Colonel Lucy Giles

Colonel Lucy Giles0:01

BBC Sounds, Music, Radio, Podcast.

Presenter0:04

Hello, I'm Lauren Laverne and this is the Desert Island Discs Podcast. Every week I ask my guests to choose the eight tracks, book and luxury they'd want to take with them if they were cast away to a desert island. For rights reasons, the music is shorter than the original broadcast. I hope you enjoy listening.

Presenter0:41

My castaway this week is Colonel Lucy Giles. In 2015, she made history when she became the first woman to command a college at the Royal Military Academy, Sandhurst. Its motto, serve to lead, could have been written with her in mind. By the age of 25, she was commanding 72 men on operations in Bosnia. She has served in over 20 countries, including Iraq, Afghanistan and Northern Ireland, excelling in a field that is 90% male. Her extraordinary success wasn't easy to predict. Her family had no military connections and at school, the career's advice included becoming a hairdresser. Now, as a senior female officer in the British Army, an institution which she describes as evolving in its attitudes, she says, I hope I can act as some kind of role model for some of the soldiers and officers out there, showing you can be a mom, you can marry a person that has a busy job, and you can try and hold down a job yourself as well. If that's role modelling, I embrace it. Colonel Lucy Giles, welcome to Desert Island Discs.

Colonel Lucy Giles1:43

Thank you. It's absolutely fantastic to be here.

Presenter1:46

So Lucy, you've had a long career in the Army and you're currently President of the Army Officer Selection Board. That's another role that you are the first woman to hold. What qualities do you look for in an officer?

Colonel Lucy Giles1:56

Mental resilience is really important, and the ability to get on with people in your team is also a critical skill. The foundation of our training at Sandhurst is to build upon that. So, we always start with quite intense few weeks where you don't go out of camp, etc., and that's for us to be able to build the teams up together. And also, in terms of physicality, we know we can do a lot of that training at Sandhurst, but we do need to see the building blocks and that people have put in a bit of preparation before they come to our selection.

Speaker 12:18

Uh

Colonel Lucy Giles2:30

Yeah.

Presenter2:30

Tell me a little bit more about that Sandhurst motto: serve to lead. What does it mean to you?

Presenter2:35

Yeah.

Colonel Lucy Giles2:35

It's the compass point that guides us, I think, particularly in the officer corps. It's written on the front of the officer's mess at Sandhurst. It's about selfless commitment. It's about looking after your soldiers, leading by example, leading from the front, ultimately to achieve the goals that you set yourself and where you're deployed on operations. It's not just about a set of words and a phrase, you've got to live that, you know. So you have to be prepared to embark in this journey, not just because it's a job, but because it's a way of life, and you have to really believe it and be authentic with it, I think.

Speaker 13:02

Uh

Presenter3:02

Uh

Presenter3:12

Stress is a fact of life in a job like yours, isn't it? Is music something that has helped you manage that through the years?

Colonel Lucy Giles3:19

I think music has been a great distressor, particularly when you're in operations. I remember sitting out in the sun outside my Cori Mec in my early tours in Bosnia, and it just took you away from what you were doing on a day-to-day business. Some of it was exciting, some of it was a real eye-opener, particularly for someone like me who was quite new to the army at that stage. So it can take you back to a place that triggers lots of memories, happy and sometimes a little bit sad.

Presenter3:41

That's

Colonel Lucy Giles3:49

It's important to feed that emotional part of you because that's the thing that keeps us human.

Presenter3:54

Well, Lucy, let's get stuck into the discs then, starting with your first. Tell us about this one.

Colonel Lucy Giles3:59

I used this particular song, The Day That Never Comes from Metallica, to describe some of the ethical decision-making that you could face as a leader when you're up against it and when you're perhaps faced with difficult decisions to make. So it's an emotional roller coaster of a song and of a story, and that's why I like it.

Speaker 24:22

Bushy cross that line

Speaker 14:27

Be down this

Speaker 24:27

Time

Speaker 24:30

Hiding yourself, crawling yourself, you'll have your time.

Speaker 24:38

God only stemped

Speaker 24:42

Take it back one thing Yeah.

Speaker 14:45

Uh

Speaker 14:46

I'll end this day by squat up on the

Presenter4:52

Metallica and The Day That Never Comes. So leadership then, Lucy Giles, that track represents that to you, and there are a lot of theories about it. How on earth do you go about teaching it?

Colonel Lucy Giles5:04

I think we try and keep it as simple as it possibly can be. What leaders are, what their values are, what's important to them, how leaders behave is perhaps the biggest change we've made in terms of articulating what we mean in the Army and that was launching the Leadership Code in 2015 by the change.

Presenter5:20

And what was the change there?

Colonel Lucy Giles5:22

Well, it really focused in on not just having a set of attributes, a list of acronyms that you can then use to remind yourself that you've got to be you know have trust and integrity. It's about bringing that to life. It's about behaving in a way that extols the values.

Presenter5:39

And of course you're living those values yourself. What sort of leader are you, and how would you describe your leadership style?

Colonel Lucy Giles5:46

I don't think I would define leadership in one simple sentence or say that I am a leader and describe myself as X, Y and Z. I think the important thing that you must be, however, in a leadership role is you've got to be true to yourself and you've got to be authentic. Because if you're not, people are never going to believe what you're saying, trust you, follow you. And when the chips are down and when you're having to ask that extra bit from people, they will be less inclined to do it. Lucy, it's time for disc number two. Tell us what we're

Presenter6:18

We're going to hear next and why you're taking it with you today.

Colonel Lucy Giles6:21

I met my husband Nick in 1991, and in meeting Nick, he sort of changed my musical taste. And I suppose this is a bit of an example of how that music changed. And when I started Sandhurst in January 1992, the first night I was sitting there with one of my tapes that Nick had made me playing songs like this with my mate Jane Arrington and Amanda Hussell and they've been friends ever since but I think I've probably changed their cultural tastes as well.

Colonel Lucy Giles6:54

But it's a heart-shaped box in Nirvana.

Speaker 26:57

She has me like a pisces well I am weak.

Speaker 27:08

I've been looked inside your heart shaped but for weeks

Speaker 27:17

I've been drawing to your magnet trap

Speaker 27:27

I wish I could

Presenter7:29

Nirvana and Heart Shaped Box. So Colonel Lucy Giles, you're the eldest of four born in Somerset. Is that where you first forged your leadership skills then as a big sister?

Colonel Lucy Giles7:39

Well, probably, although I should think my siblings probably saw it m more as um being a bit bossy.

Colonel Lucy Giles7:46

I had a I think a very happy childhood when I look back. I used to help dad out in the garden and with the horses.

Presenter7:54

So, your dad was the village vet and he was tending to a lot of local farm animals. And also, when you say horses, I mean, they were big animals that he had.

Colonel Lucy Giles8:01

They were shyer horses, so at one stage I think Dandy at 18 hands high was one of the biggest horses in the country at the time.

Presenter8:09

Yeah.

Speaker 18:09

Uh

Colonel Lucy Giles8:11

I look back now and I can't believe that my parents let me do it. But I'd be wandering in and amongst the legs of this gentle giant and help plait the tail and I was able to vault on to him just about. But there was always companion horses, so which are really horses that I think dad had saved from being put elsewhere because they were broken. And so I ended up, along with my sister actually at the time, we used to do a bit of riding and mucking about with the horses as we say. And you would accompany your dad when he'd go on call-outs as a vet? I do recall going out with him on one occasion when I was 12 or 13. And we went to a farm and all these ewes that were pregnant were dying and nobody could work out what was happening. And it was an immediate post-mortem, which was a bit new for me to see that kind of thing going on. And then I watched my dad slowly work out what had happened. And because they'd moved from one type of grazing to another, they were deficient in some magnesium it was. And dad got hold of some magnesium, injected one of the ewes, and she immediately went from on her knees up and chewing away and quite happy as Larry. It was fantastic to watch and be part of.

Presenter9:23

So you were passionate about horses as a girl. Did you consider following in your dad's footsteps and working with animals?

Colonel Lucy Giles9:30

Do you know, I'd have loved to have done that because we were always surrounded by dogs and things coming in, you know, whether it be a three-legged lamb or a

Colonel Lucy Giles9:38

Broken fox or a badger at the bottom of the garden. I just didn't have the application, I think, academically to reach the standard that you needed to have. I think. What are we going to hear next? It's disc number three. It was my music teacher that was a real influence on me. So, Mrs. Dummett used to bring us all into the class and play us things like Dark Side of the Moon or the latest Andrew Lloyd Webber musical. She got us to do things like be in the choir or orchestra and stand up, and it instilled a lot more confidence, I think, in myself and my friendship group. She would be taking us up to London along with some of the other teachers. We hadn't been to London, and to go and see these amazingly produced stage musical, and you could just lose yourself in that world for a bit. And I just loved it. This is linked into that experience when I was younger. It's a particular excerpt from Jesus Christ Superstar. It's a short piece, but it's one I love, and it's Pilot's Dream.

Speaker 210:41

I met a Galilee

Speaker 210:45

A most amazing man.

Speaker 210:49

He had that look.

Speaker 210:50

You're very rarely fine.

Speaker 210:55

The haunting hunted kind

Speaker 211:00

I asked him to say what it happened, how it all began.

Speaker 211:09

I asked again.

Speaker 211:11

Never said a word.

Presenter11:13

Uh

Presenter11:14

Pilot's Dream from Jesus Christ Superstar, sung by Barry Dennon. Words and music by Tim Rice and Andrew Lloyd Webber, taking you back, Colonel Lucy Giles, to your school music and drama loving days.

Colonel Lucy Giles11:25

Singing and doing drama then stuck with me even through the army. So, in one of my postings, I did stage musical stuff and I was always part of the production or direction team. And I have been known to do a bit of a turn on the commissioning ball as well. So, that's getting up on stage at the big do. Yeah, and they weren't expecting their college commander to be doing that, that's for sure. Do you have a signature performance piece? Well, it could be a bit of Sweet Child of Mine, although Mustang Sally can take an appearance as well. Wow. Yeah.

Presenter11:55

So let's go back a little bit. You went to study biological sciences at the University of Exeter, and while you were there, you got involved in the University Officers' Training Corps. What kind of things?

Colonel Lucy Giles12:06

We doing It was a couple of friends that were in the Hall of Residence that said, Why don't you come along for a selection weekend? And I thought, I have no idea what you mean by that. They said, Oh, come on, it'll be good fun and I thought, All right. Anyway, I found that I could boss people about and get away with it.

Colonel Lucy Giles12:22

But also I mentioned that one of the best things we can do in the armed services is challenge people, and that's what exactly happened to me. So I was put in situations which I didn't think I would be able to do at heights or in a group of people or whether it was skiing or diving or

Speaker 112:30

Yeah.

Colonel Lucy Giles12:41

It's just so many things that I was able to have the opportunity to experience, and I genuinely met some real friends for life there because I didn't realise it at the time, but that's exactly what bonds you is those shared experiences where you're putting yourself under a bit of pressure. And it wasn't until I left, travelled a bit, had some attachments with the regular army through the OTC, and getting a bit sort of cajoled by my mate Allison, that I ended up deciding to sign up. You needed a little while to kind of get your head around the idea. I think I did because I'd just come straight from my local comprehensive, went to my local sixth form and went straight to a hall of residence at a campus university. I had quite a narrow outlook if I reflect back on it. So I need that broadening and I think the chance of through the OTC of getting away and doing different things I think really helped. It's time for small meeting.

Presenter13:36

Is it the

Colonel Lucy Giles13:36

You see disk number four. What are we gonna Yeah.

Presenter13:38

Yeah.

Colonel Lucy Giles13:38

When I went to university, it was a bit of an awakening, and I met some great friends there that were on my course. But it was the friends I met in the halls of residence I was at in Lopez. We ended up living together for a couple of years after that. So Andy, Miranda, and Katie have been stalwarts and are my closest friends. So this record, it's got to be Love Shack and the B52s.

Speaker 114:24

I got me a car

Speaker 114:27

Well and

Presenter14:31

The B fifty two s and Love Shack. So Colonel Lucy Giles, you finished your biology degree and then spent a year out travelling doing Operation Raleigh before you decided to join the army.

Colonel Lucy Giles14:42

My family were absolutely relieved that I'd finally got myself a proper job and was focussed on something that could offer a career.

Presenter14:51

You were part of the last female-only company to commission at Sandhurst. What was the thinking behind moving to fully mixed commissioning courses?

Colonel Lucy Giles14:58

I think the Army realised that having three separate courses actually, one for graduate men, one for non-graduate men and for mixed graduate, non-graduate women, wasn't really reflective of how we were being employed into the future. So Sandhurst changed in September 1992 to having a system where they would have companies on a regular commissioning course, but they would still have a female platoon.

Colonel Lucy Giles15:29

And it wasn't until 2015 that we made it all completely mixed, and that was on my watch.

Presenter15:33

Was on my

Presenter15:35

Well, are there pros and cons to it being mixed now?

Colonel Lucy Giles15:37

There's only pros, really. Yeah, because we need to train as we fight and we fight as a diverse gang of people.

Colonel Lucy Giles15:44

What we were doing inadvertently wasn't deliberate.

Colonel Lucy Giles15:47

was creating a a misogyny in a way where there was this distrust of the girls were doing a something slightly different to what the boys were doing.

Presenter15:55

Uh

Colonel Lucy Giles15:55

And I think that's unhealthy and it did pervade because I experienced it. What happened? What was the misogyny that you experienced?

Colonel Lucy Giles16:03

It wasn't so much that I was entering an organisation that was deliberately misogynistic. It was because it's just always been done that way. And so the behaviours then tended to match it. So I was teaching in an organisation even 10 years ago where one of my colleagues had never worked with females before, ever.

Colonel Lucy Giles16:24

And it's not because he's not wanting to, it's just he just never had that experience. And it does mean that you you can think that it's a challenge to work with um females when it's a predominantly male environment. But

Colonel Lucy Giles16:37

We're all just getting on with our jobs and wanting to focus on the task in hand. So it's about the prevailing culture, really, and the attitude.

Presenter16:44

That go with that. And I wonder if your own attitudes are changing and have changed over your careers, because I know that you felt you didn't have a lot of female role models.

Colonel Lucy Giles16:44

Geez, yeah.

Presenter16:53

When you were rising through the ranks, but actually, you know, now you have become a role model to young women.

Colonel Lucy Giles16:59

When I started in the Army, about the highest rank that I remember seeing was captains, majors who were females. And now it has massively changed. One thing I'm very proud of within the organization is that it has adapted over the last quarter of a century to be able to

Colonel Lucy Giles17:15

Have more inclusive policies and eternity, maternity opportunities. I did have a bit of a light bulb moment when I started at New College at the Royal Military Academy Sandhurst when I was queuing for my boots and there was a couple of girls in the same queue as me doing the same thing. They were getting some items from the quartermaster stores and one of them nudged the other one and said, I think that's her. And I looked at them and they said, Excuse me, ma'am, are you the new college commander that's just starting? And I said, yes, I am. And they both looked at each other and Smarten said, We're so excited because we've never seen a Lieutenant Colonel before. And I realised then, as do some of my colleagues as well in the similar position, that whether I liked it or not, I had a duty and I had a role to play as somebody that they could be inspired by, perhaps. And so I've made it my mission since then to do the best I can.

Presenter18:12

Currently about eleven percent of military personnel are female Lucy. How do you think a better gender balance would shape the Army of the future? What difference would it make if it was a more diverse organisation?

Colonel Lucy Giles18:23

There is a real role to play if you've got a mixed force.

Colonel Lucy Giles18:28

If you're going into a particular country that requires interface with the local population and you can only interface with half the population because

Colonel Lucy Giles18:38

you're a predominantly male battle group, then that doesn't make sense. It's not operationally effective. So that's the sort of argument that I would put forward as to why we need to be more diverse.

Presenter18:49

Time for disc number five, Lucy. What are we going to hear?

Colonel Lucy Giles18:52

Disc number five is from a band that I've fell in love with in the early nineties when I was based in Abingdon, having done my tour in Germany.

Colonel Lucy Giles19:02

and I became a member of their fan club, and I've still got the badge. And my claim to fame is that I overlapped at Exeter with the lead singer, which is Tom York. But I only found out then that that Nick had been at school with Radiohead in Abingdon.

Colonel Lucy Giles19:20

And not only that, his sister Toi and Justin know them all quite well. And they were very kind to my sister-in-law and Justin when they lost their daughter. And they dedicated one of the albums to her. So not only really fantastic musicians, but they're also extraordinarily good people. And this is Street Spirit by Radiohead.

Speaker 219:42

Rows of houses All bearing down on me I can feel them The hands touching me All these things are two position All these things are wonders who

Presenter20:10

Radiohead and street spirit. Colonel Lucy Giles, one of your first leadership roles entailed being deployed as a troop commander in Bosnia. You were just twenty five years old and had seventy men, one woman and a hundred and ten vehicles under your command. Tell me a little bit about that tour.

Colonel Lucy Giles20:26

To have that responsibility, which of course you just you lap up at the time, but when I look back, it you know it was quite immense. I mean our role was to support the distribution of materiel and kit and equipment and people all across the area of operations. So we were based in split in Croatia and then our logistic runs would be sometimes twelve hours and we've had one that was eighteen hours in the snow, right up to Maglai, Vitez, Gornivikuf, those sort of areas to support the British forces deployment.

Presenter20:59

Yeah.

Presenter21:01

You are in a zone of conflict, of course. How dangerous was it for you all?

Colonel Lucy Giles21:05

Well, we deployed in the October and Christmas was the R and R, so I was meant to be going home for two weeks. And just at that time, one of my soldiers, two of them actually, were held hostage in Sarajevo. And there was nothing I could do about it. I was told to go back home and I went to see one of my team's family to just sort of explain what was going on.

Speaker 121:29

And that

Colonel Lucy Giles21:31

I found that really difficult because I was impotent to do anything. Another incident that happened during that time was that uh a convoy was mortared. So when they came back to camp and and you then saw the damage that was done and you just knew how lucky they were. I mean, I've still got a bit of shrapnel from it, but

Colonel Lucy Giles21:49

It is the presence of mind of our junior NCOs and young soldiers that saved the day on that one.

Colonel Lucy Giles21:54

And that's why the British Army is so strong, because we've got that backbone of experience and resolve at the lowest level.

Colonel Lucy Giles22:02

Okay.

Presenter22:02

hear how how much you care about the people that you're working with and and how closely bonded you are too. But obviously that's a lot to process at just twenty five. I mean these days there's much more emphasis on mental health, but were people adequately helped at the time if they needed it?

Colonel Lucy Giles22:20

I don't think we recognised how much we did need it then. Like a lot of uniformed organisation, a way of sorting things out is getting together socially and dark sense of humour.

Presenter22:32

Hey.

Colonel Lucy Giles22:32

That kind of world that out of context is probably not appropriate, but

Colonel Lucy Giles22:38

That's, I think, how how people manage to deal with some things that were were often pretty hideous.

Presenter22:45

And of course, talking about emotions in a profession which is all about being seen as strong, you know, and as invincible in in a way, I I think

Presenter22:55

For you leading from the front on that issue, is it important to say, yes, I'm human and I've been through some things that have been very difficult too?

Colonel Lucy Giles23:05

It's vital that you you say it how it is, I think. Otherwise h y you're just talking in words and meaningless conceptual ideas. You know, whenever I was doing my um

Colonel Lucy Giles23:18

leadership experience lectures to officer cadets at Sandhurst, I would try and bring it to life with real stories of things I'd experienced and I was very honest where I'd got things right and where I'd got things wrong, so that they can learn and they can take these on board. You met your husband, Nick?

Presenter23:35

quite early on in your Army career, as you mentioned. How easy has it been for both of you to progress in your individual careers, especially with all the travel that that entails?

Colonel Lucy Giles23:46

We've made it work because we both love what we do, we enjoy it, and there's the sort of healthy respect for each other's part in the bigger picture. But we did make a pact sort of early on in our marriage, which was if it all gets a bit too tricky and if either of us are really unhappy, we need to do something about it. And that's been at the back of my mind in particular.

Colonel Lucy Giles24:12

to guide me when I'm having those moments of thinking, is this all worth it? And what are those tipping points? When Nick's been away for long periods and he's been away for three year long tours, there are moments in that where it can be quite tough, you know, when you're left behind.

Colonel Lucy Giles24:31

Can be challenging. Do you worry about each other?

Colonel Lucy Giles24:34

Yeah.

Colonel Lucy Giles24:35

Yeah, I think so. Well, yes, I know so. Um, which is why the hymn that um I've got as the Nexusc is is so important. Because when I've been

Presenter24:39

Mm-hmm.

Speaker 124:39

Yeah.

Colonel Lucy Giles24:49

Busy mum, busy doing job, busy doing this, busy doing that. Especially when Nick's been away, I've never really allowed myself to stop and think about it too much. So the only time you have a pause for reflection is, I found that in the church, if I've been at a chapel service or a remembrance parade or over Christmas or whatever, it's when you have those small moments of reflection that it does come to you.

Colonel Lucy Giles25:16

The hymn that I've chosen as the next disc, it's a verse from Those in Peril on the Sea, which

Colonel Lucy Giles25:23

recognizes the role of the armed forces on land and sea and and the air and and finally culminates in that final verse as being you know a

Colonel Lucy Giles25:32

A trinity of love and power. It absolutely.

Colonel Lucy Giles25:38

Always makes me emotional because it reminds me of the time when.

Colonel Lucy Giles25:44

when he's not been necessarily with us.

Colonel Lucy Giles25:48

It's a hymn that's played at Sandhurst at at Chapel Sundays and at commissioning services. So for three and a half years of which he was away for two of them, every Sunday. This would always make my eyes prickle.

Colonel Lucy Giles26:02

Because you sit and you reflect about the enormous sacrifice it's not only that we're doing at the moment around the world, but it's what's happened in the past and inevitably will happen in the future.

Speaker 226:24

For the Lord I'm saintless fire.

Speaker 226:32

Oh, yeah.

Speaker 226:43

Are you

Presenter27:12

For those in peril on the sea, in a special arrangement by Lieutenant Colonel Simon Hawt, who was conducting the members of the Guards Chapel Choir and the band of the Cold Stream Guards. Very moving, Lucy Giles.

Colonel Lucy Giles27:23

Amazingly talented Corps of Army musicians that we've got in the Army. And a very special piece of music to you. Yeah, definitely.

Presenter27:30

Lucy, young army recruits who are 16 and 17 years old, they start in the service at Harrogate and the commanding officer there recently said that about a third are what you would describe as really disadvantaged, excluded from school, maybe with behavioural issues or often coming from broken homes. I wonder how you tackle the moral dimension there. There's a duty of care, isn't there, to those young men and women.

Colonel Lucy Giles27:53

There certainly is. When we welcome people into the Army and they step over the line and they attest in the first week of their training.

Colonel Lucy Giles28:02

They're not just coming in to do a job, they're coming in and joining a family.

Colonel Lucy Giles28:06

So it does give a sense of purpose to some of these young men and women that are coming from maybe not such privileged backgrounds as I've experienced, for example. And yeah, there is definitely a duty of care that we have to make sure that these young people are supported and trained effectively. And also we realign the values that may have slipped in their younger years so that they're absolutely focussed on it.

Speaker 128:16

Mm-hmm.

Presenter28:33

and conversely Last year, I think half of the officer cadets arriving at Sandhurst were privately educated, so is there still a class divide between officers and other ranks?

Colonel Lucy Giles28:44

When you look at the statistics across the year, we do have more from the state sector actually than we do from public school all up. But the the balance is about

Colonel Lucy Giles28:54

fifty five, forty five at the moment. There is the opportunity for anybody to be able to apply to become an officer and apply online through the the Army websites, no matter what their background. In a way, when you start your the training, it doesn't matter where you've come from.

Colonel Lucy Giles29:10

Because it the playing field is level pretty quickly. All right, Lucy

Presenter29:13

Time for some more music.

Colonel Lucy Giles29:15

Uh

Presenter29:15

It's disc number seven. What are we going to hear next and why are you taking this with you today?

Colonel Lucy Giles29:20

Well, this particular track reminds me of the school run and the mad half hours on a Saturday afternoon playing with the children. Jess was born in 2004, Alex was born in 2008, Jessica had picked up all the lyrics and Alex was just shouting a lot. So when I hear this track, it just takes me back and makes me laugh. And the game was always who could hold on to the word fire the longest with some very interesting car journeys that we had. So this is from Cassabian and It's Fire.

Speaker 129:38

Uh

Speaker 129:56

Spill my guts on the wheel I wanna taste the heart

Speaker 130:03

But I'm on fire

Speaker 230:12

Ah

Presenter30:24

Kisabian and Fire. So Colonel Lucy Giles, the desert island isn't the only desert in your future, I happen to know. In your downtime, you are a sports enthusiast. And I think you're down to do the toughest race on earth, the Marathon di Sable. Six days, 251 kilometres. This is an ultra-marathon in the Sahara Desert. What is the appeal of an event like that?

Colonel Lucy Giles30:46

The original plan was to do it as a sort of I'm fifty and I can do anything kind of challenge, but Covid put a bit of a spanner in the works in 2020. It was tried to be run in September as well. So this is my third and final effort. So hopefully we can get across the start line in April. But I do love the challenge and it just helps keep me alive and you never stop learning about yourself either.

Presenter31:10

And of course, the next challenge for you is going to be life on the island. Now I'm imagining that all of your training in the army has toughened you up and that you will take it in your stride. What's the first thing that you'd set about doing when we cast you away, do you think?

Colonel Lucy Giles31:24

It's got to be fire shelter. I mean, that's the my standard training when I did my survival courses. That was what you needed to look for and get make sure you got water and a bit of food. But the the classic is that you end up doing that and then you go round the corner and it's all there laid out. So, you know, doing a recie, time spent in planning is never wasted. Okay, so quick recie first, just to make sh

Presenter31:44

Stewart hasn't recently been exited by another castaway officer. Exactly. I see. All right, got it.

Colonel Lucy Giles31:47

Exactly.

Presenter31:50

And how are you with your own company, of course? Because the psychological challenge of that is going to be tricky.

Colonel Lucy Giles31:55

I'm actually very comfortable in my own company. I like socialising and people who know me will know that only too well. But I'm also quite reflective and I'm quite happy in my own company. I'm very happy to go for a walk with our new little Splocker Billy and just lose myself in music or lose myself in nature and in the environment. Something I learned when I was studying biology and also working with my dad actually.

Presenter32:18

One more disc before you go then, Lucy. What are we going to hear for your final choice today?

Colonel Lucy Giles32:22

Well, this is a track that takes me straight back to school and my German exchange. And I'd had a pen pal that had come over from Dusseldorf, I think it was. And so it was our turn to go over there. So there I was, I had my ra-ra skirt, fluorescent fingerless gloves, looking the part and thinking I was super cool on the dance floor. So this is a track called Big in Japan by Alphaville, and I have to say that it is the go-to mummy track for the long car journeys that we are going on. And you know, I got it on vinyl for my 50th, so it's been with me for a while.

Presenter33:28

Alphaville and Big in Japan. So Colonel Lucy Giles, I'm going to send you away to the island. I will give you the books, the Bible, and the complete works of Shakespeare to take with you. You can also have another. What will your book choice be, Lucy?

Colonel Lucy Giles33:40

I would go for the complete works of Agatha Christie, but I think one will just do because I can never remember who actually does it and murders somebody in the end. So I think it will keep me entertained trying to keep guessing.

Presenter33:49

But he

Speaker 133:49

In the end so

Colonel Lucy Giles33:53

Any favourites? I do you know, I don't have a favorite because as I say, I've got a brain the size of a pen when it comes to remembering books and things, so anyone will do. All right, you can also have a luxury item to make your stay a little bit more enjoyable.

Presenter34:04

The

Colonel Lucy Giles34:05

Enjoyable. What will that be? Yeah.

Presenter34:06

Yeah.

Colonel Lucy Giles34:06

My luxury is time, but I'm going to have plenty of time on my side. So the thing I think I would love to occupy my time with is doing a large jigsaw puzzle, but not just any jigsaw puzzle. I think I'd need an illustrated map of the island that would be on the picture with nature notes around it so I can learn because I'm innately curious about the natural world. And on the back of it, I'd have pictures of my family. So I get a few for the price of one. So it's a jigsaw puzzle, which is what I would take.

Speaker 134:16

But

Presenter34:36

Oh, that's a fantastic choice. And finally, which one track would you save from the wait?

Colonel Lucy Giles34:41

if you had to? I think I'd save Metallica the day that never comes. Not only is it the longest track there, so I think I've got good value for money, and it just reminds me of very happy time at Sandhurst and the kids love it too.

Colonel Lucy Giles34:56

Colonel EC Giles

Presenter34:56

Thank you very much.

Colonel Lucy Giles34:58

for letting us hear your desert island discs. It's been an absolute pleasure.

Presenter35:12

Hello, I really hope you enjoyed that interview with Colonel Lucy Giles. We've cast many people from the Armed Forces away over the years. They include General Sir David Richards, Field Marshal Viscount Montgomery of Alamein and our 3000th castaway Captain Eric Winkle Brown, the Fleet Air Arms most decorated pilot. You can hear their programmes if you search through the Desert Island Discs website or on BBC Sounds. And if like Lucy, you're a Radiohead fan, you can also find Tom York's Desert Island Discs in there too.