David Harewood

Speaker 10:01

BBC Sounds, Music, Radio, Podcasts.

Presenter0:04

Hello, I'm Lauren Laverne and this is the Desert Island Discs podcast. Every week I ask my guests to choose the eight tracks, book and luxury they'd want to take with them if they were cast away to a desert island. And, for rights reasons, the music is shorter than the original broadcast. I hope you enjoy listening.

Presenter0:44

My castaway this week is the actor, writer and presenter David Harewood. It was in America that he became an apparent overnight success, landing a role in the acclaimed drama series Homeland. His big break wasn't all that it appeared, however. In reality, it came after well over 20 years of hard work at home in the UK.

Presenter1:04

He was the first black actor to play Othello at the National Theatre in 1997, was Martin Luther King in the Olivier award-winning play The Mountaintop, and toured the world as Anthony to Vanessa Redgrave's Cleopatra. But he struggled to cross over and land weighty television roles. He was between jobs and down to his last 80 pounds when he decided to take a chance and audition for Homeland. It turned his career and his life around. His success has allowed him the opportunity to explore how and why his own story has played out in the way it has. In the award-winning BBC documentary Psychosis in Me, he talked openly about the mental illness that could have destroyed him at the age of 23. He says, The only place I feel like I belong is on stage. On stage I feel 10 feet tall. If you give me a character, I'm indestructible. I feel invincible. It's when I step off stage that I get my questions. It's when I'm unsure. David Harewood, welcome to Desert Island Discs.

David Harewood2:01

Thank you. Thank you for inviting me. It's it's warm in this desert island already.

Presenter2:04

Yes, exactly. You are most welcome to our warm environs. Let's start with that feeling of being on stage then, David. Such a powerful quote from you. And it sounds very physical, that sensation. I feel ten feet tall. Tell me more about it.

David Harewood2:07

Yeah.

David Harewood2:17

But

David Harewood2:18

It well, you have surety on stage, you have um certainty. So, you know, we've all rehearsed the moves, everyone knows their lines, everyone's wearing agreed costumes, everything's set. And that's not like life, is it? No one knows their lines in life, in real life. Uh so I on on stage I sort of grow.

David Harewood2:36

You give me a character, I pour myself into that character, and it gives me a sense of freedom.

Presenter2:41

And what do you like when you're not working? You know, it's obviously such a great outlet for all that creative energy. Where does it go between gigs?

David Harewood2:49

I'll pot around the house and

David Harewood2:51

I enjoy walking my dog every morning and that's my

David Harewood2:54

bonding with nature and with the wilderness, even if it's just tooting common. That gives me a a sense of sort of perspective. But I I do try and have some downtime or or create that downtime.

Presenter2:56

Mm-hmm.

Speaker 12:57

Uh

David Harewood3:06

When I get tired and overwhelmed, that's when my little alarm bells ring. I have these mental health alarm bells.

Presenter3:12

Yeah.

David Harewood3:13

Uh that start ringing that tell me I'm just doing too much.

Presenter3:17

Well, let's hear your first disc, David. What have you chosen, and why are you taking it with you today?

David Harewood3:22

I remember as a kid listening to this tune, Bob Marley and the Wailers Exodus and playing drums and singing the entire album and just imagine because it was live, just imagining myself there and I had this wonderful two hours in my front room basically playing a live concert and pretending to be Bob Marley.

David Harewood3:42

Let's see the

David Harewood3:45

Alright

David Harewood3:47

Who men thought your people here again?

David Harewood3:55

Uh

Speaker 33:55

Let's see it done!

Speaker 33:58

Alright, move and thought every floor. Yeah.

Presenter4:10

Bob Marley and the Wailers and Exodus. So David Harewood, let's go back to the beginning. You were born in Birmingham, the youngest of four. Your parents, uh Joe and Maline, had come to the UK from Barbados. They were part of the Windrush generation.

Presenter4:24

Your dad was a lorry driver. Tell me a bit about him. What was your relationship like when you were little?

Speaker 34:25

Uh

David Harewood4:25

Hmm.

David Harewood4:30

He's a quiet man, my dad very, very quiet man.

David Harewood4:33

you know, he would probably golf on driving his lorry.

David Harewood4:37

He owned this thing called a bread run, which was his long run down to Devon to deliver bread.

David Harewood4:41

And as a kid I just remember sitting in the front of this truck, high up,

David Harewood4:45

In his truck, looking out the window, watching the fields and the different towns roll by. It was great. And as a kid, I had a wonderful imagination. So there was always.

David Harewood4:54

ideas flying around in my head about fighter jets zooming in to kind of pick me up from the lorry or the Thunderbirds would launch and sort of pick my dad's trailer up out of the I had all these great, amazing

David Harewood5:07

Sort of images, James Bond type images of Bond shooting at the back of the trailer and kind of driving off in a fancy car and stuff.

Presenter5:14

You say your mum was tremendously hard working. You hardly remember her sitting down during the day at least, but she also had a a reputation for being wayward and someone who had a little fire in her, which sounds like a really lovely combination. Tell me about the wayward side.

David Harewood5:26

Mm-hmm.

David Harewood5:29

Well, she loved the bingo. She was always out, you know, and sort of maybe maybe if she wanted, she'd kind of have a little bit of a tipple. But she was also, as I said, she had a bit of a fire in her. And one of my earliest memories was that

David Harewood5:39

Looking for my brother and somebody throwing a stone at my face. About five or something like that. Yeah, I just got hit in the face with this rock. Somebody throwing this rock, and she sort of brought us all in the house. And she knew exactly who it was. And she walked off to the police station and she sort of calmly said to the police, the neighbors have just thrown this stone. And she said, I beg you come because if you don't, you're going to be around my house later, taking them to the morgue and me to the prison. Because she had this kind of turn of phrase, which was like, you better come now, or I'm going to go around and do something which you're going to, someone's going to get in trouble for. But she had it with this kind of beautiful West Indian lilt. And.

Speaker 16:07

Mm-hmm.

David Harewood6:15

The officer kind of knew exactly what she meant and kind of went round and spoke to this guy. Not that it stopped anything, but um, you know, she knew she had to stand her corner, she knew she had to protect her children and she was fierce, she was strong, you know, and I I sort of admired her for that.

Presenter6:30

David, we've got to go to the music. It's your second disc today. What have you chosen?

David Harewood6:36

I just remember as a kid.

David Harewood6:39

You know, hearing music like this.

David Harewood6:41

And um

David Harewood6:42

Just a sense of happiness.

David Harewood6:46

The warmth in the house, you know, my mum and dad cooking their West Indian food. I think this was actually before.

David Harewood6:53

They divorced. So there was a sense of

David Harewood6:57

togetherness and happiness in the household.

David Harewood7:00

And they had this grammar phone and um all their records in it. And sometimes we'd sneak into that front room and play some of their music. And this was one of those tracks, Tears on My Pillow, Johnny Nash, that really is very evocative.

Speaker 17:11

No.

David Harewood7:14

Oof.

David Harewood7:15

Family and time.

David Harewood7:18

Something that's gone.

David Harewood7:25

Every night I wake up crying

David Harewood7:32

Tears on my pillow

Speaker 17:34

Uh

David Harewood7:35

Pain in my heart.

David Harewood7:38

You won't be

Presenter7:44

Jonny Nash and Tears on My Pillow, David Harewood. So the incident that you described, your earliest memory of having a rock thrown at you by a neighbour, very sadly, that was just the beginning of the abuse that you would experience in childhood, which you believe is at the root of the mental health problems that you experienced as an adult. I know that there was one formative incident when you were seven years old, I think, that you trace that real kind of fracture back to. Can you tell me about that?

Speaker 18:08

Yeah.

David Harewood8:08

When you

David Harewood8:10

What do you think?

David Harewood8:16

I saw this old guy across the street

David Harewood8:19

And he kind of was walking towards me. But I knew because he was old, it wasn't like a skinhead,'cause in the time, you know, you if you back in the day, if you saw a skin he saw a skinhead, you were in trouble.

Presenter8:28

You describe it as your spidey sense.

David Harewood8:29

Your spider sense would tingle and you'd go, I better run her here or I better scalp her. I still this guy was no threat to me'cause I'cause he was an old guy, so I didn't really my spider senses were low, they weren't tingling.

Speaker 38:40

Um

David Harewood8:42

And he sort of walked up to me in a very calm.

David Harewood8:45

way and then he kind of leaned in

David Harewood8:47

and he said, Get the out of my country, you little black bastard

David Harewood8:52

And he stayed there, looking at me, glaring at me with a big red face.

David Harewood8:55

And it really suddenly hit me that because I was black,

David Harewood8:59

that he didn't think I belonged here.

David Harewood9:03

And I just always remember that being really...

David Harewood9:06

discombobulating, really confusing. I just didn't as a young kid, I just didn't understand it. I thought, well, I'm from England. And I just buried everything, buried the discomfort, buried the the pain, and just sort of trying to get on with my life and just assimilate.

Presenter9:20

Luckily, home was a haven at this point for you. That was a place where you felt safe and happy. And you you described the happiest memories of being the family gathered around the T V laughing together.

David Harewood9:25

Wait.

Speaker 19:25

Uh

David Harewood9:30

Hmm.

Presenter9:31

What was the typical night like? If we'd have sat in with the Harewood family, what would we have been wanting?

David Harewood9:35

It was joyous, jumping on the sofa and he'd be sort of mum would be cooking dinner, dad probably would be already home, and he's watching his watch you know, he was a great lover of British sitcoms.

David Harewood9:48

So whether it was Some Mother's Do I Have Em or Benny Hill or Tommy Cooper or all those sort of seventies sitcoms, British sitcoms, he would roar with laughter. Him and my mum would roar with laughter. That for me was um

David Harewood10:01

perfection. It was hearing the sound of laughter

David Harewood10:05

and sort of feeling safe in amongst this sort of family setting. And you know, one one day we were all playing in the playground, my brothers were all playing about my sister came running to the bottom of the fence and she said, Roger, Paul, David, there's a black man on the television.

David Harewood10:20

And we all just sort of ran into the living room, you know, to see.

David Harewood10:24

It would be Sinbad or something like that or some American film and there'd be the one strong heroic black dude who'd sort of fight the Cyclops and save the day and die heroically. They wouldn't last, but it was good to see them. I guess seeing myself reflected was a sort of

David Harewood10:41

Yes, I you know there is a way might be difficult but there is a way of making it

Presenter10:47

It's time for some more music, David. What are we going to hear next? Disc number three, if you would.

David Harewood10:50

this sound and this band very much reflected the multicultural nature of my world. And I remember it being a very pivotal moment in my life thinking, what am I going to do with my life? Because I

David Harewood11:03

I I wasn't I didn't thrill in academically at school. I didn't really want to go to university. And it was like the dole office or the factory.

David Harewood11:15

One in ten, for me anyway, was about

David Harewood11:18

I'm a number on a list. I'm just, you know, you know, just this sense of hopelessness in those early 80s of not having a future.

Speaker 111:25

The one in ten

Speaker 111:27

Run a leaf

David Harewood11:28

Uh Uh I am the one

David Harewood11:30

Even though I don't exist

David Harewood11:33

Nobody knows when I'm always

David Harewood11:37

Speaker Minder of World Authenticity

Presenter11:53

UB forty and one in ten. So David Harewood, you were happy and safe at home and happily at school as well. You had quite a positive school experience, even though, as you say, you weren't earmarked as an academic high flyer. But you loved performing.

David Harewood12:10

Yeah, I was a mischievous, naughty little boy. A lot of the teachers were sort of.

David Harewood12:17

found me regrettably very funny. So so so even though I was

Presenter12:20

So against their best intentions, they would laugh too.

David Harewood12:21

Yeah.

David Harewood12:22

They would laugh too, or they would throw me out and then they'd come out and go, Can you just please stop messing around? And literally five weeks away from leaving school.

Presenter12:27

Yeah.

David Harewood12:32

I got this call from one of my teachers, Mr. Reader.

David Harewood12:34

And he called me in and he said, What are you going to do when you leave, Harewood?

David Harewood12:38

And I really had no idea. So I don't know, sir. And Mr. Reeder said, well, look, we've been talking in the staff room, and we think you should be an actor.

David Harewood12:46

And that was my Eureka moment.

David Harewood12:48

I hadn't even thought it was possible to be an actor. I didn't even know what an actor

David Harewood12:52

How you became an actor.

David Harewood12:54

But a fire was lit in me. I just suddenly went,

David Harewood12:58

What a great idea

Presenter13:00

So David, you had found a a professional path and and pursued it with a passion. But life at home had become more difficult. When you were about fifteen, uh your dad became unwell. How do you remember that time when you look back now?

David Harewood13:14

Um

David Harewood13:15

It's a difficult time. I remember one night kind of coming home and all the lights in the house were on, downstairs were on. My dad always used to type in this typewriter.

David Harewood13:24

And um

David Harewood13:25

There was one sheet of paper in.

David Harewood13:27

In the typewriter there was just one word written on a A4 piece of paper.

David Harewood13:32

He just said illness.

David Harewood13:34

I was kind of shielded from a lot of

David Harewood13:37

What was going on in my you know, my my dad's suffered

David Harewood13:40

A form of psychosis, different a different type of psychosis.

David Harewood13:44

So my dad was sort of t taken away.

David Harewood13:47

And he was taken to hospital.

David Harewood13:50

and spent a couple of weeks in in uh an institution, sectioned.

Presenter13:54

How did life change when he came home?

David Harewood13:56

He was a very different man. A very, very different man. And um

David Harewood14:02

I remember him and my mum arguing a lot more, raised voices. You know, he was difficult to live with. And.

Presenter14:09

Mm-hmm.

David Harewood14:14

They split, decided to

David Harewood14:17

decided to go their separate ways.

David Harewood14:21

And me and my two brothers were going to stay with my dad. And that happened very quickly.

David Harewood14:27

Then suddenly my mum was gone.

David Harewood14:31

And that was painful.

David Harewood14:32

I was very painful.

David Harewood14:34

I was I was th you know, I always remember Christmases as a kid.

David Harewood14:38

Lots of food in the house, mum cooking, presents, joy.

David Harewood14:43

And the first Christmas after this they split.

David Harewood14:46

God was

David Harewood14:48

You know, there wasn't much.

David Harewood14:50

Food.

David Harewood14:51

in the in the cupboards and it was just cold and bare and

David Harewood14:55

I still went to see my mum on Christmas Day, but I it it just felt weird. Going to two different houses on Christmas Day felt very weird. And that so that felt like the end of my

David Harewood15:06

Childhood, I think.

Presenter15:08

Let's take a minute for some music, David.

David Harewood15:10

Hmm.

Presenter15:11

What are we going to hear next?

David Harewood15:13

Um, I'm gonna play Tom Witz, you know, once I'd kind of be decided to tread the path and become an actor.

David Harewood15:21

and going down to Rada and just mixing with different very different people.

David Harewood15:26

And listening to different music. And I remember, you know, living in a house with four or five other people and this this track came on and I just always remember.

David Harewood15:36

Just being so astonished by the lyrics, Tom Waite's twenty nine dollars from the album Blue Valentine evokes the change from the boy that left Birmingham to this young adult.

David Harewood15:48

Really bad.

David Harewood15:52

Red drums

David Harewood15:57

At night

David Harewood15:59

With a broken shoe

David Harewood16:05

Let's do

David Harewood16:10

You should never hear from

David Harewood16:14

Probably someone

David Harewood16:16

Still winning

David Harewood16:18

Not for you!

Presenter16:20

Tom Waits and $29. David Harewood, you graduated from Rada in 1987 and a couple of years later, when you were 23, you experienced a psychotic episode. Just before you became ill, you were performing in a politically charged play about race. Talk me through what happened as you remember it, because I know you don't remember all of it.

David Harewood16:42

There was somebody in the company who was really difficult to work with. An an elder actress who was

David Harewood16:49

Being a bit touchy-feely, and I just didn't know how to handle it. So I sort of started drinking quite heavily.

David Harewood16:58

Self-medicating basically to get myself on stage, I'd have to be drunk.

David Harewood17:04

And smoking a lot of weed, and um because I was unstable, I think it was actually doing me more harm than good.

Presenter17:11

And then you got the part of Sloane in the Joe Orton play, entertaining Mr Sloane at the Derby Playhouse. Now most of the reviews were very positive, but I think there was one in particular that wasn't very complimentary, was it?

David Harewood17:24

I read one that was in the in The Voice newspaper, which is a black newspaper.

David Harewood17:29

Really having a go at me saying how dare I play this role?

David Harewood17:32

Sexual deviant who is a kind of murderer.

David Harewood17:37

A killer.

Presenter17:38

So this idea that you were a poor representation of the

David Harewood17:40

Who are representing in the community and said

David Harewood17:45

kind of encouraged members of the community to walk out.

David Harewood17:48

And throughout the rest of the run, it just kept happening. People would just get up and walk out. Black people.

David Harewood17:55

That started to unnerve me and I

David Harewood17:58

There's a sense that I was being rejected. I call back the white space, I was rejected by the black space as well. So I was just it started becoming too much.

Presenter18:07

After the run finished, you came back to London and things started to unravel. What was going wrong?

David Harewood18:14

Uh

Presenter18:14

That's gonna f

David Harewood18:14

Find it to sort of

David Harewood18:16

had these moments of blackouts. You know, I'd suddenly wake up at three o'clock in the morning and I'd be outside Euston station in the in the middle of the night and I'd go, What on earth am I doing here? I better go home I'd start walking home, black out and I'd wake up in Camden at

David Harewood18:31

It's four o'clock in the afternoon. What am I doing here? I better go home. Start walking home. And then I'd. I was in and out of sort of reality. It was bizarre and scary, ethereal. And specifically the moment the voices started speaking to me in my head, Martin Luther King's voice appeared in my head, literally independent of. I was looking around the room going, where's that voice coming from?

David Harewood18:56

And there was this big booming American voice inside my head explaining what I had to do. And I'll never forget that.

Presenter19:05

Many years later, you had the opportunity to read your medical records for the first time. What did you find out about your behaviour and your experiences from reading them?

David Harewood19:17

Before I was sectioned I was screaming I have to save the boy

David Harewood19:21

I have to save the boy screaming at the top of my voice.

David Harewood19:25

Just as seven policemen sat on me and launched themselves on me and I was given an emergency

David Harewood19:31

Tranquilizer, uh to knock me out.

Presenter19:34

You were sectioned twice in quick succession, but eventually you came out of hospital and you went to live with your mother. She weaned you off your medication, she got you better and you started working again.

David Harewood19:47

I think I'm very lucky that I'm one of the 15% of people who have.

David Harewood19:51

uh psychotic breakdown who don't need further medication.

David Harewood19:56

Most people who suffer breakdowns will remain on some form of medication.

David Harewood20:02

But um I've never experienced anything again like that.

Presenter20:08

Let's have some more music. It's number five. What are we going to hear, David, and why?

David Harewood20:13

I was in the West End doing a show about Martin Luther King, funnily enough.

David Harewood20:19

Having had him speak to me in my height of my breakdown, and at the first night party, the producers had bought all these miniature bottles of champagne and

David Harewood20:29

There was hardly anybody at the party. I didn't want you. There were lots of lots of empty tables at this party. And so me and my mates nicked loads of these.

David Harewood20:37

Let me

David Harewood20:39

At least fifty bottles. We had pockets full of these little bottles of champagne. And the next day we opened the f came we got out of bed.

David Harewood20:47

12 o'clock in midday, opened the fridge to get breakfast, and it was just full of champagne. And we just went.

Speaker 120:53

And we just went.

David Harewood20:54

Champagne for my friends! So we literally drank the entire all day.

David Harewood21:00

Had just the best day, and at one point, this song came on.

David Harewood21:07

And it was so hot and we were in the garden, it was dancing, and it was just beautiful. And it just really reminds me of a new beginning. And it's the chimes. Still haven't found what I'm looking for, but every time it starts, I just remember that day.

David Harewood21:22

And run to the feet.

David Harewood21:27

Only

Speaker 121:28

Yeah.

Speaker 121:29

With you.

Speaker 121:32

I've been with you.

Speaker 121:38

I

David Harewood21:41

I have grown.

David Harewood21:44

I have got peace to the war.

Presenter21:52

The chimes and I still haven't found what I'm looking for. David Harewood, despite the trauma that you went through, you do say the experience has made you a stronger person. How did it change you?

David Harewood22:05

It has made me stronger.

David Harewood22:06

and more rounded and more understanding.

David Harewood22:11

And

David Harewood22:12

Made me more complete.

David Harewood22:14

You know, my therapist said something very

David Harewood22:17

poignant and he he sometimes he would say to me,

David Harewood22:22

You said you have to save the boy.

David Harewood22:24

What would you do now? And, you know, if you saw that boy, and I'd say, well, I'd give him a hug.

David Harewood22:29

Nold his hand.

David Harewood22:31

Somewhere in my mixed up, confused mind I knew I had to get back.

David Harewood22:38

to that little black boy.

David Harewood22:41

that I'd lost.

Presenter22:43

Did you ever get to talk to your dad about what you went through, what you both went through?

David Harewood22:47

Unfortunately not. No. Um

David Harewood22:50

You know, my career started sort of taking off.

David Harewood22:54

And I regret not having the ab ability to sit down and talk to my dad about

David Harewood22:58

Well, it happened to both of us. But by that time, by the time I kind of got back from the States,

David Harewood23:03

He was in the early stages of dementia.

David Harewood23:06

And eventually he passed away.

Speaker 323:08

But you've said your book is a letter to him in a lot of ways.

David Harewood23:11

Yeah.

David Harewood23:12

It is why I have respect for that generation, Windrush generation.

David Harewood23:16

Who?

David Harewood23:17

Literally sailed halfway around the world.

David Harewood23:19

To start a new life.

David Harewood23:22

And

David Harewood23:24

Their experience was anything but.

David Harewood23:27

A joy.

David Harewood23:28

rejection and racism.

David Harewood23:32

So that my book was a sort of appreciation letter, a love letter to my dad for all that he did.

David Harewood23:38

Get through.

David Harewood23:41

Even though costume to a certain extent.

David Harewood23:44

or that he did survive.

Presenter23:46

Let's have some more music, David.

David Harewood23:48

Yeah.

David Harewood23:49

I had a very, very good friend of mine when I was at school, Louis, an Italian guy. He always said to me, You're going to make it.

David Harewood23:56

Yeah, gonna make it He was the only one who was convinced that I was gonna make it.

David Harewood24:00

We used to go to Italy. We used to go to Italy every year and um one year we were in this camp and they

David Harewood24:06

There was a karaoke contest, and Louis said, You've got to go and sing tonight. So I got up and I sang Otis Redding, sitting on the dock of the bay.

David Harewood24:15

And people were sobbing.

David Harewood24:18

And the next night they said, you, let's go. And I had to sing it every single night every single night we were in camp. And I always remember it because Louis unfortunately passed away and as you said, at the start of this programme, I'm down to my last eighty quid.

David Harewood24:36

The day I got homeland, and I said to my wife, My God, I've got the job. And she said, Do you know what day it is today? It's Louis's birthday.

David Harewood24:45

And I got the job a year after he died.

David Harewood24:48

On his birthday, and I thought, you always said I was going to make it, and he was right.

David Harewood24:54

This song words reminds me of him. Sitting in the morning sun.

David Harewood25:00

I'll be sitting in the evening car

David Harewood25:05

Watching the ships rolling

David Harewood25:09

Then I watch him roll away again.

David Harewood25:13

Yeah.

David Harewood25:14

I'm sitting on a dock of bay

David Harewood25:18

Watching the tide roll away

David Harewood25:23

It's sitting on a block of bay

David Harewood25:27

Waste the time

David Harewood25:29

Uh

Presenter25:31

Otis Reading and Sitting on the Dock of the Bay.

Presenter25:35

David Hayward, in twenty eleven, you were cast as the CIA director David Estes in the television series Homeland alongside Damian Lewis and Claire Daines, and you've described your time in America and the show as life changing for you. Why?

David Harewood25:49

I found a

David Harewood25:51

strength and acknowledgement there in my career as a black British actor that I'd never had before.

David Harewood25:58

A Shakespearean black actor? Oh my God. Oh, my God. It was they just loved us and were they they were really appreciative of what we could do and you know, I spent nine years, ten years in in the States and

David Harewood26:12

It's been disappointing coming back here, the sort of roles that I've been.

David Harewood26:16

uh coming my way.

Presenter26:17

More recently, even after all of that success.

David Harewood26:19

Cone go

Presenter26:20

Yeah.

David Harewood26:21

I would have done that maybe ten years ago.

David Harewood26:23

But not now.

David Harewood26:24

and the roles that I get

David Harewood26:26

Offered an

David Harewood26:28

The roles that I'm that are really exciting come from America.

Presenter26:31

Is that to do with colour or is that just acting in the UK?

David Harewood26:36

It's strange, you know, it almost feels like I'm limited by other people's perceptions of what I can be.

David Harewood26:42

Whereas in America I'm not. I can be the head of the CIA.

David Harewood26:45

I can be

David Harewood26:47

you know a president

David Harewood26:49

Whereas

David Harewood26:50

I think they'd

David Harewood26:51

be nervous about casting a bl a black Prime Minister.

David Harewood26:55

They were nervous when I played.

David Harewood26:57

Fry Tuck.

David Harewood26:59

In Robin Hood, there was

Presenter27:00

The BB

David Harewood27:00

But they were nervous about it.

Presenter27:00

See from that many years ago.

David Harewood27:05

Can we do this? Is it allowed? Whereas in America they go, Yeah, Sherlock Holmes, let's make Watson an Asian woman.

David Harewood27:12

In 24, they made the president black even before there was a black president. There's a sort of can-do.

David Harewood27:17

Elements to American casting and drama.

David Harewood27:20

Whereas I always sometimes I th I I feel here there's a hesitancy to do that.

Presenter27:24

And what do you think about the next generation who are helping to shape the stories that we tell? John Boyeger's producing, Michaela Cole, of course, is a brilliant writer as well as an actor.

David Harewood27:32

Cool.

David Harewood27:33

Painter as well as an actor. Really inspired by them. They keep me going. You know, we've maybe just pushed the door open. They've kicked it right open.

Presenter27:42

It's great to see

David Harewood27:42

The

Presenter27:43

Okay David, it's time for your penultimate disc. What's it gonna be and why are you taking it to the island?

David Harewood27:49

I was in Houston and I bought this bike and I had this a pair of arms and I the sun was setting and I was riding home on this big cruiser bik really one of those cr big cruiser bikes, really low rider bikes.

David Harewood28:02

And it was D'Angelo cruising. And that's exactly what I was doing. Cruising.

David Harewood28:08

through downtown Black America and just feeling, oh, 110%, just feeling seen, acknowledged, supported and alive.

David Harewood28:21

Baby, let's cruise.

David Harewood28:25

From here

David Harewood28:32

Don't be confused, me

Speaker 128:34

Uh

David Harewood28:35

Who would

David Harewood28:37

Is clean green.

David Harewood28:42

And if you want it, you get it forever.

David Harewood28:49

Just for the ones that stay

Presenter28:52

D'Angelo and Cruising.

Presenter28:55

So David Harewood, you've said that coming to terms with your past is an ongoing process for you. How do you feel about where you are with that today?

David Harewood29:05

There's moments when I still think

David Harewood29:07

I don't feel

David Harewood29:09

I thought I thought it's sad that I'd never bought an England shirt.

David Harewood29:13

I bought a Brazil shirt. I bought an Italy shirt.

David Harewood29:16

I'd never bought an England shirt, and worn it with pride. I very nearly did before the last

David Harewood29:22

The Euros very nearly did.

David Harewood29:25

But then the reaction afterwards reminded me why I don't.

David Harewood29:29

Because that's that rejection again.

Presenter29:32

Well, let me ask you this, because I am about to send you away to the island and you've spent a lot of time, particularly over the past few years and today, talking about the idea of belonging where you belong and home. So

Speaker 129:43

Yeah.

David Harewood29:44

Uh

Presenter29:46

What are you going to miss, because maybe that's the closest thing, when you're on your island.

Presenter29:51

What will you miss? What's home for you?

David Harewood29:53

Home is where I

David Harewood29:55

As they say, lay my hat. And.

David Harewood29:58

I've been very

David Harewood30:00

comfortable in North America the last

David Harewood30:03

Couple of years. Very comfortable.

David Harewood30:06

And

David Harewood30:07

A lot of these anxieties have only arisen since I've come back. You know, I sort of yearn to get back over there.

David Harewood30:14

And then I'll, you know, miss the family and miss my friends and want to get back here. So I'm constantly shifting.

David Harewood30:21

my notion of home. I think I probably would miss family.

David Harewood30:26

But I'm looking forward to going to my island. I've got all my great music.

David Harewood30:30

And my memories?

Presenter30:31

Well, tranquillity and some time alone with your record collection awaits. But before we get there, one more disc, David, for you to introduce.

David Harewood30:38

Thank you.

Presenter30:39

What's it gonna be?

David Harewood30:40

Oh man, this so this the opening moments of this song are just so evocative of summer.

David Harewood30:48

You know, on my desert island, I want to be chilling in the day, dancing at night. And this will is very evocative of.

David Harewood30:56

Fun times, and it's Rufus and Shaka Khan ain't no buddy.

Speaker 131:03

For you, it's been so long. I know just what I would do when I heard your song. Fill my heart with this. Freedom. Uh

David Harewood31:16

I could not resist, I needed someone. And now we're flying through the spars. I hope this night lasts forever.

Presenter31:31

Rufus and Chaka Khan and Ain't No Bodies.

David Harewood31:34

That is just wonderful.

Presenter31:35

Just

Presenter31:37

Well, I'm not surprised you're looking forward to the island, and it's time for you to head there, David Harewood. I am giving you the books to take with you, of course, as well as your discs: the Bible, the complete works of Shakespeare, and one other book of your choice. What would you like?

David Harewood31:50

Neil Gaiman's The Sandman. I've never actually read it, but I s I I was voicing one of the characters called Destruction. And rather than Destruction just being about breaking things apart, is it more about creation?

David Harewood32:04

And changing new things and making things anew. Just a wonderful.

David Harewood32:09

embodiment of life.

Presenter32:11

Fantastic, it's yours. You can also have a luxury item. What would you like?

David Harewood32:15

My luxury item is going to be a fold-out disco light-up dance floor.

David Harewood32:20

Bang on the Shaka Khan, the crew's in. I might try and brew some sort of cocoanut rum, sipping a fe you know, a whole leaf colada and uh and and sort of and sort of dancing.

Presenter32:33

Oh, I mean, I'm even going to throw in a smoke machine just because that was so vivid. I feel like I was there with you. And finally, which one track of the eight that you've shared with us today would you save from the waves if you had to?

David Harewood32:46

Could've ate nobody.

David Harewood32:48

Purely because it makes you smile, it makes it just like food for the soul.

Presenter32:53

David Howard, thank you very much for letting us hear your Desert Island discs.

David Harewood32:57

Thank you.

Presenter33:12

I hope you enjoyed my conversation with David. He's going to enjoy himself listening to Chuck Akan and sipping on a leaf colada. We've cast away many actors before him, including Tom Hanks, WooBy Goldberg, and Lauren Bacall. David's homeland co-star Damian Lewis is there too, and you can find all of those episodes in our Desert Island Discs programme archive and through BBC Sounds. The studio manager for today's programme was John Boland, the assistant producer was Christine Pavlovsky, and the producer was Paula McGinley. Next time, my guest will be the writer and broadcaster John Ronson. I do hope you'll join us.

Speaker 133:54

Hi, I'm Andy Oliver and I'd like to tell you all about my Radio 4 series One Dish.

Speaker 134:01

It's all about why you love that one dish, the one that you could eat over and over again without ever getting tired of it.

Speaker 134:09

Each week, a very special guest will bring their favourite food to my table and will be unpacking the history of it. And food psychologist Kimberly Wilson is on hand to talk us through the science bit.

Speaker 134:21

What food reminds you of your child? What's your favourite place to go for dinner? What do you have for Sunday lunch? What's your favourite dessert? You say planten or planting? What food would you take with you to a desert island? What's your favourite type of chilli oil? What do you have for breakfast? What's the best past? What's the one thing you look for? So if you're the sort of person who's already planning what you're having for lunch while you're eating breakfast, then this podcast is going to be right up your street.

Speaker 134:45

That's One Dish with Me Andy Oliver. Listen now on BBC Sounds.