Levi Roots

Presenter0:00

Hello, I'm Kirsty Young. Thank you for downloading this podcast of Desert Island Discs from BBC Radio 4. For rights reasons, the music choices are shorter than in the radio broadcast.

Presenter0:10

For more information about the programme, please visit bbc.co.uk slash radio four.

Presenter0:33

My castaway this week is the entrepreneur Levi Roots. His food products, recipe books, restaurants and cookery shows are all inspired by his Jamaican heritage. For years in his Brixton kitchen he'd been boiling up endless bubbling pans of his special recipe condiment to sell at the Notting Hill Carnival. Its name? Reggae Reggae Sauce. Put simply, it was the music that inspired the sauce that inspired the business, and it was thanks to his winning appearance on BBC Two's Dragon's Den back in two thousand seven he sang and strummed a guitar to pitch for investment that a cottage industry is now a multi-million pound success story.

Presenter1:10

His life hasn't always read like a fairy tale.

Presenter1:13

He was born one of five children in the Caribbean and brought up by his grandmother, but, by the time he made the long journey to the UK to join his parents, he was eleven and still unable to read or write. As a teenager, he spent time in a detention centre. Later, there was a spell in prison. In fact, it was his second stint behind bars that he credits with turning his life around. But through it all, there has always been the music, including performances with James Brown and Maxie Priest. He says Food is fun. The kitchen's not a boring place. You should be able to express yourself and combine your music, your food, and your ingredients, in much the same way as an orchestra does on stage. So welcome, Levi Roots. When you gave that pitch to the dragons, you brought in all these sort of flavours. You were so descriptive, I could almost taste it as I heard you talking about it. What are the store cupboard essentials for you at home that you must have?

Levi Roots1:59

Yeah.

Levi Roots2:06

For good Caribbean cooking. Well, I call it my sunshine kit and I I always used to have that around me. Even in my early days, when I used to go on my music tours, I always had this little thing and one thing that was always in there was scotch bunny chilies.

Presenter2:18

And they're really hot.

Levi Roots2:19

They're really hot. It carries a fantastic flavor when you add that to pimento or allspice, which are the two key ingredients in jerk. And so I think if you have a bit of scotch bonnet and some allspice in in your cupboard, then I think that you're fully fledged to to cook some Caribbean.

Presenter2:36

Now these days, of course, I'm sure you could afford to eat out in the finest three Michelin starred restaurants all the time. But what's your go-to recipe? If you really want something delicious to eat, what do you

Levi Roots2:42

I've had a

Levi Roots2:46

What do you Well, there's a very famous Caribbean dish called Akian saltfish, and this is the sort of food that I grew up on because the Aki tree is a tree that grows wild in Jamaica. It's in everyone's garden, and of course, we had one in our garden. And my grandma used to always feed us on this tree, mix that with some salted cud, and make this fantastic, beautiful colored dish that represented Jamaica. So that's my comfort food. Whenever time I wanna s I sort of sit and and maybe have a bit of music on in the background, I would choose that particular dish.

Presenter3:16

Your company sells over fifty different lines of food now, though. I mean, that is an empire. I'm sure it's taken a lot of hard work to get it there.

Levi Roots3:20

I feel like

Presenter3:24

Do you ever sort of look at your life and say, How wa wait a minute, how did this happen?

Levi Roots3:28

I do, I do every day. I do. Every day because I thought I was quite rubbish in the dragons did myself personally. I'm scared to look at the program now to see how rubbish I really was. But I do always say that even if you are rubbish, you got to be you because people are investing in whoever you are. And perhaps if I did get all my numbers right and I was all flashy and everything, I probably wouldn't have got the investments.

Presenter3:30

P as

Presenter3:55

You've been in reggae bands over the decades. You've been a music producer as well. It's always particularly difficult when I have guests who've got music at the center of their life to get them to choose just eight pieces of music. So what's been your criteria for choosing the music?

Levi Roots4:04

Yeah.

Levi Roots4:08

Well, I think you're right. Music has always been there. But I think if I can choose songs that has some meaning towards my life, that helps me to sort of change from my bad days, you know, into the better me, into the best of Levi Roots. This is how I managed to sort of hone down the request for eight songs. It's about songs that affected my life.

Presenter4:29

In that case, then, you must tell us about your first one.

Levi Roots4:31

Well the first one is from that wonderful man Mr Stevie Wanda and for me this song's connection to do with one of my iconic Jamaican god which is the great Bob Marley and and how this song sort of merges Stevie's belief in in what Bob Marley was saying in these songs. It is so Jamaican but it it is still Stevie.

Speaker 34:51

Everyone's feeling pretty

Speaker 34:55

It's hotter than July.

Speaker 34:59

Though the world's full of problems

Speaker 35:02

They couldn't touch us even if they tried.

Speaker 35:06

From the par algorithm

Speaker 35:10

Marlis Carton Voice

Speaker 35:13

Tonight there will be a party

Speaker 35:17

On the corner at the end of the block

Speaker 35:22

Whoop it down in the to the quick blow down

Presenter5:27

That was Stevie Wonder and Master Blaster Jamming. Levi Roots, you are a sharp-dressed man. Thank you very much. I need to tell people the vision that sits before me today. You are in, I think that must be a bespoke suit, because surely off the peg it wouldn't fit you quite like that.

Levi Roots5:40

You have a good hike as well.

Presenter5:42

You have wonderful jewelry on, some of it encrusted in diamonds, rings, you've got beads in your hair. Is it true you have thirty-five Oswald Botang suits?

Levi Roots5:51

Wow, you did it right in the head. I have indeed. I I've been um that's the only thing that I really spend my money on. But I do think it's important that you have to look the part when you're in business, especially for someone like myself who, you know, comes from my background. If you do want to inspire others, y you know, you've got to be able to inspire your own self. And for me, it's looking the right part and making sure that I get that message over.

Presenter6:17

And talking about inspiring others, you spend a good chunk of your time visiting schools and prisons. What's the purpose of that and what are you saying to the people in the schools and prisons?

Levi Roots6:25

I found it difficult to find one of these kind of, you know, Levi Roots type fellows who used to come around Brixton when I was growing up. Because I've always said that I wasn't really a bad lad, but I never had the motivation and I never had these people to come around to Lovely Brixton to speak to us as young people. And I think kids nowadays need to see people that they can identify with. And I was lucky enough to sort of find, well, you've got to be in the right place at the right time. And I was in the right place at the right time for someone like Peter Jones to come along and says, you know, I can spot you.

Presenter7:00

And Peter Jones was uh one of the entrepreneurs outside of the state.

Levi Roots7:03

One of the entrepreneurs and dragons then who who um who saw that that you know this wasn't just about a raster man singing a song, that there was a business behind that as well.

Presenter7:12

You became a Rastafarian when you were eighteen. Uh you've been brought up up until then as a Christian by your parents. What does it mean to you today to li to live a Rastafarian life?

Levi Roots7:17

Yeah.

Levi Roots7:22

It was about finding myself. You know, I was a bit lost before Rastafari came into my life. My father gave me the name of Keith Graham, and I really struggled in school at the time when you're sort of 15, 16, and you're trying to find out who you are and where do you fit into this new country which I found myself in. And I looked up the name and saw that the name Keith Graham was Scottish. And I just felt like I didn't really feel Scottish. Where did this come from? Where do I fit into this world? And it was the music of Bob Marley that I started to listen to his albums. And I got the sort of drift of what Rasta was saying: that you're not Scottish after all, that you are African and you should have a name that identifies with who you are. And that's how I started to sort of dig a bit deep into what Rastafari was about and found that you could pray anywhere, you could pray to anybody, with anyone. But as long as you know who you are, then yourself is fulfilled. And I wanted to be Levi Roots, not Keith Graham, and that's how I managed to make that change.

Presenter8:25

And very much in that vein then, tell me about your second disc.

Levi Roots8:28

Yeah, well the second diss is it's got to be from the great man himself. You know Bob Mali is a massive inspiration for me and this song is an anthem for Asters. It was the speech made by his Imperial Majesty Emperor El Selassie when he was in exile here in the UK in Bath. Mussolini had invaded Abyssinia. He went to the United Nations and he made the speech and he managed to get the troops together from the UN and went back to Ethiopia and drove Mussolini out. Bob Mali got the words to the song and he decided to turn the speech of his Imperial Majesty's into this iconic song called War. So let's have a listen to that.

Speaker 29:06

Until the philosophy which hold one race superior and another.

Speaker 29:16

And feel ya.

Speaker 29:19

It's finally

Speaker 29:22

And permanently

Speaker 29:26

Discredited

Speaker 29:29

And abondon.

Speaker 29:32

Everywhere is water.

Presenter9:36

Uh

Speaker 29:36

Miss a wire.

Presenter9:38

That was Bob Marley at Anne Waugh. So, Levi Roots, as we know then, you were born. It was actually Keith Valentine. Graham, Keith Valentine.

Levi Roots9:44

Graham, Valentine Graham. You're only allowed to call me that. I can hear you. Yeah, okay. I won't mention that.

Presenter9:47

Yeah.

Presenter9:50

For a moment. You really don't have to be Levite. So um that was in Jamaica as we know. Doreen and LaSalle were your parents. At the time you were the youngest of of five. What was family life like? Do you have memories of early family life?

Levi Roots10:00

I have indeed. I have wonderful memories. I have beautiful memories of my, you know, my wonderful grandma. To me, she was mom, dad and granny and everything in one. Um, because I I I was a bit young when my parents left. You were four? I was four. The key thing then was just to get a job, send for the kids, educate them and then to return. That was the plan. But it never worked out like I like.

Presenter10:24

And it was when you were four, your parents left for the UK. That was very early sixties then.

Levi Roots10:29

Yes. And of course, then all kids back then were left with the grandma. And the plan was every year they would lose one. And you can imagine what it was like for grandmas then, you know, to grow up these kids, you know, for four or five years. Seeing one of her charges go every year, knowing that she probably won't never see them again, it was a really tough one for her. Tell me more about your grandma, Miriam. It was. What was she like? She was beautiful, you know, beautiful bone structure, a bit like my mom. Long grey hair at the time that she had, and a real workaholic. Everyone loved her. I mean, my house would be full of people when I come from play as a 10-year-old boy and you know, the smells of our house, my grandma cooking. What did she cook? My grandfather had a little farm, so we weren't that poor that I can't remember she ever going to a supermarket. So when you say what did she cook, it was stuff that we grew. You know, everything that went into the pot was things that she could send me out in the garden to pick or to send my grandfather to catch a chicken or something like that. So it was all what we call yard food, food that was grown in the yard. And even though, you know, we were a poor family, her skill was just using spices to make a delicious meal that would draw the neighbors from miles around when she was cooking.

Speaker 211:16

Uh

Speaker 311:16

Right.

Speaker 211:16

Uh

Presenter11:41

And you were so close to her, and she took such great care of you. You were the youngest. Uh tell me about the last time you saw her then. What age would you have been?

Levi Roots11:49

Oh, I was ten and a half and my suitcase had arrived, finally, because I'd seen my brothers and sisters' suitcase arriving every year and didn't think it would happen to me. I was too close to my grandma. I'd never thought I would leave her. And it was one of the saddest things I remember as a child. And knowing that I'm going to go, because every time my brothers or sisters went, they never came back. I don't have much memories of actually the leaving her of that date because I was probably too distraught to sort of remember the day. But all the happenings up before that, you know, it was v still very vivid in my mind. And she telling me about the things that I should remember. You know, she was saying, look after yourself. When you get to UK, this is what you're going to do. You've got to eat fresh food.

Levi Roots12:43

And I never saw her again. She she died maybe four or five years after.

Levi Roots12:48

me coming to the UK and uh memories is what I try to keep alive in in my products and and in my sources.

Presenter12:55

Let's have some music then, Levi. Tell me what we're gonna hear. This is your third one of the morning.

Levi Roots13:00

Oh for you.

Presenter13:02

It's okay, just take your time.

Levi Roots13:04

This next this next one.

Levi Roots13:06

Is actually one of the first songs that I heard on the radio when I got here, when I missed her so much.

Levi Roots13:13

Music was very close to her because she was one of the main singers in our local church. And my father loved music too, and he was always at the radio on. And when I came to this country about a week after, I started to listen to songs on the radio. And I heard this brilliant track, you know, from Dean Warwick. And I think it was her voice that captivated me, that sounded like my grandma's singing, because she had a great voice, my grandma. And whenever time I listened to this song, it reminds me that I miss my grandma, but there was something else, because I was now making connection with my mom, who I'd missed daily and I didn't know for a long time.

Speaker 313:52

If you see me walking down the street, And I start to cry each time we meet.

Speaker 314:01

Welcome back.

Speaker 314:04

Walk on by make me leave

Speaker 314:12

You don't see the tears, just let me grieve In private, cause each time I see you, I break down and cry.

Speaker 314:25

Walk on my stomp stop.

Presenter14:31

Walk on by, Dion Warwick. Um tell me then, Levi, this little ten and a half, eleven-year-old boy who came from Jamaica to Tuls Hill in South London, as his family

Levi Roots14:39

Don't ask his f

Presenter14:41

got to know him and he got to know them. How comfortable a relationship was that?

Levi Roots14:45

The relationship

Levi Roots14:47

It it wasn't quite comfortable as as you put it, because I I d I do think for both my father and myself it became a bit of a challenge.

Levi Roots14:57

Because obviously I didn't know this man. You know, for me, he was a bit of a stranger. Even when I was a small boy in Jamaica, because your father is out, you know, he's in the sugar cane fields trying to make a living. My mom was fine, you know, she was a very great protector of me and knowing that I missed my grandma. But I'd come over and now, you know, my parents had now had a daughter, my sister, Marcia, and she was the champion of my father. So I struggled when I came over. Now I was expecting to get all this love as the sort of the youngest one. And in some ways, I was sort of displaced and didn't get the attention that I thought I deserved, all the attention I wanted from him. And I don't think he knew what to do with me. My other brothers and sisters all sort of went to school before they left Jamaica. But being the youngest, I never got any education while I was there.

Levi Roots15:49

And I think I was a bit of a disappointment to him.

Presenter15:53

Did he talk to you about that?

Levi Roots15:55

We never got that far.

Levi Roots15:57

Yes, I would have wanted, you know, I see his lovely car outside, you know, he had this fantastic Woozley, brilliant car, big and everything. And my sort of secret joy was to one day my dad would have said, come, son, you know, let this go for a drive, just the two of us in it and have a chat. That was a secret sort of wish of mine, but it never happened. I think that that would have been something for me that perhaps would have changed my life around and not sort of struggling the way that I did to do with that father figure that I seeked out in everybody that I could in the Rastafarian community, someone to sort of to be a leader of me. I now have a three-year-old son. And for me, it's doing it the right way now and not having anything at all sort of bounced off from my father, apart from that hard work ethics. But I do speak to my mom recently about where do I get me from? You know, why do I do the things that I do and all that, and sort of change my life around? Where does it come from? And she tells me that it's from him, you know, which is sort of taking away a little bit of that hard feeling that I had towards him over the years by knowing that whoever I am and whatever I have and my abilities to be this Levi Roots person that I've learned to be, because I wasn't always, you know, as fab as I am.

Presenter17:30

You've got to smile on your face actually talking for you saying that.

Levi Roots17:30

I wonder if you're telling people who are saying that. Yeah, she tells me that, you know, this is your father, this is who he is.

Presenter17:37

When you were at school and when you arrived there I mean tricky. You know, you arrive you're eleven. Being eleven is difficult enough. The fact you can't read and write, you know, just really throws something pretty toxic into the mix. You learned quickly. You always had your your nose in a book. You did okay in school.

Levi Roots17:46

Yeah.

Levi Roots17:52

I did. I caught up very quickly. I I think I had the abilities, as I says, it was always there. Down to my mom sort of grabbing the reins, you know, and knewing that I was struggling. She knew that I was getting into trouble trying to be this cool kid and show off in front of everybody else. And she sort of picked it up and says, you're not at school when you're at home. You're at a different school. And this is how I actually learned by she teaching me at home.

Levi Roots18:17

Yeah.

Presenter18:18

Time for some more music, Levi. Tell me about this. This is your fourth.

Levi Roots18:21

I remember the film The Harder They Come, which is one of the most iconic movies coming out of the Caribbean, out of Jamaica. I do think it's a really wonderful film, starring the fantastic Jimmy Cliff. My finest moment in the film is when the song came on, Many Rivers to Cross, when in all the mayhem of the movie and everything, there was this one moment where Jimmy Cliff is stranded on a beach and then this song comes on and it just changes the whole vibe of the movie.

Speaker 318:48

Many rivers the call

Speaker 318:53

But I can't seem to find

Speaker 318:58

My way over.

Speaker 319:09

As I travel along.

Speaker 319:13

Why can't

Speaker 319:18

Many reverse the problem

Speaker 319:22

And it's only my will.

Presenter19:26

That was Jimmy Cliff and many rivers to cross. So, uh, Levi, a lot it strikes me that nineteen seventy six was quite an eventful year for you, because it was the year when you were you were eighteen, you just turned eighteen. We know about you embracing Rastafari. It was also the year that your parents separated. And you had your

Levi Roots19:39

Yeah.

Levi Roots19:44

First child.

Presenter19:44

Yeah.

Levi Roots19:45

I did. I did. And it's why I I keep going back to role models and how important important it is that if my father had taken me for that drive in you know in in the WooSlee, you know, perhaps the conversation would have been about, you know, you know, hey son, you've got to, you know, make sure that you remain focused on on your head and, you know, go ahead and do something fantastic with with your life.

Presenter20:06

What was in your head at the time? I mean, when you found out you were going to be a father, when the baby came along, how did you cope at the time?

Levi Roots20:14

Well, I caught by having fun. For me it was about

Levi Roots20:18

Being about myself. It wasn't about anyone else. I was now having a great time that I was free from my father's sort of clutches. I'd now left home. I was involved in the music. I had met the great Lloyd Coxon from the sound system, Sir Coxon, and he heard me sing and said, You know, you're an 18-year-old kid, come along and I'll produce you. And for me, that was it. You know, that's what I always wanted.

Presenter20:43

And your dad had wanted you to get into a sort of profession. You indeed you went to be a trainee engineer, a lathe operator.

Levi Roots20:46

Do you like it?

Levi Roots20:47

Yeah, which he was very pleased with that at the outset because I was now doing something that he perhaps would have wanted me to do.

Presenter20:54

And what happened to that? How long did you stick at that?

Levi Roots20:56

I sticked for that for about two years. My brother had got the job for me and you know for me it was for him it was great that he got me into the employment in the first place. And I did well. I wasn't bad at it but I wanted the music. I wanted to be on stage. I felt like I didn't belong in a you know in an engineering shop pulling on a lathe on a lathe machine. I thought I belong on a stage with a microphone in my hand and I wanted to get that. So I gave up the job to the shock of my father and I left home and as it says joined the circus. In my case it was joined a sound system but that was history.

Presenter21:34

Let's just take a snapshot of Brixton in the 70s. You know, they're out of the 70s and into the early 80s. Of course, many people will remember the terrible riots in Brixton. It was a time of the police stop and search policies. There was an inquiry by Lord Scarman subsequently. You yourself, as a young Rastafarian British man living in Brixton in the 80s, what do you remember?

Levi Roots21:41

Yeah.

Levi Roots21:45

Yeah.

Levi Roots21:47

Yeah.

Levi Roots21:57

Oh, I remember terrible housing. I remember lack of jobs.

Levi Roots22:03

I remember a police state.

Presenter22:07

Police state that strong words.

Levi Roots22:09

Yes, and but most importantly I remember the Sus laws.

Presenter22:12

Yeah, stop and start.

Levi Roots22:13

stop and search though, which was the scourge to all black, you know, boys and girls.'Cause you didn't have to do anything to get in trouble then or for a police to be intrusive and and stop and search you and hence if you know whatever you said could be you could spend the night in in a police prison.

Presenter22:31

And just to remind people, I mean it was deemed acceptable under law for police to stop and search people if they were just loitering in public places with what was called criminal intent.

Levi Roots22:34

For please

Levi Roots22:37

Yeah.

Levi Roots22:39

Yeah, yeah, which and what was criminal intent?

Presenter22:42

And this happened to you repeatedly, did it?

Levi Roots22:44

This happened, of course, absolutely. And I was rebellious back then, like many youths back then. You wanted change. Let's have some more music, Levi Roots. It's your fifth. What's this? Yeah, well, again, now this is another fantastic lady in the music industry that inspired me. I think I'd like to send this one request to my mum.

Presenter23:04

You may.

Levi Roots23:04

Me? Yes. And it's Aretha Franklin and with her track called Respect.

Speaker 323:10

What you are

Speaker 323:15

Are you deep food?

Speaker 323:16

You know I got it through.

Speaker 323:19

All I'm asking who

Speaker 323:21

Spot in the respect when you just win a bit back.

Speaker 323:24

Just a little bit, hello, just a little bit, mister, just a little bit.

Speaker 323:31

I ain't gonna do you wrong!

Speaker 323:33

Why you go?

Speaker 323:37

Ha ha ha ha ha ha.

Speaker 323:43

That's what it is.

Presenter23:45

That was Aretha Franklin and Respect, and you said, Levi Roots. We don't usually do dedications on this program, but you're going to dedicate that one to your mother, and goodness knows it sounds like she deserves it. By 1986, then, you were in your late 20s. You were running a youth and community center in Brixton. You were convicted there of unlawful possession of a firearm, of conspiracy to supply Class A drugs. I've read you say that you were.

Speaker 323:50

Yeah.

Levi Roots23:50

But you go

Levi Roots23:53

Thank you very much.

Speaker 323:54

Yeah.

Presenter24:10

A good prisoner. What is a good prisoner?

Levi Roots24:12

A good prisoner, I think, is one that finds himself or herself.

Levi Roots24:17

Being incarcerated gives you that opportunity to to find that elusive self. I I don't think I turned to be good overnight. You know, it was having the time to become good'cause you went in bad,'cause that's why you're there in the first place.

Presenter24:33

So it created a space in which you were given the opportunity to, if you like, pause the life you were on.

Levi Roots24:39

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And and it's to make that methamorphous from the Keith, which I think that's what used to get me in trouble. You know, that's that's the part of me that's that's unfocused. I I do think while I was incarcerated it it allowed that Levi person to come through, you know, the the the person that loves to cook and loves to sing and and and loves to articulate. That's that's the part of me that I found while I was away.

Presenter25:05

Was it a literal epiphany? Did you think I have a choice here and I feel the choice I'm making is this?

Levi Roots25:12

No, actually it was someone that I met while I was there. I met this wonderful New Zealand lady that came in to the prison maybe once a week and taught drama and elocution lessons to people that were near to the end of their sentences. And I went into her office and she said, you know, Levi, this is your moment. I'm going to teach you how to be the real Levi.

Levi Roots25:37

And it was the beginning of a fantastic relationship of this once a week, you know, she would come in and change my life completely. Brought the books in that I should be reading. But she was saying, you got to keep going because if you are to focus in anything, it's just like a book. You know, you've got to know the beginning, the middle, and before you know what the ending is about. And then she would bring Shakespeare into my life also. She taught elocution lessons about, you know, for me to talk properly. And for two years, I had this most wonderful teaching from this lady.

Presenter26:10

Let's have your sixth piece of music, Levi Roots, tell me.

Levi Roots26:12

Yeah, the six my sixth piece of music. Well, I think if in if they're anyone out there that knows my life before, you know, in sound system and know my music, they'll think that, yeah, this is a Levi Root style because it's the Abyssinians and it's called Declarations of Rights.

Speaker 326:29

Oh no

Speaker 326:35

I've seen one

Speaker 326:39

He's a

Speaker 326:50

It's worse than I said get up and fight for your right

Presenter27:02

The Abyssinians and Declaration of Rights. So, Levi Roots, you had been selling, as is now the stuff of legend, your hot sauce. You're at Jerich Sauce at the Nossing Hill Carnival for run about fifteen years before you were approached actually by a BBC producer at a food event that you were working at, who said, Have you ever thought about trying to make this a bigger business? And do you know about Dragon's Den? and the answer was

Levi Roots27:21

Uh

Speaker 327:21

Yeah.

Speaker 327:25

No.

Levi Roots27:25

What?

Speaker 327:26

Ah

Presenter27:27

And you told your family that you'd been approached for Dragon's Den, and what did your kids say to you?

Levi Roots27:31

My kids at their words read dad no one with three foot long dreadlocks is gonna be no dragon slayer on dragons then that was their exact words you know because I I I do think that because they knew that I'd carved out a musical career for myself. So they were thinking that you know dad on T V with a guitar and a show about finance and enterprise it's not gonna be cool for them. But you know as I've always said that my main thing was that if you've got kids and they think that you're not cool to do something, what do you do? You do it just to prove them

Presenter28:01

You didn't know the show. You did charm the dragons, as they're known. But, I mean, they picked holes in your pitch. You know, you'd got your figures all wrong, you were adding knots where there weren't any. But in the end, two dragons decided that they would invest. And within just a few short months, your sauce was on the shelves in Sainsbury's. Did you walk into a Sainsbury's and buy a sauce?

Levi Roots28:08

It's you know you've got your

Levi Roots28:10

Only you were

Levi Roots28:11

Yeah, but it's

Levi Roots28:22

Yeah.

Presenter28:23

So it took off from the get-go, as is very often the case with people who make successful businesses. You find yourself on the wrong end of a lawsuit. It was twenty eleven, I think, when somebody you used to know said that they had been in at the beginning and that the flavors were to do with them.

Levi Roots28:23

Yeah.

Levi Roots28:33

Yeah.

Speaker 328:33

Yeah.

Levi Roots28:34

Uh

Presenter28:39

The judge found in your favour. I'm sure it was a bruising experience. What did you learn from it?

Levi Roots28:44

you've got to make sure that once you do your business plan, you sort of wrap up all the stuff to do with who owns recipes and who doesn't and all that kind of stuff because I didn't in the first place. So that became a serious lesson for us. And now I teach that to other people as well.

Presenter29:00

Let's have some more music, Levi Roots. Um it's your seventh.

Levi Roots29:03

Yeah, my seven songs. Yeah, this is the most fun one though.

Levi Roots29:07

Yeah, it's Beyonce and it's Single Ladies. And I've chosen this one because I think being on a desert island, I'm gonna need a party vibes in to feeling. Whenever time I hear this song, I can't hide the feeling that I feel like I wanna get up and and dance. I love this one, Single Ladies by Beyonce.

Speaker 329:26

All the single ladies, all the single ladies, all the single ladies, all the single ladies, all the single ladies, all the single ladies, all the single ladies. Now put your hands up.

Speaker 329:36

Up in the club, just pop up I'm doing my all the thing You decided to dip him And now you wanna trip another brother notice me I'm up on him You're only doing any attention Just crying my tears here, three good tears here You can't get mad at me Cause if you like a thing, you should've put a ring on it

Presenter30:01

That was Beyoncé and Single Ladies, and both of us Levi roots managed not to dance during that, which was quite something. Um you're a father of eight. Yes. Um by seven different mothers. You've never been married. Never.

Levi Roots30:05

The

Speaker 330:05

Yeah.

Presenter30:13

Tell tell me about that.

Levi Roots30:14

Lord, how long have you got? I love my kids. I think that they're the most valuable possession, if I can call them that, you know, thing that I have. I've now learned how to be a proper father. I do think I was rubbish in my earlier, because my young son now, which is three and a half, and my last child before him is 28. I do remember all of these moments that I should have been there, that I wasn't. So there's a lot of memories, missed opportunities that do come floating by. But I do think the way I've led my life since then, hopefully, you know, they'll look at that and be very proud that their father has managed to be able to do these things for them.

Presenter30:57

You are somebody with a lot of charisma, and you seem to be very at home in your skin. When you think about the guy who spent time in prison, when you think about the young man who who didn't have the father that he needed,

Presenter31:09

Where you are now, does it feel like a good place?

Levi Roots31:12

I am the best of me. I do think I've got to that point where I am able to focus. I I know what I can give. So uh in my skin at the moment I I I do feel fulfilled.

Presenter31:25

Yeah.

Levi Roots31:25

Your eighth. Tell me about this final discourse. Yeah, well, this next final one, yeah, I had to sort of draw this one out, as we say, in Patwar. And it's Garnet Silk, who a lot of people thought that, you know, he would have been the next Bob Marley. But unfortunately, he passed away before he could really make his moment. And this song is just really one about Africa. And I care immensely about that continent. And to hear Garnet singing Hello, Mama, Africa. And that's what I wanted to say: hello, everybody in Africa. So let's draw this one.

Speaker 331:57

Titanus the first

Speaker 332:06

How are you?

Speaker 332:08

I'm feeling fine and I hope you're fine too. Hello, Mama, Africa. How are you?

Speaker 332:19

I'm hoping you hear these words, your grace turned home.

Speaker 332:27

We still need

Presenter32:30

That was Garnet Silk and Mama Africa. You were saying during that Levi Roots you were enjoying the music but you said you know what the only thing that's not on this list that should be is Beethoven's fifth. You just it didn't make the cut. It only just didn't make the cut.

Levi Roots32:38

Just it didn't make the cut.

Levi Roots32:40

It only just didn't make it. Yeah, the thought was there, but then I just thought the selection really flowed really well as it was.

Presenter32:48

It's time then, Levi, for me to give you the books, as I do for everybody. It's the complete works of Shakespeare and the Bible, too, and you get to take another book along with those. What what is your additional book going to be?

Levi Roots32:58

Well my additional book I'll probably take a long walk to freedom.

Levi Roots33:02

An else Mandela.

Presenter33:04

We'll give you that now.

Presenter33:05

You're also allowed to take a luxury.

Levi Roots33:08

Maybe my guitar. I don't think I could leave that behind. That's yours.

Presenter33:13

And if I were to press you just to choose one of the eight discs, which one single disc would you choose above all others?

Levi Roots33:20

I think B and Warwick will conby.

Presenter33:23

It's yours. Levi Roots, thank you very much for letting us see your desert island discs.

Levi Roots33:27

Thank you, Kirsty.

Presenter34:08

You've been listening to a download from the BBC. You'll find more information on the Radio 4 website: bbc.co.uk slash Radio 4.