Barbara Windsor

Presenter0:00

This download is the only extract the BBC has of this edition.

Barbara Windsor0:04

of Desert Island Discs, the presenter was Roy Plumley.

Presenter0:08

What part of London do you come from, Bubba?

Barbara Windsor0:10

At the east end.

Presenter0:11

Where?

Barbara Windsor0:12

Oh sure did. You'd have never have guessed the jiff.

Presenter0:15

Any show business tradition in the family?

Barbara Windsor0:17

Uh no. Uh my grandfather was a docker, but in his spare time he did a bit of a music hall and uh my father was a Charleston champion.

Presenter0:25

Professional?

Barbara Windsor0:26

No amateur.

Presenter0:27

How did it all start with you? What was your first contact with show business?

Barbara Windsor0:31

Well, it has to go back. I mean, when I was six, I was evacuated to Blackport and sent to a local dancing school.

Presenter0:36

Yeah.

Barbara Windsor0:38

And uh when I came back to London, there was a little label and a letter saying to my mum.

Barbara Windsor0:43

Uh this is from the people who Barbara was staying with. You must let her carry on dancing because she adores it. She's a proper show off. So my mother thought, Oh, that's smashing you know. And uh that's it. So I went to a local dancing school from the time I was six to twelve.

Presenter0:58

Yes, and you had displays every year.

Barbara Windsor1:00

That's right, yes.

Presenter1:01

What we'll call.

Barbara Windsor1:03

Do you know how yeolitis?

Presenter1:05

That's lovely, isn't it?

Barbara Windsor1:05

That's lovely, isn't it?

Presenter1:06

Yeah.

Barbara Windsor1:07

And uh when I was twelve

Barbara Windsor1:09

Mammy got a few quid together, and uh sent me to Ada Foster's.

Presenter1:13

Oh, yes, the theatre school.

Barbara Windsor1:15

Yes. She had been advised, I must tell you this, Roy, to get rid of my cockney accent, you know, because they said she'll never get on with that accent.

Presenter1:22

Of course, did a great job.

Barbara Windsor1:24

To Holly, I know.

Presenter1:25

And what was your first professional appearance, then?

Barbara Windsor1:28

At Golders Green in Sleeping Beauty is one of the Ada Foster babes.

Presenter1:32

Splendid.

Barbara Windsor1:33

Hmm.

Presenter1:33

And after that?

Barbara Windsor1:35

After that

Barbara Windsor1:36

Well, I was very fortunate, um, because it

Barbara Windsor1:40

You know, at the time it was all sort of English roses and you had to speak very s posh and that. But I got into an American show where they wanted little girls with very loud voices called Love from Judy.

Presenter1:51

Oh yes, musical version of Daddy Long.

Barbara Windsor1:52

That's right, yes. And I was in that for two and a half years. I went in with white socks and flat shoes and came out teetering on high heels and paint.

Presenter2:00

Yeah.

Barbara Windsor2:01

Knew it all, didn't I, I thought.

Presenter2:04

And

Barbara Windsor2:05

I'm from there.

Presenter2:06

Yeah.

Barbara Windsor2:07

Oh, then it all started the trouble, didn't it? Because um I'd got rather plump and nothing was in the right place, you know.

Barbara Windsor2:15

and I didn't get any work for some time, so I went to work in a shoe shop because I had no trade behind me, being that I'd left school so early. I couldn't tithe or do shorthand or bookkeeping, the usual things. So I went to work in a shoe shop, which I thoroughly enjoyed. I used to audition on my Thursday afternoons off.

Presenter2:31

Yes, every Thursday.

Barbara Windsor2:31

Yeah.

Barbara Windsor2:32

Oh yeah, oh I went for umpteen auditions and then I

Barbara Windsor2:38

I don't know, I got to about eighty. I dec I thought this is the last one I'm going for. And there was a queue at the Watergate Review. Remember the Watergate Review? Yes, I'm back in Lump Street.

Presenter2:45

Little theatre club.

Barbara Windsor2:47

And there was a great long queue, hundreds of girls queuing up for this audition, and I arrived, and every girl was singing I heard a Robin singing.

Barbara Windsor2:55

And I walked on and sang, Sunnyside the Street.

Barbara Windsor2:59

And I got through the whole chorus, which was quite amazing in those days. I used to get one line out and they'd say, Thank you, Miss Windsor, we'll let you know And um anyway I got through the whole chorus and it was lovely Peter Myers who said Oh, how refreshing all those awful girls seeing I heard of Robin singing.

Presenter3:13

Yeah.

Barbara Windsor3:14

And he said to me, Could I dance? I said, A bit and could I do the Charleston? which I could because of me dad.

Barbara Windsor3:21

And, um, he said, Oh, I think it's lovely.

Presenter3:23

Mm-hmm.

Barbara Windsor3:24

And I stayed with that show for six months.

Presenter3:26

So, six months at the Watergate, things were going pretty well.

Barbara Windsor3:30

Nah.

Barbara Windsor3:31

I was out of work again. I mean, it still wasn't happening really for me, you know.

Presenter3:33

However,

Presenter3:35

Back in the show shop.

Barbara Windsor3:36

Yes, I used to go backwards and forwards, you see.

Presenter3:38

Hmm.

Barbara Windsor3:39

And then I think it I really made up my mind. I thought, well, it's not going to go my way.

Barbara Windsor3:45

And uh suddenly um I got a phone call from Brian Blackburn who said I'm putting on a review at a club.

Barbara Windsor3:52

called Winston's. I'd like you to be in it.

Barbara Windsor3:55

And I was there on and off for five years and it was a marvellous experience because I had to do everything. I had to play schoolgirls, dress up as dinodoors, geniola, brigida, you know, because they were the sex bombs at that time and

Presenter4:04

Because they were the

Presenter4:06

Doing impressions

Barbara Windsor4:06

Don't you improve?

Barbara Windsor4:07

Yes, everything and in drag.

Presenter4:10

Everything you say.

Barbara Windsor4:10

Everything was there. And it it and and it was it it was smashing for me to do that.

Presenter4:14

You were fighting for West End recognition, but your big opportunity came back in the East End.

Barbara Windsor4:16

Number 12.

Barbara Windsor4:20

Yes, with things ain't what they used to be.

Presenter4:22

How did that come about?

Barbara Windsor4:23

Believe it or not, I didn't find out till a couple of years ago and um it was through Bernie Winters. Um Lionel Bart was auditioning with Joan Littlewood. Things ain't what they used to be.

Presenter4:33

This is going to be done at Stratford East.

Barbara Windsor4:35

Stratford East, that's right, yes. And um, Bernie Winter said, Well, there's a little funny girl at the studio I was making too hot to handle at the time.

Barbara Windsor4:43

And he said, Why didn't you call Barbara Windsor? Why don't you get her down here and audition for you?

Barbara Windsor4:47

And that's how I got to audition for things in what they used to be

Presenter4:50

How long did things run?

Barbara Windsor4:52

Oh, two and a half years.

Presenter4:53

Ah

Barbara Windsor4:53

I mean when I get the hits they're fantastic.

Presenter4:53

Uh

Barbara Windsor4:56

But it's all those awful flops in between.

Presenter4:59

What did things lead to, as far as you were concerned?

Barbara Windsor5:02

Oh, s super things uh the rag trade.

Presenter5:05

The T V series.

Barbara Windsor5:06

Yes, the B B C television series.

Presenter5:09

Yeah.

Barbara Windsor5:10

Which made me very commercial. I mean, you can do your shows, but how many people see your night? Six hundred, but you do one night and eighty million people watch you. And that led to

Presenter5:18

Mm-hmm.

Barbara Windsor5:20

But sparrows can't see.

Presenter5:21

The film.

Barbara Windsor5:22

Mm-hmm.

Presenter5:22

This was Joan Littlewood again.

Barbara Windsor5:24

Yes, it was her first attempt at film, as you say, and um she said to me uh that she was doing this film Spanish Councillor, which I couldn't understand because it wasn't a successful stage show. And um she said to me, I want you to play a married lady with two children I said, Oh, God, I can't do that She said, Oh, yes, you can and

Barbara Windsor5:44

Anyway, I ended up by doing it. It was smashing.

Presenter5:46

He went to the United States to promote that film, didn't you?

Barbara Windsor5:48

Oh, that was outrageous actually,'cause I arrived there and they stuck subtitles on the bottom.

Presenter5:54

What?

Barbara Windsor5:55

Well, th I mean, there was a lot of cockney slang, you see, and they assumed that nobody would understand what we were talking about.

Presenter6:01

It was shown as a foreign film, and it was

Barbara Windsor6:03

Practically, yes. But they put it in a classic sort of cinema, you see. And so you didn't get your average New Yorkers go.

Presenter6:04

Would they put it?

Presenter6:06

You see.

Barbara Windsor6:10

to see it. And th there was a ballot. You had to put your voting, whether yes or no, you like the subtitles, and the majority of people said no, and they didn't need the subtitles because we were such animated performers that they got it all.

Presenter6:24

Then what, you came back and worked for John Littlewood again?

Presenter6:27

We as I

Barbara Windsor6:27

Well, yes, I I I got back and oh, what a lovely war had been running here and then it was going to Broadway and she said, uh, would I like to do it? And uh, once again I said no. You see, I I always think I'm so limited in what I

Barbara Windsor6:41

I can do.

Barbara Windsor6:43

She said, Why? And I said, Because it's a director's piece.

Barbara Windsor6:47

I wouldn't have a chance to shine in that show and I wanted to go on Broadway and shine really. And she said, Oh, you've become boring with your rag trades and all the rest of it and she got me at it. So I ended up by going to Broadway.

Presenter6:58

How long did it run?

Barbara Windsor7:00

Four and a half months, which is pretty good going.

Presenter7:02

We

Barbara Windsor7:02

We played opposite Hallo Dolly.

Barbara Windsor7:04

And uh Golden Boy. We used to get the overflow from Hello Dolly. If they couldn't get into Hello Dolly, they'd try Golden Boy. If they couldn't get into Golden Boy, they'd try us.

Presenter7:12

I want it.

Barbara Windsor7:12

And be shocked.

Presenter7:15

Then you came back and you were leading lady in a very big musical industry.

Barbara Windsor7:19

Ah

Presenter7:21

And the bigger they are

Barbara Windsor7:22

Yes, but dias it's still'cause I left Broadway and said I must go back to London.

Barbara Windsor7:28

You know, because I'm starring in a new musical. Lionel Barr's written the music, Joan Little is going to direct, Oliver Messel's doing the sets, Paddy Stone is doing the choreography, called Twang, you see.

Barbara Windsor7:38

Did I little but no?

Presenter7:39

Yes, it was a strange enterprise, so big, so costly.

Barbara Windsor7:42

Mm, mmm, what went wrong?

Presenter7:43

What went wrong? What was the trouble?

Barbara Windsor7:45

Well, I mean, it we can talk about it now at the time it was awful. I mean, we all thought it would be super to get together, all the mates and things ain't what they used to be, and do another show together, but we'd forgotten we'd all changed. You know, I wanted to be name above the title, so did Li, so did Joan, you see. And uh, it was none of your sort of dozen dirty props and a few bum actors. It was uh we'd all changed.

Presenter8:08

We don't

Presenter8:10

Big stuff.

Barbara Windsor8:10

Yes, and I don't think anybody really got together.

Presenter8:14

Yes, and after that you did a very successful musical with Danny Larue.

Barbara Windsor8:17

Oh, yes, that was most fortunate, because I was terribly worried after twang.

Barbara Windsor8:23

And uh within three weeks Danny had phoned me up and

Barbara Windsor8:26

With this musical Call Comes Fire With Me, which was a very big success.

Presenter8:31

And of course your carry on films. How many of those have you done?

Barbara Windsor8:34

Oh, I've only done four.

Barbara Windsor8:36

People always think I've done far more, only because

Barbara Windsor8:39

What they usually show.

Barbara Windsor8:40

some part of my body on the posters.

Presenter8:44

See you.

Barbara Windsor8:45

Mm-hmm.

Presenter8:46

Now bring the story up to date. You're playing Marley Lloyd.

Barbara Windsor8:49

Yes, and sing a root song.

Presenter8:52

Yes. You'll try it out at Greenwich first.

Barbara Windsor8:53

Yes, and it was a lovely success there and uh

Presenter8:56

How are you in the West End?

Barbara Windsor8:57

Yeah, it's all being lovely and super.

Presenter9:00

Has your career worked out more or less the way you wanted it to?

Barbara Windsor9:03

Much better than I ever imagined, actually.

Presenter9:07

What's your ambition if the telephone rang tonight and said, when you're free?

Presenter9:11

What would you like that offer to be?

Barbara Windsor9:14

Well

Barbara Windsor9:15

To do a film in Hollywood.

Presenter9:17

That would be smashing, wouldn't it? What sort of film? Dramatic film, musical film, comedy film?

Barbara Windsor9:21

No super comedy with somebody like Jack Lemmon.