the world. How do you look back on that scene and that moment today?

Rita Tushingham17:42

Well, I I think it's wonderful that it was that and that it m history was made. But it it was just a sweet, wonderful

Rita Tushingham17:51

Love Story

Presenter17:53

You became very close friends with Paul Danqua, who played Jimmy. Was your friendship ever an issue away from the film set?

Rita Tushingham18:00

We were very, very close friends. He was the godfather to my first born Dadonna.

Rita Tushingham18:08

And we we did all sorts of things together. Paul was rich with living. He loved life and had such a wonderful sense of humour and looked after me so well. But we would walk around, you know, when we were in in Soho, walking around, and people would shout, Black and white don't mix. And I was so shocked, and Paul would just say, No, it's all right, she's just been on holiday.

Presenter18:37

And going back to that original and very unkind advert, it actually called for quotes ugly girls to audition. Now, some journalists were very cruel about your appearance when the film came out. How did you deal with those comments? What did you make of them? I'd look at people and

Rita Tushingham18:52

think, Oh, they don't look so bad, they don't look so good either. So you you you I didn't take it personally. You don't think about it. You don't honestly go into the bathroom in the morning and say, Oh, God, you're ugly

Rita Tushingham19:05

You you just don't

Rita Tushingham19:07

Do it. You're not that you have to be really into yourself.

Rita Tushingham19:12

Don't you, to to be that concerned? And why should you be concerned by one person? Because they think it's a story.

Presenter19:20

Let's get some more music, shall we? This is your fifth choice today. What are we going to hear next?

Rita Tushingham19:24

Well, when I first came to London,

Rita Tushingham19:26

John Dexter, director that I was working with.

Rita Tushingham19:30

invited me to go to the ballet.

Rita Tushingham19:32

And um I hadn't ever seen a ballet.

Rita Tushingham19:36

on stage, and it was at the Royal Opera House. It was Margot Fontaine, Rudolph Neurayeff, dancing.

Speaker 119:43

Dancing

Rita Tushingham19:44

Giselle, just a wonderful atmosphere there, and then sitting there and then seeing them dance, and the whole drama of it. She was beautiful, he was beautiful, and they were

Speaker 119:44

Giselle

Rita Tushingham19:56

Fantastic. I was very lucky to experience that.

Presenter21:00

An extract from the Ballet Giselle, composed by Adolphe Adam, performed by the Pro Arte Orchestra, conducted by Marcus Dodds. Readed Tushingham, after the success of A Taste of Honey, you moved to Chelsea and you acted at the Royal Court Theatre. London was, of course, in full swing by then, and you were getting in amongst it. You hung out with some incredible celebrities and artists of the day. Francis Bacon, who was introduced to you by your friend and co-star Paul Dankwa. What do you remember about him? Yeah.

Rita Tushingham21:30

We'd go out and and have sort of supper or or something like that, and and just would relax and go to Morocco. I went to Morocco quite a lot, and Francis would come over there. And I remember we were it's very naughty of me we there was a restriction of how much money you could take out of the country.

Rita Tushingham21:49

And they sent me from Tangier Paul sent a telegram and saying could you bring some money out for Francis? So I got the money and I had to send I remember sending a telegram back saying bacon rasher is okay.

Presenter22:10

So you sending a coded telegram to Francis Baker.

Rita Tushingham22:12

Yeah, bacon rushes and took it and took um some money out for France. And I remember us sitting on the beach and Francis decided he was going to cover himself'cause there was a young boy who used to sell the telegraph on the beach and so Francis was sitting covered in the telegraph because it was too hot.

Presenter22:29

Cousin is too hot.

Rita Tushingham22:30

Yeah.

Rita Tushingham22:31

Oh, he w he was amazing, amazing.

Presenter22:34

Bam!

Rita Tushingham22:35

Yeah.

Presenter22:36

You work with some wonderful actors in your career. Who has a special place in your heart, I wonder?

Presenter22:41

I've been

Rita Tushingham22:41

Or Venus.

Rita Tushingham22:43

Oh, Alec Guinness.

Rita Tushingham22:45

We, of course, the scenes that I did in Dr. Giivago were just with Sir Alec Guinness, and we got on really, really well. Where we were shooting, we were staying in this hotel, and he used to put notes under the door, and I would put notes under his door, and we always used to put a hand on the notes. I do that to this day now.

Presenter23:07

So we draw a little picture of the land at the bottom.

Rita Tushingham23:08

And but now to this day when I send someone something by hand, I always put the hand on it. The history is because of Sir Ali.

Presenter23:13

I hand

Presenter23:17

What about Oliver Reid? I mean, you know, he was obviously a a a great spirit, but I would have thought you'd have to be bring out your A game to handle him.

Rita Tushingham23:25

I knew what needed to be done with Oliver. You almost needed to be.

Rita Tushingham23:31

A teacher.

Rita Tushingham23:32

And then he wouldn't pull the tricks that he thought he could pull with other people. What kind of tricks did he pull? When he used to fix people's drinks and I know he did it to my

Presenter23:36

When it used to be.

Rita Tushingham23:41

First then husband Terry. Spiked that drink. Yeah, he he was absolutely blotter. And he did it to the director.

Rita Tushingham23:48

who fell in his soup,

Rita Tushingham23:50

I remember he was in a No, he did, but I he didn't do it to me'cause of course I didn't drink. But he told me that the money was I said to him, How dare you? How dare you? And he was I d because I don't think people sort of

Presenter23:56

So we talked about them right now.

Rita Tushingham24:04

Questioned it. They didn't call him on it. And it's what a bad woman doing it. My goodness me. But I did. I went right in there.

Presenter24:10

And he respected you for it. Yeah.

Rita Tushingham24:11

Yeah, he did. We did r respect each other, but I wouldn't take it. I was not gonna have that nonsense.

Presenter24:17

Particularly difficult in the context of the film you were doing together, because I think you were a mute in that one. I was, and that's quite difficult.

Rita Tushingham24:22

I was, it's quite difficult.

Rita Tushingham24:26

So and but I did have to chop his leg off.

Presenter24:29

Wow, there is that.

Rita Tushingham24:30

So I had that up my sleeve.

Presenter24:34

Let's have some more music, Rita. It's disc number six. What are we going to hear?

Rita Tushingham24:37

Uh

Presenter24:38

Yeah.

Rita Tushingham24:38

Bridge Over Troubled Water, which we used to play a lot in Cornwall, Terry and I, and then

Rita Tushingham24:45

Aisha, my second daughter, and Dadonna played it, and now Dylan and Willow, and Willow a couple of weeks ago was singing in a choir and they sang Bridge Over Troubled Water, so it goes through three generations.

Speaker 124:48

Don't

Speaker 125:00

When you're weary

Speaker 125:06

Feeling small

Speaker 125:10

Yeah.

Rita Tushingham25:10

When tears are in your eyes

Rita Tushingham25:18

I will draw

Speaker 125:19

Yeah.

Presenter25:26

On your side.

Speaker 125:27

Uh

Presenter25:31

Simon and Garfunkel, Bridge Over Troubled Water. Rita Tushingham, the sixties had been boom time for the British film industry, but the 1970s were a bit more difficult. So you started making films in Europe. How did that work? I mean, you didn't speak another language, so did you tend to play those kind of English blow-in to town type characters?

Rita Tushingham25:51

No, often you we were, you know, that I was dubbed. But I did six films in Italy, and I loved working in Italy. It was they're wonderful to work with, chaotic but wonderful. And there's a because often you didn't do sync sound. So there's a lot of chatting going on. And you know, especially if they were doing a shot where the camera's tracking towards you, they're there, no, no, and all this is going on and all the chatting you're trying to do the dialogue. But it it worked.

Presenter26:22

So you were travelling a lot. You'd made the decision to leave your family behind in Cornwall to get acting jobs. That must have been very difficult. Your daughters were quite young at the time. How did you weigh up whether to leave or whether to take another path, do something else?

Rita Tushingham26:36

Well, um I was the breadwinner, so if I hadn't we'd have been living on the beach in Polpero.

Rita Tushingham26:43

Um and yes, it was hard, it was very hard, because I feel I missed out on a lot.

Rita Tushingham26:49

with Dadama Nayusha.

Rita Tushingham26:51

But that was the the job I did, so they were used to it. It it wasn't unusual for them because it's what they knew from day one. And they came with me up until a certain age, and then, you know, it was too disrupting

Presenter27:06

From from school and everything.

Presenter27:08

In two thousand five, your daughter Aisha was diagnosed with stage three breast cancer. She was just thirty three. I'm pleased to say that she recovered and she went on to have your two grandchildren. You supported her through treatment, but that must have just been a devastating time. How did you get through it?

Presenter27:27

Um

Rita Tushingham27:29

You just do. You it was a shock.

Rita Tushingham27:34

You feel like someone's picked you up.

Rita Tushingham27:36

and thrown you against a wall.

Rita Tushingham27:39

You can hide in a corner.

Rita Tushingham27:41

And not do anything about it or say, right, this is it, you have to, I hate the word, but you have to be in the moment.

Rita Tushingham27:48

You have to accept what's happening, and Ayesha is the most

Rita Tushingham27:53

Amazing Percy.

Rita Tushingham27:56

And

Rita Tushingham27:57

She just got on with it. She

Rita Tushingham28:00

is so strong and spiritual.

Rita Tushingham28:03

And she helped me and at the same time I had my other daughter, who was quite frail and ill in Los Angeles, in hospital at the same time. But I would hold the crystal, and I made myself at the end of every day

Rita Tushingham28:20

I brought myself into this is the situation.

Rita Tushingham28:24

And I slept. I really slept well. And I would hold a crystal. And you just have to recognize what the situation is. You can't hide from it. But there were times when I wanted to keep myself busy. Yeah, you must have.

Presenter28:39

Been just on pins the entire time. I know that you did a lot of kind of stress ironing at the end of the day. Oh, yes.

Rita Tushingham28:45

Oh, yes, and I'd say I say what I'd do some if some workmen were working on the building, I'd try and say, Oh, let me let me iron that shirt for you, do that anything. Yeah, I needed something to occupy me.

Presenter28:55

Rita, it's time for your next choice. What is it and why are you taking it with you to the island today?

Rita Tushingham29:01

I haven't a clue. Because they're just so joyous, and they're naughty but innocent, and they're not unkind. You laugh with them, and they're so clever.

Presenter29:12

And it's important to you to have comedy on the island, to have voices on the island then.

Rita Tushingham29:15

Oh, gosh, you've got to. G it's the most important thing to be able to laugh.

Speaker 129:20

So, in this the age of the 10-second attention span, the teams are going to compete to produce the shortest possible rendition of some well-known films, programmes, etc. And Barry and Graham, you can start. Romeo and Juliet, I love you. I love you too. I'm dead. So am I.

Speaker 129:42

No, just kidding, oh bugger.

Presenter29:48

A clip from I'm Sorry I Haven't a Clue with Humphrey Littleton, Barry Cryer, Graham Garden, Tim Brooke Taylor and Jeremy Hardy, produced by John Naismith.

Presenter29:59

So Rita Tushingham, is there any part that y you have the urge to play, the the one that got away that you haven't done yet?

Rita Tushingham30:05

No, I don't think you should ever think that because you'd always feel incomplete, wouldn't you? If it's not going to work, it's not going to work. So you have to go on. You can't keep thinking, Oh, I wish I had this and I wish I'd that you'd never move on then.

Presenter30:18

It sounds Rita like like your faith is an important part of your life. Will that be what sustains you on the island?

Rita Tushingham30:23

Yeah, yes it will. It it sustains me daily, really. So I would take that with me to the island, that's for sure. You said it's a faith that you've worked For yourself. How would you describe it? It's being spiritual towards people, I think, is the most important. And also being aware. I can't explain it, but it's just something that.

Presenter30:32

Or would you just

Presenter30:37

The mess

Rita Tushingham30:42

A jigsaw I've pieced together, and it fits me.

Rita Tushingham30:46

Well

Presenter30:47

We'd love to hear your final disc before we cast you away for God. What's it going to be, Rita?

Rita Tushingham30:47

With love.

Rita Tushingham30:51

It's going to be Hallelujah by Jeff Butley. I went to Kew Gardens.

Rita Tushingham30:58

And it was night and they they were playing music uh all over the place and there was the big glass house.

Rita Tushingham31:06

And the sky was so many stars, it was so beautiful.

Rita Tushingham31:11

That was playing and I sort of felt at one.

Rita Tushingham31:15

With nature.

Speaker 431:17

Well I heard there was a secret core

Speaker 431:21

But David played and it pleased the Lord But you don't really care for music, do you?

Speaker 431:31

It goes like this, the fourth, the fifth, the minor fall and the major lift.

Presenter31:38

Uh

Speaker 431:38

The b

Presenter31:39

Apple King composing Halloween

Presenter31:45

Hallelujah

Presenter31:48

Jeff Buckley with Alleluia.

Presenter31:51

So Rita Tushingham, I'm going to send you away to the desert island. I'm giving you the Bible, the complete works of Shakespeare, and you can take one other book. What will that one be? It's

Rita Tushingham32:00

It's going to be the Brewer's Dictionary of Phrase and Fable. And it's got over 18,000 entries in it. And I thought that could keep me going for a long time. It's a wonderful book.

Presenter32:05

Yeah.

Speaker 132:09

Game f

Rita Tushingham32:11

I could probably do if I wanted to spend the

Rita Tushingham32:14

20 years, maybe I could do about five a day or something, I don't know.

Presenter32:19

I can imagine you speaking the lines out loud as well. You'd have to the sea, to the wave. Sure, sure. Well, I definitely want that to happen, so that's yours. What about your luxury item? What do you fancy?

Rita Tushingham32:21

Bonnie's half

Presenter32:29

Well

Rita Tushingham32:29

Yeah. Yeah.

Presenter32:30

I have to

Rita Tushingham32:30

to take a photograph of my beloved family.

Rita Tushingham32:35

But I'd like to protect it in a book of matte cartoons, and I'd like the book to be wrapped in a a mosquito net.

Presenter32:46

You are sneaking in some contraband there, Rita Tushingham. I'm not allowed to. And you've got the most angelic look on your face as well. I can see that mischievous streak coming out from your childhood. I'm seeing little Rita in front of me. Mosquito net, too practical.

Rita Tushingham32:51

And you've got

Speaker 132:52

Uh

Presenter33:01

Oh, yes. You can have the photo, but you can't have another book. You can, however, have a a whole album of family photos. Yes, I could. Perfect, Rita. In that case, we'll give you an endless supply of family photos.

Speaker 133:01

Uh

Rita Tushingham33:01

Oh yes.

Presenter33:14

And finally, which one track of the eight that you've shared with us today would you save from the waves?

Rita Tushingham33:19

Bridge Over Troubled Water, because I've got memories of all of us in that song.

Presenter33:25

Rita Tushingham, thank you very much for letting us hear Desert Island discs.

Rita Tushingham33:29

Thank you. I've really enjoyed it. I've loved being here. Thank you.

Presenter33:53

Hello, I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Rita, and I'm glad we were able to come to an agreement about her luxury. We've cast away many actors, including Sophia Loren, Nicole Kidman, and Dame Helen Miran. Rita's co-star, Alec Guinness, is in our back catalogue too. You can find all of those episodes in our Desert Island Discs programme archive and through BBC Sounds. The studio manager for today's programme was Emma Hart, the assistant producer was Christine Pavlovsky, and the producer was Paula McGinley. Next time, my guest will be you two frontman Bono. I do hope you'll join us.

Speaker 434:35

Hi, I'm Greg Jenner and You're Dead to Me from Radio 4 is back. Yes, we're the comedy show that takes history seriously. And this series, get ready to hear about Frederick the Great of Prussia with Stephen Fry. I'm just thrilled at this history lesson. Learn a fair old amount about an ancient Egyptian queen with Keema Bob. What a vibe. And for a stitch in time, we talk about the Bayer Tapestry with Lou Sanders. Oh, I'm a gog. All alongside a host of brilliant historians. That's You're Dead to Me. Listen and subscribe on BBC Sounds.

Speaker 435:04

Johnny good, isn't it?