Ian Wright

Presenter0:01

BBC Sounds, Music, Radio Podcasts. Hello, I'm Lauren Laverne, and this is the Desert Island Discs Podcast. Every week, I ask my guests to choose the eight tracks, book, and luxury they'd want to take with them if they were cast away to a desert island. This is an extended version of the original Radio 4 broadcast, and, for rights reasons, the music is shorter than the original broadcast. I hope you enjoy listening.

Presenter0:46

My castaway this week is Ian Wright. As a professional footballer, he was a late starter. When he signed with Crystal Palace, initially for just three months, he was 21 and a Sunday league player, working as a labourer to support his young family. It was the generosity of his foreman, who said his job would be waiting for him if football didn't work out, that persuaded him to take the deal. Thank goodness he did. He would go on to become world class, one of the greatest strikers of his generation, the second highest scorer of all time at Arsenal, and to earn 33 caps for England. Enthusiasm, exuberance, and flair were his defining characteristics on the pitch. A superstar player whose enormous skill was matched by his love of the game. Now a successful pundit, he remains as passionate and opinionated as ever. He says, As time goes by, people realise you're an honest bloke who'll stand in your corner. It suits some people to sling mud, but they can't take away what I've done. I just want to be remembered for being a hardworking, honest professional who did the best he could with the opportunity he got. Ian Wright, welcome to Desert Island Discs.

Ian Wright1:50

Thanks so much.

Presenter1:54

Yeah. I don't give a Well enough, just at the end

Ian Wright1:55

When I hear you say those things, you know, I mean, it brought me back to my foreman. And it was a time where Palace offered me a trial like two times by then. And I turned them down twice because, like you mentioned, I had a young family. Sean was already free and a bit. Bradley was just born, and I really couldn't afford to go through another trial and another rejection and give up the chance to have this really good job where I've just finally got where they were going to actually teach me a trade. So I turned Palace down three times and he was the one who said to me, Listen, I'll keep the job for you and you go and see how you can do. It's amazing.

Presenter2:28

Just turning on a sixpence. Let's start with your beloved Arsenal. So many high points during your time there. What were your personal best moments? If you were making the show real, what would be on it?

Ian Wright2:39

I think the first league game I played at Southampton and it was with my dear friend David Rowcastle. We grew up on the same estate. I've known David since he was five and I was like nine. And he was an inspiration to the whole estate because when he was fifteen, sixteen, he got signed by Arsenal as a youth team player and he was the one who used to always meet me. When you go from Honor Oak Estate to the other side of Broccoli to Crofton Park, you'd have to go across a bridge and he'd meet there. And I'd be coming back from the youth club, not doing anything like eighteen, nineteen at the time, and he would always dig me out about wasting time. You should be playing, you should be trying to get in. It's moments like this where it's difficult to speak about him because he was always looking out for me, wanted me to do the very best I can with the opportunity. So when I got to Arsenal and our first league game was away to Southampton and I scored at At-Trick in the game and David scored the other goal. And it's the best it's the best football match I've ever played in.

Presenter3:44

I mean, he he died tragically young, didn't he?

Ian Wright3:46

Thirty three, um Hodgkinson's lymphoma.

Ian Wright3:51

even with the Premier Leagues, the FA Cups, the Golden Boots and all the stuff that comes personally and from the team, that sticks out more than anything simply because it just brings me back to when we were both on the bridge and he just wanted me to do the best I could with my opportunity. So

Presenter4:05

Hmm.

Ian Wright4:09

I don't think of the personal accolades or the trophies or anything that I've won, the England Caps, which would mean the the world to me. All I think about is the fact that I played with him for a year as a professional.

Presenter4:21

I mean, I'm not surprised that you're so emotional talking about him and and I was wanted to ask you next about what must be a hugely memorable match for you, but you know, hearing you talk about him, it must be all the more so. You were playing Bolton Wandress in nineteen ninety seven, waiting to become Arsenal's highest scorer of all time, and you were wearing a shirt underneath your other shirt that had one, seven, nine just done it, but you'd had it on for like

Ian Wright4:39

Mm-hmm.

Ian Wright4:45

There we go.

Ian Wright4:47

Five five days.

Presenter4:47

Five matches and quite a few matches by that point.

Ian Wright4:49

Yeah, I know, but the reason why I had five games before I'd done it is I was so nervous. Never been so nervous in my whole life. Literally forgot how to shoot. My legs turned to lead. And then when I finally done it, I scored a hat-trick in the game to do it. When I went home that night, I couldn't sleep because I felt a sense of accomplishment. And it took me back to the fact that I got in so late into the game. People don't realize I was 28 when I got to Arsenal. And so to score the goals at the rate and the level I was scoring because I had such great players around me, it was very hard to comprehend what I'd done. And you know what? When I really realized what I'd done is when Tyrion really broke the record. That's when I realized I was top of that tree for like eight, nine years. But like I say, I would easily have given all of that up for another 20 years with my dear friend.

Presenter5:41

We've got so much to talk about today, Ian, but of course, first we've got to dig into your music, the first of your eight discs. Why have you chosen this one?

Ian Wright5:43

Right today, Ian, but of course

Ian Wright5:48

Well, it's I know people would never ever guess this one, but this is a song from the film Shaw Shank Redemption, and it's Mozart. The marriage of Figaro. What I used to do with this song is when I used to go to Arsenal, and I live about an hour away, this would be the first song I would play because I want to be calm and I want to build to a crescendo. So by the time I get to Avonall Road, when I'm close to Arsenal, I'm probably blasting out the prodigy or something like that. But this is what I would start with.

Speaker 36:57

Best of sir.

Ian Wright6:59

Yeah.

Ian Wright7:01

Uh

Presenter7:16

From the soundtrack to the film The Shoshank Redemption, that was part of Duatino Solaria, from Mozart's Marriage of Figaro, performed by Edith Mathis and Gundala Janowitz, with the Orchestra of the Berlin Opera, conducted by Karl Bohm. So, Ian Wright, what about your relationship with Arsenal fans? You have a very special connection with them. What did their appreciation mean to you?

Ian Wright7:39

I can't it's it's very difficult to try and explain the Arsenal fans, the the the Crystal Palace fans firstly. I remember it was the Crystal Palace away fans. They sponsored me literally all the way through my my Palace career and I will love them forever for that.

Ian Wright7:53

Obviously, the Arsenal fans as well. When I went to Arsenal, it ramped up the pressure, the media spotlight, the national spotlight you're now under. Because when I went there, they were champions twice out of the last three years. So the spotlight is on you. And so fans from other clubs are going to try and do everything they can, especially with somebody as volatile as I was. Some of the times on the pitch, they're going to try and upset you. They're going to try and get you off your game. And when you hear that you go somewhere and they're booing your every touch, and then you can hear from the Arsenal fans, they start singing your name. It actually makes you feel like you've got someone here watching you. Someone's got your back. I can't tell you what that feels like because they see that you need that help. Then they help you. You score. You all celebrate together. It's like it can't get any better than that. I see football players now scoring goals and they're very serious about it. You think you said, what are you doing? You're playing the game to score for that unbelievable adrenaline buzz that you can't get from anything else and you're suppressing it. You know what I mean? I love the fact that I could share it with them at that particular moment and you run in, you get booked, but then you take that. You take that.

Presenter9:01

Worth it.

Ian Wright9:01

Absolutely worth it.

Presenter9:03

You were called up to the England Squad, and you had gone to collect thirty three caps. What did that mean to you?

Ian Wright9:08

What did that

Ian Wright9:09

The world to play for England is really it's really strange when I think back at it. You know, I'm playing for England with an England side that's not long come back from Italian ninety World Cup with Gazza and Lineker and Waddle and Barnes and all those great players that I watched in that tournament and now I'm amongst them. I remember like almost floating on air when I went into the first camp and they were all there and they were all doing normal things like swearing and eating sandwiches.

Ian Wright9:44

And it's only when we got to Wembley I could feel it all well enough. Because to go in and see your boots underneath the number nine of England, people are looking at you to see how you're going to react.

Presenter9:56

Yeah.

Ian Wright9:56

And I remember Gaza saying, look at Right, he's gonna cry.

Ian Wright10:03

And I swear, if Gazza doesn't say that, probably would have burst into tears because he knew, he recognized what was going to happen. He was somebody as well who football meant the whole world to him.

Presenter10:12

You've never been afraid to speak up for what you believe in, and you've a very important voice in the sadly still very current debate about racism in football. Are things better or worse than they were in your playing days, do you think?

Ian Wright10:26

Well what we're seeing now with the emergence of social media, you can see it happening. We've seen it recently, we've seen it with Raheem Sterling, but like I don't think that it's something that's ever gone away, and something so complex as well. It's very difficult to try and even on this on here to try and explain what it means. And I think that people feel that because you've you've been a victim of it, you've got the I've got the answers. You don't know. You know, people talk about education. Then you look at a lot of people who are accused of racism. They're older people. They're people who should know better. Still think that education is the key and that's all we can do. But you know, you're just hoping that more and more people will out it when it happens.

Presenter11:00

Hmm.

Ian Wright11:05

Then you need the proper kind of discipline and the proper kind of punishment so people understand.

Ian Wright11:11

You know, it's not acceptable.

Presenter11:13

What about changes in the boardroom? I mean, you've talked about the glass ceiling for black players. What opportunities would you like to see opening up for them?

Ian Wright11:20

What a thing is you look at someone like Les Ferdinand who is in the boardroom.

Presenter11:24

At which club is

Ian Wright11:25

He's a QPR, but the fact is that Les himself, being one of the few, can't even name another CEO like Les is, he has to be successful. Because if he doesn't make a success of that, you're not going to be able to get the next person through the door. Now, what I'm talking about with a glass ceiling in that respect is that there's people who probably will be qualified and be able to maybe do that job, but are they getting the opportunities? That's the main thing. It's about opportunity.

Ian Wright11:54

For people of diverse nature. You know what I mean? All you want is for people to have an opportunity to do something and get the opportunity to do a job that they want to do.

Presenter12:03

It's time for your next track, What's It Gonna Be?

Ian Wright12:05

Well, this is just a great song I found a few years back, and it's a very spiritual song. It's from Kirk Franklin. He's a pastor. I'm not particularly religious, but I'm God-fearing. And the message in this is all about upbeat and keep going. And when you listen to the beat of it as well, it's just a very uplifting song.

Speaker 312:47

Take control.

Speaker 312:49

Don't take it, Father.

Presenter12:59

Kirk Franklin and looking for you. So Ian Wright, you were born in 1963 to Nestor and Herbert, who'd emigrated here from Jamaica, and you lived in Broccoli in South London. How would you describe yourself as a little boy?

Ian Wright13:05

It's a net.

Ian Wright13:13

Um

Ian Wright13:14

It was, it was, I don't know, I didn't, I know for one thing, and I was just saying, I didn't feel, apart from my brother Maurice, I just clung on to him, it wasn't a loving place to be. I didn't feel like people cared enough apart from my brother Maurice, because when we were younger, my stepfather, who was a very big, growly-voiced, gambling, weed-smoking, angry man who frightened me. I was afraid of him.

Presenter13:43

Your parents uh your dad left when you were about eighteen months and then

Ian Wright13:46

Yeah, my yeah, and then all I've known from a young age was my stepfather and I was never anywhere near somebody that he liked.

Presenter13:49

Right.

Ian Wright13:55

And I've I've been very truthful about how he made me feel, but I always helped him. So when I was younger, growing up, Morris was just an older brother to me, a couple of years older, who had to look out for me. He teased me.

Presenter14:07

He teased you about your football, didn't he?

Ian Wright14:08

He teased me from the day I've known him. Even now, he'll tease me on WhatsApp. And in the end, it drove me because I wanted to impress him so much that everything he told me I couldn't do, because he was a naturally very good footballer, I practiced and practiced until I could do it. So when I was younger, growing up, you know, I was very angry. Anything would happen, I'd get a smack or I'd get a clip or something would happen. So when I played football at that age, as soon as it got to a point where I couldn't deal with it, I'd lash out. And so that's how I felt when I was younger. Very angry and confused, little guy.

Presenter14:42

Your dad left when you were very young. What contact did you have with him after that?

Ian Wright14:44

Uh-huh.

Ian Wright14:47

It would be like you might see him in two years, you might see him after five years. I remember when I was 11, 12, the whole estate used to go on this family trip, going to Little Hampton or Margate. And I didn't have at that time any trousers, decent trousers, because it was a thing where everybody got dressed up. And someone got a message to him saying, Listen, Ian's going to a trip on Sunday and he's going to need some trousers. He hasn't got any trousers to wear. And so the messages come back: Yes, I'm going to come and give you the money to go and buy the trousers. It's going to happen. So you've got to understand my stomach because I don't see this guy. So Saturday comes, and I'm literally beside myself. And they said that he was going to be coming at half nine in the morning, ten. So I was waiting in our block of flats on the little Plimfy thing where you could sit on the entrance. And I was there from half nine in the morning. And he got there at quarter past five, right? And I just remember.

Ian Wright15:52

that the emotions

Ian Wright15:57

I can't even get to tell you the emotions I went through because if he didn't turn up, I don't know what I would have done. And I remember I got myself to Peckham, bought the trousers and I remember'em because it's so vivid. It was those patchwork ones that have like patches like on my suit here. And like I say, the reason why I say that is because if he didn't turn up on that day, I would never ever have had anything to do with him again.

Presenter16:16

Sing it.

Ian Wright16:25

And it's something that I've made sure I don't have to do. I don't have to wait for people for me to progress.

Presenter16:34

We'll talk more in a minute, but right now, let's take a break for some music. This is your third disc. Tell me about this one.

Ian Wright16:38

This is

Ian Wright16:41

Well, this is a really tough one. Tina Turner, River Deep Mountain High. It's one of the first records I ever remember. And when you go on to see Tina Turner's film and what she went through,

Ian Wright16:52

And then what what I saw my mum go through, I remember this record would come on and my mum would just cry.

Ian Wright16:59

Because I've seen what she'd been through with my with my stepdad. You know what I mean? She was like what four foot eleven and stuff and he was six four. You know what I mean? And, you know, I used to see him like lift her do stuff to her. And this record, when I hear it, it just takes me to a place of real

Ian Wright17:15

Anxiety.

Ian Wright17:17

It's a horrible tune for me. I remember my brother, when my stepfather used to be really, really manhandling my mum, my brother used to cover my ears so you couldn't hear it and when this song comes on, it just takes me back to to that place.

Presenter17:34

Why is it important to you to represent that and to talk about that experience?

Ian Wright17:37

Talk about that experience. I have to own it and deal with it as hard as it is. My mum came through it with my help as well.

Ian Wright17:42

So it's it's part of my life.

Ian Wright17:46

Part of my life.

Presenter18:13

I continue Turner with Riverdeep, Mountain High. So Iain Wright, life at home for you when you were little was obviously incredibly difficult, but football, by the sounds of it, was an escape.

Ian Wright18:20

Well, but f

Presenter18:23

It was a release.

Ian Wright18:24

was the one thing that I was good at. And I started playing at eight and people used to say, Oh, he's really good and then my brother would tease me about stuff. So then I'd practice my left foot, practice my right foot, practice my heading. I was so happy. I was so happy when I played.

Presenter18:38

So you went to Turnham School when you were about eight, and you said you had a very, very short attention span. What was going on with you?

Ian Wright18:39

Yeah.

Ian Wright18:41

Yeah.

Ian Wright18:44

Yeah.

Ian Wright18:45

I just found it very hard to focus on what they wanted me to do. If you had to write an essay, if you had to do maths or anything, the teacher would have to spend a lot more time because I didn't quite grasp it. My handwriting was really poor. I wasn't confident with my reading. And then I remember being outside the classroom, like for the third occasion, and Mr. Pigden, when he walked past, I wouldn't even look at him. You know what I mean? I was so scared of him because he was really strict. And I remember on this third occasion, he looked at me, he looked down at me because I was seven. I was at the school the other day because I had to do his plaque. And he looked down at me. It felt, it felt like he was looking at me for an hour. I wouldn't look at him, but I could see his clothes. I remember he had these, his shoes were so shiny, he had turn-up trousers, his suit was always so immaculate. And then he looked at me and then he went into the classroom, said a couple of things to the teacher, this and that, and then he came back outside and he said, come with me.

Ian Wright19:43

And that changed my life.

Presenter19:44

I mean, many castaways will sit where you are now in and reference individual teachers who changed their lives, but mister Pigden was truly important to you to the extent that you dedicated your autobiography to him.

Ian Wright19:56

Graffiti.

Presenter19:57

How did he treat you? How did he engage with you and challenge you?

Ian Wright20:00

I know he loved me.

Ian Wright20:02

You know, I don't know why he chose me.

Ian Wright20:05

I'm glad that he did. Once he came in, and you know, it was everything was so much better. He was the one who taught me about Jimmy Greaves and making sure when you finish in, when you're going through with the goalkeeper, pass the ball into the goal. Look for the space, score beautiful goals. But he gave me responsibility. I mean, I used to collect the registers from the teachers. Then they made me milk monitor. I really liked that. And, you know, I looked up.

Presenter20:29

What was that like for the kid who couldn't sit still?

Ian Wright20:31

Well, it was really good. I just felt important.

Presenter20:35

Yeah.

Ian Wright20:36

And then what he'd do, he'd put me back into the classroom, and then my writing got better. He wouldn't let me play football if he'd heard that I'd been naughty in class. He just gave me a sense of feeling like I I had some use. You know, it was really weird because of the viral video that went around where people said

Presenter20:51

Yes, this is in 2010 you were reunited with him and that video clip online's been viewed over two million times. You had thought that he had passed away. You'd been told incorrectly.

Ian Wright20:55

And

Ian Wright21:01

Yeah, I couldn't find him. I was doing a television show and there was a there was a bit in it where I had to go back to the ground and, you know, just sit in the director's box. And so I was sitting there in a reflective moment and then he just came

Ian Wright21:16

My right shoulder.

Ian Wright21:18

And the funny thing about it was that because he was like three or four steps higher than me, so the first thing I remember doing was I just ripped my hat off my head. Just went like that. And then I'd said to him, Oh my gosh, I thought you died, I thought you were dead. And he said, Well, I'm very much alive, Ian, something like that. And then.

Ian Wright21:39

He kind of he said how proud he is of me.

Ian Wright21:47

And then I hugged him, and because he was three or four steps up, I felt like I was like seven again.

Ian Wright21:54

We kept in touch from then on and

Ian Wright21:56

I remember him saying, you know, because he was one of the youngest pilots in World War II.

Ian Wright22:02

He was one of the pilots chosen to do the flyover of Buckingham Palace, right? So.

Ian Wright22:09

I remember him saying that he was more proud of the fact that I played for England than him flying off

Presenter22:18

Uh

Ian Wright22:18

Yeah.

Presenter22:19

Or in

Ian Wright22:22

Love that mad

Presenter22:24

You can see it in your

Ian Wright22:25

So

Presenter22:26

in that moment on that clip.

Ian Wright22:28

Gosh, man, I'm so sorry to people who are listening. I'm just turning into this.

Ian Wright22:32

Bumbling crying guy, but

Ian Wright22:35

You know, it's um

Presenter22:37

They'll all be crying with you until um

Ian Wright22:40

When he said that

Ian Wright22:43

He he changed my life just by recognizing I don't know what it was when I was standing outside that classroom that I needed more and and he gave it to me. And you know, to be able to unveil his plaque at Turnham Junior School was the greatest thing that I've ever done in my life, to be honest. It's the greatest man in the world.

Presenter23:07

Let's hear some music. This is your four theme.

Ian Wright23:09

Yes. This is Bob Marley and you know there's loads of Bob Marley songs and this one's deep because I remember when Alex Ailey's Roots came out, it was really quite hard in our school for a while. Now everything changed because the slavery thing and not really knowing about slavery until you watch Roots then you start to find out what went on and the next few days at school it turned into like a a black and white zone and anger and p it was real nightmare.

Ian Wright23:37

And I remember this song was one that I listened to a lot in and around that time. Just it just talks about those things, you know. It's just a song that you listen to and it was very powerful. It's a powerful song for me.

Ian Wright23:48

And so I thought, yeah, of all the reggae records that I could put in, I thought that I'd put in this one because it's so uh significant, Redemption Song.

Speaker 323:56

Won't you hear Justin?

Speaker 324:01

The Sons of Freedom

Speaker 224:04

Uh

Speaker 324:04

Uh

Speaker 224:04

Yeah.

Speaker 324:05

Yeah. This is all out.

Speaker 224:05

All I ever have

Ian Wright24:06

I hear it.

Speaker 324:06

Uh

Ian Wright24:06

Yeah.

Speaker 224:10

Redemption songs.

Speaker 224:14

Redeem.

Ian Wright24:14

Jim Shawn Songs.

Speaker 224:16

Uh

Ian Wright24:19

Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery. None but ourselves can free our minds.

Presenter24:28

Bob Marley and the Whalers with Redemption Song. Ian Wright, you were just fourteen, I think, when you left home and stopped going to secondary school and you got a job as a plaster. How did your mum react?

Ian Wright24:36

And you got

Ian Wright24:40

Um it wasn't really fussed. Maybe because I used to leave the house in my school uniform.

Presenter24:47

Uh

Ian Wright24:47

Uh

Presenter24:47

Huh?

Ian Wright24:47

And then get changed and then I'd go to work. And I'd done that for a few weeks. I didn't do any revision for the mocks. I was playing truant a lot. It was a time in my house where it just got just majorly on top. And so I left and went and lived with my friend's mum. She was amazing. Called her Auntie June. My mate Johnny, his brother David. And it was kind of like a place where a load of boys like myself were in and around. And once I got with them, then they started to take me to Lucian Boys Club, Jasper's, around the back of the Squire pub up in Bellingham, where it was really hardcore racial guys drinking. And, you know, it was a volatile time. People would get, a lot of people would get beaten up. But this was a time what changed for me, my outlook on everything. You know, I've started to meet people like that were gay people and being around all kinds of people. It was an amazing time.

Presenter25:47

What about your footballing ambitions at this time? Where were you at with that? You'd been going for trials but without any success. Why do you think they didn't notice your talent?

Ian Wright25:57

I I honestly don't know. I went for a trial with Orient went for trial with Chow and went for trials with Millwall. It was really horrible because you'd be walking off the pitch and then you'd see the scouts going up to people saying, listen, I represent this one, that one, and you're never getting picked.

Presenter26:10

Hmm.

Ian Wright26:10

And, you know, it was demoralizing.

Presenter26:13

What was the difference between those other kids and you, do you think?

Ian Wright26:15

I don't know. I feel like I used to go to these trials on my own.

Ian Wright26:19

Some of the times um my dear friend Calvin Gentle, who passed away, was a magnificent football name and his brother Chris. Calvin would try and come with me, Maurice would try and come with me, but when you're just there with your brother, like I'm like thirteen, fourteen and he's like sixteen, it's you know what I mean, I didn't have the right representation when they were coming up. They never came up anyway.

Presenter26:38

Never came up anyway. Didn't have a family with you who were obviously going to help you with your training and support you.

Ian Wright26:40

We're obviously going to help you with your ch

Ian Wright26:42

I didn't have that, no.

Presenter26:44

I do want to ask you about your experience of prison in nineteen eighty two. You were in prison for nonpayment of fines, among other things, driving without a licence. You were in Chelmsford prison for eighteen days. What was the impact of that experience on you?

Ian Wright26:51

We strike him with

Ian Wright26:55

Yeah.

Ian Wright26:57

With that impact, that literally that was it. For a start, you're in one of those Mariah vans where you're enclosed.

Ian Wright27:06

I couldn't take it. I was like.

Ian Wright27:09

And it was all happening really quickly to the point where I got put into a cell. Bam, when the door closed, I realized where I was. And I literally

Ian Wright27:19

I cried from the first day to the last day. It made me realize I can't do this. So when I came out, it was a case of trying to find a kind of job that's gonna pay me so as I can focus on getting that trade. That's all I'd done from then until it started to happen.

Presenter27:36

Ian, we've got to go to the music, and I know this is a special track for you, so tell us about it, your fifth disc today.

Ian Wright27:38

And

Ian Wright27:42

Oh my gosh. So when I started to go with my guys, when I ran away from home, they took me to the soul clubs and it was an eye-opener. It just made me realize that soul music is where I need to be. But when I heard this one, you know, I'm not going to say too much in respects of the song because I want people to listen to the intro because I've never heard it before. I'm in the middle of the dance floor, you could start to see people gearing up and I'm thinking, what's coming? What's coming? And that was me. I was never going back to reggae like I was like a slave to it before. This took me to the next level.

Presenter28:54

MSFB Mysteries of the World. Oh, Ian Wright. I mean

Ian Wright28:57

Ian Wright. I mean, just gorgeous. Just transcendent. You know, I remember just standing there and you know when you listen to the to the intro, like you say, you can hear everything. Harps, violins, cymbals, and it just took me back to trying to dance as well as those guys were dancing. It's just a beautiful record, gorgeous song.

Presenter29:15

Alright, so in 1985 things improved for you. Life was starting to change. You were playing Sunday League for a team called 10MB and while you were there you were still working as a labourer for Tunnel Refineries and you were scouted by Crystal Palace. You turned them down three times but when it came to making the final decision about whether or not you were going to sign I understand that you talked it through with your son Bradley who would have been about eight months old at the time.

Ian Wright29:17

For you life

Ian Wright29:41

Just barely walking around holding onto stuff, but

Ian Wright29:45

When the day came, I remember I was having a bath, and Bradley, who, like I say, was crawling around in the bathroom, mainly trying to eat the bubbles out of the bath. That's what he was doing. I remember having to stop him. And I remember speaking to him, going into why this is so important, just saying to him, This is it. This is another chance for me. What happens, though? You know what I mean? What happens if I don't make it again? You know, people are going to say you're not good enough again. And saying, no, all I want is the best for you, best for you. I just want us to live somewhere nicer. I want to be a footballer so bad. I was just speaking like that to like an eight, nine-month-old baby. And it was amazing simply because I remember going for this trial and I felt so free.

Ian Wright30:32

And once I got there, I just said, I'm just going to do what I do because I've been rejected, trying to impress, trying to do what I think they want me to do. And I just went and done my stuff, scored about three or four goals in the game. And so then I found out that I was going to make it. And what that talk done, which I didn't even realize at the time, it just made me go into a mode of.

Ian Wright30:56

What are you worried about? Just go and do it.

Presenter30:59

And once you got to Palace, you just flew. After six years there, in nineteen ninety one, you signed for Arsenal for what was at the time a record fee of two point five million pounds. You were twenty eight at the time. Can you sum up how you felt signing for such a a significant, important club?

Ian Wright31:16

No, to be honest, simply because it was leaving Crystal Palace for a start was a shock. I never asked to leave. I never ever tried to orchestrate a move. I was happy at Palace. So all of a sudden I'm going to Arsenal. Like I mentioned, David Roecastle's there. They've been champions twice out the last three years and they wanted me. It was very hard to comprehend. It took a while for it to sink in that I was at Arsenal Football Club with my friend David Roadcastle. The days before my first game, which was Leicester in the Cup, which I scored in as well, the nerves of all of a sudden being the record signing for Arsenal Football Club was overwhelming.

Presenter31:56

And everybody talking about it.

Ian Wright31:57

Everybody and everybody's screwed right, let's see what he's about because like people say, Yeah, he's not going to be good. Once he's amongst better players, we'll see what he's really about. And what I found is that once I got around better players, I actually just slotted in and got better.

Ian Wright32:13

And because I went to another level with Arsenal.

Presenter32:15

Did it change your view of yourself?

Ian Wright32:19

I think that the success of it and the fact that I went there and now I'm accepted as one of the the main strikers in the league. I think what happens with that and with the the amount of praise you're getting because all of a sudden as much as people are giving you negative criticism, they're still realizing that, well, he's still scoring, he's still doing well. And then you start to get a kind of a

Ian Wright32:44

a solidarity with yourself where you say, Listen, I'm kind of invincible. You can't hurt me. And the only thing that happens with that is you kind of start feeling that you're breathing different air. You you you start to think that you're a bit special maybe.

Presenter32:47

Uh

Presenter32:58

A little bit too big for you, Bruce.

Ian Wright32:59

Absolutely. Absolutely. I went through that.

Presenter33:00

Absolutely.

Ian Wright33:02

And if I'm going to be totally honest, it's not my proudest years. You know, I think I messed up a lot of.

Ian Wright33:09

See, messed up, is that a bit strong? I think that caused a lot of problems for a lot of my family.

Ian Wright33:14

That I'm that you know you you you can only as time goes by try and rectify and and and make people realize that yes, you're going through a phase where you know you made some terrible decisions, terrible decisions and done some terrible things. I found that when I went on a football pitch, everything that I was doing off the football pitch

Ian Wright33:33

Didn't bother me. On the football pitch is Sanctuary.

Presenter33:36

I might come back to that, Ian, after this next track, and it's your sixth today. Why have you chosen it?

Ian Wright33:37

Yeah, yeah.

Ian Wright33:41

Because this is the song that I had played when my wife was walking out to me for our wedding. And I got Shola Amma, dear friend, and she sung this song because I needed to find a song to sum up what Nancy means to me and how she's changed my life and how she makes me a better person. She's an unbelievable woman. And I needed to find a song that could sum up how I felt about her. And this is it. And so when they played it, walking towards me.

Ian Wright34:13

Everybody knows'cause you've seen what I've been like on there.

Ian Wright34:17

Floods of tears.

Presenter34:19

Fire.

Presenter34:23

The highest mountain

Ian Wright34:30

Uh

Presenter34:30

Yeah.

Speaker 334:30

Indeed

Ian Wright34:31

Uh

Speaker 334:34

Then the deepest sea

Ian Wright34:37

Yeah.

Ian Wright34:42

But

Ian Wright34:45

We alone

Ian Wright34:53

Die

Ian Wright34:57

Endless love

Presenter35:00

Randy Crawford with Endlessly. So Ian Wright, you've found so much happiness with your second wife, Nancy Now, but you talked about your time at Arsenal and how your success there was underpinned by struggles that you were going through, some pretty bad behaviour, some things that you're not proud of. Your temper got the better of you on several occasions.

Speaker 235:06

Yeah.

Speaker 235:12

You were going to

Ian Wright35:16

Yeah.

Ian Wright35:19

Is the

Presenter35:19

How did you start to tackle that? How did you deal with that?

Ian Wright35:21

I needed therapy, you know, because I got to a stage in my life where.

Ian Wright35:28

You're in a position where you're not hearing the word no too frequently because you're doing so well, and that's dangerous.

Ian Wright35:36

to the point where y you're obnoxious. I knew I was not in a good place. I went to see this wonderful woman, Rosalyn Craig, her name was I have to mention her. And I remember when I first started to go and speak to her, she recognised after the first few that you're you're not telling me the truth.

Ian Wright35:54

Why have you come here? But if you want to waste money, then go and do it somewhere else because I've got too many people that need help and you are wasting my time. And she said that.

Ian Wright36:06

And then I burst into tears,'cause you know I can. And then I just poured out. And the therapy was the best thing that ever happened to me because what I realized is that a lot of it stemmed from my youth, when I was a child.

Ian Wright36:22

I remember one time she asked me about being hugged.

Ian Wright36:28

when she said, Can you remember the first

Ian Wright36:30

hug you got from your mum. Can you remember any time where maybe your your stepdad showed you if and I literally couldn't remember anything like that. And like as as time went by with Roslyn,

Ian Wright36:44

She tried to tell me to speak to her, to speak to my mum, and I tried so many times.

Ian Wright36:50

And she she doesn't acknowledge any of that stuff. So it's very difficult to try and put it to bed and understand what she may have been going through or what her journey's been up to that point.

Presenter37:01

And did therapy enable you to get a different perspective on that?

Ian Wright37:05

Absolutely, the therapy worked because what it made me realize is that, yeah, it wasn't great um when I was growing up, but I turned it into something. And I'm just pleased that I got to a stage where I d I didn't want to be that guy where I looked in the mirror. I just didn't like myself.

Ian Wright37:20

You know?

Ian Wright37:21

Didn't like it.

Presenter37:22

Ian, it's time for your next track. What have we got?

Ian Wright37:26

How can I say this is a very important song especially in the black community

Ian Wright37:29

What Stormsey done with this song, he was able to capture what it means to any black person that has got success and what that means to the people around, and what you have to do, and how you have to then carry yourself, the criticism that you have to deal with. People don't realize that when you do become successful as a black person, I'm sure it happens for white people as well. The amount of people that you do need to continue to try and help. And what Mike did with this was just magnificent to the point where I had to send him a message and say, Mike, that is awesome, bro. The way you've captured the feelings of anybody who's got to a level where you are now in the public eye and you can help, you know, he's just hit the nail on the head with this song. You know, the crown, it's magnificent.

Ian Wright38:19

I have my reasons and life has its lessons I try to be grateful and count all my blessings But heavy is the head that wears the crown

Ian Wright38:39

Amen in Jesus' name, yes, I declare it. Any little see that

Presenter38:48

Stormsy, a.k.a. Michael O'Mari and The Crown.

Ian Wright38:51

He just really caught what it means to be as successful as you are as a black person and what it means to the community.

Presenter38:58

You connected with it as well. That experience heavy is the head that wears the crown.

Ian Wright38:59

Well that experience

Ian Wright39:01

Where's the crown?

Presenter39:02

Tell me then about life as a pundit on Match of the Day in BT Sport and ITV. Having been a player, you know what it feels like to be on the pitch there, but it's also your job to criticise players, to represent the fans. How does that feel?

Ian Wright39:14

Do you know to

Ian Wright39:15

How does that

Ian Wright39:16

It's very privileged, you know, to be able to have played for a living and now you're in a position where you can speak about it to try and give insight. The research, I just cannot get enough of that because what you want to do is you want to try and explain the game to people when you see incidents that people who don't watch football can understand why that happened in that particular moment. So, to be able to be in a position where you can do that, unless you have to criticize people some of the times, but you don't have to be negative in that criticism. It's more a case of just as simply as you can letting people know why that happened. You know what I mean? I've had a double whammy in respects of being fortunate to be in that position.

Presenter39:56

You talked earlier about becoming a dad when you were very young. You're now a father of eight kids from several relationships. What do you hope your kids have learnt from you?

Ian Wright40:06

Do as I say, not as I do. I was very young. I don't regret any of my past. I know I'm a decent man now. I can just look myself in the mirror and know that. All of them are wonderful with their kids. And you know, that's all I would like for my kids and the way they treat their kids, is for them to know that they're doing the best they can. All we want to do is give them a good education and love.

Presenter40:29

We've spent a lot of time today looking back. What about looking forward? What are your hopes for the future?

Ian Wright40:34

To be honest, I just now I feel like I'm in an unbelievable place. I've got an unbelievable woman who married me. And like I say, with everything what I went through, to get to marry someone like my wife Nancy, I know someone's looking out for me. You know, I don't feel like there's much I want now. I've done all the material stuff. You know what I mean? A place now where it's more about the substance of things now. I don't want to waste words. I don't want to waste time. What about one more tune then? Yes, please.

Presenter41:06

What will it be?

Ian Wright41:06

This one's for me and Nance because when I'm at my happiest, when we're out, if this song comes on, me and Nance are just dancing. I can do any move I want, she'll do any moves she wants, and then we'll hug and we'll dance again. Even when I'm thinking about it now before it's come on, I can imagine her dancing to it and it makes me smile.

Ian Wright41:27

I like what I see when I'm looking at me, when I'm walking past the mirror Don't stress through the night at a time of my life, ain't worry about if you feel it Got my head on straight, I got my vibe right, I ain't gonna let you kill it See, I would change my life, my life

Speaker 341:42

Uh

Ian Wright41:54

Think I won't

Speaker 241:55

Change my life

Presenter42:00

Mary J. Blige with Just Fine. So, Ian Wright, it's time to cast you away to your desert island. As always, you can have the Bible, the complete works of Shakespeare, and a book of your own choosing. What would you like to take?

Ian Wright42:04

To your death.

Ian Wright42:07

The complete

Ian Wright42:11

I'd probably go with The Curious Incident of The Dog in the Nighttime. I really love reading that book. It was such a good book.

Presenter42:18

You can also take a luxury item for sensory stimulation or to ease the pain of your isolation. What do you fancy?

Ian Wright42:25

I'd like to be able to take a golf club.

Presenter42:27

We can do that for you, no problem.

Ian Wright42:28

Could you do a seven-iron with some golf balls?

Presenter42:31

You're in the bunker for all eternity.

Ian Wright42:32

For eternity I'm in the bunker.

Presenter42:34

And if you had to save just one track of the eight songs that you've shared with us today, which would it be?

Ian Wright42:40

Endlessly for Nance.

Ian Wright42:43

'Cause that's how much I love her.

Presenter42:45

Iain Wright, thank you so much for sharing your Desert Island discs with us.

Ian Wright42:48

Pleasure, lost. Pleasure.

Presenter43:02

Well, that was an emotional conversation. I hope you enjoyed listening and have now recovered. I expect Ian to have perfected his bunker play by the time he's rescued from his desert island. The Desert Island Discs Back catalogue features a number of footballing greats, including David Beckham, Sir Trevor Brooking, Gary Lineker, Jackie Charlton, and Danny Blancheflower. Fellow Arsenal legend and team captain Tony Adams was cast away by Kirsty Young in 2010, just after the World Cup in South Africa. She asked him what it was like on the journey home when you've been knocked out of the tournament.

Speaker 243:35

Horrific, absolutely horrific. I got a lot of criticism in 1988 and I remember coming back into Luton Airport and being chased by a load of, there were three coaches parked of England supporters and they chased me and I legged it and I won Fiat Uno Young Player of the Year in those days. I had a little Fiat Uno and I legged it to the car and sped away but it was horrific enough that the public was all on my case. But the type of character that I am, we won the league the next year. You know, I focused in on that and I said, right, okay, I'm going to prove to all you guys, actually, I'm a good player. And I said that to Bex actually after 98 after he got sent off and I said to Bex when he was in tears in the changing rooms, I said, all you can do now, it's gone, it's finished, you know, we're out, this is my last opportunity and you blew it for me, thanks Dave. But now what you can do is go back to your club and win the league for Man United and do your best for that. That's all you can do. And I think they did the buggers.

Speaker 344:34

Let's have some music then and tell me Tony Adams what we're going to hear first of all today.

Speaker 244:37

We've got Earth Wind and 5 and Let's Groove. It's the first record ever bought. Did you save up your pocket money? I did. I got 50p in those days and I got Staten Kidney Pie and Chips and 10pence bus fare home. So I didn't get the bus home for a few weeks and I saved up and I walked down Oxo Lane in Dagnum. There's a new record shop that just opened and I bought this kind of funky tomb man.

Speaker 344:43

You saved up your pocket money to do it.

Presenter44:44

Uh

Speaker 244:59

Yeah.

Ian Wright45:04

I'm not sure.

Speaker 345:09

Uh

Speaker 345:12

We've got a rule design.

Speaker 345:17

Make us grow!

Ian Wright45:18

Yeah.

Ian Wright45:22

Oh god

Ian Wright45:24

Let us grow, send it to scroll.

Presenter45:31

Earth, Wind and Fire, and Let's Groove, one of Tony Adams' choices back in 2010. His Desert Island Discs is a great listen. You'll find it, along with over 2,000 more editions of the program, on the website or on BBC Sounds. Next time, my guest will be Spice Girl Melanie C. Do join us then.

Speaker 346:05

What are you interested in?

Speaker 346:07

And I mean really interested in pencils, crinoline mania.

Presenter46:13

Uh

Speaker 346:13

So much so that if you see it, or hold it, or just think about it.

Speaker 346:18

Then everything stops.

Speaker 346:21

And then

Speaker 346:22

One day, it just vanished.

Speaker 346:25

Each week in the Boring Talks podcast, join me, James Ward, as I introduce a guest speaker to share their own fascination for a very niche subject.

Ian Wright46:35

But what could it possibly be?

Speaker 346:37

From the personal joys of pencils and teletext to the expectant sounds of old computer games loading.

Speaker 346:44

Every talk is a varied and surprising treat. Hear that? Lovely. The Boring Talks. Subscribe right now on BBC Sounds.