Ben Lyon

Speaker 10:00

Hello, I'm Kirsty Young, and this is a download from the Desert Island Discs archive.

Speaker 10:05

For rights reasons, we've had to shorten the music.

Speaker 10:09

Full details can be found on the Castaways page on the Desert Island Disc's website.

Speaker 10:14

The programme was originally broadcast in nineteen fifty eight.

Presenter0:18

This is the BBC Home Service.

Speaker 10:21

This is a recording of Desert Island Discs as it was being broadcast, rather than the studio recording.

Speaker 10:27

And for that reason you may hear some interference and some degradation in the sound quality.

Presenter0:33

Desert Island Discs.

Presenter0:42

Each week, a well-known person is asked the question, if you were to be cast away alone on a desert island, which eight gramophone records would you choose to have with you, assuming, of course, that you also had a gramophone?

Presenter0:53

As usual, the week's castaway is introduced by Roy Plumley.

Presenter0:58

How do you do, ladies and gentlemen?

Presenter1:00

On our Desert Island this week is a start of radio, television, films and variety.

Presenter1:04

He's very much a family man.

Presenter1:06

He's head, or likes to think so, of a very famous family. Here at 12stone 6, 6 feet 1, and never more than 37 years old, is Ben Lyon. Oh, wait a minute. Just a minute, Roy. Not 37, 36. I'm sorry. Wrong information from Bebe. My birthday is next month. I'll send you a card. Is that all?

Ben Lyon1:24

Yeah.

Presenter1:25

Welcome ashore, Ben. You've brought your records, I see. Have you got a big collection at home? Well, I was told I could take eight records if I were shipwrecked on this island, so I have them. Mm-hmm. What sort of records do you think would be first value on a desert island? Well, I think under the circumstances, I would take nostalgic and melodious records. Fine. I'm not a highbrow, you know. Do you play any instrument yourself? Well, I.

Presenter1:48

Did try the piano once, but they laughed at me when I sat down, and I think they're still laughing, so I've never tried again. There is, of course, plenty of musical talent in the family who get plenty of music at home. Oh, yes, yes. BB sings a great deal, and you know, Barbara's followed in her footsteps, and oh, by the way, Barbara plays the piano very well, too, but I can't get her to do it now, because she said it breaks her fingernails.

Presenter2:09

What's the first record you've chosen? Well, Roy, the first one I brought along to play is a lovely record, I think, by the Mellocrino Orchestra entitled Beyond the Blue Horizon.

Presenter2:21

I imagine that, well, I've always wanted to be beyond the blue horizon. Now you're there. Now I'm there. And another thing, this would remind me to keep an eye on the sky as well as the horizon for a possible passing ship or a plane overhead so I could signal them to bring me back to civilization. Well, let's hear the disc.

Speaker 12:26

Now you're back.

Presenter3:10

Beyond the Blue Horizon. What's the next one, Ben? Well, the next one, Roy, is a record that Beebe made some years ago called As Round and Round We Go. Well, that was from a show you were both in, wasn't it? Yes, it's from a Haw Haw, a show we did at the old Hoban Empire before it was blitz. Mm-hmm. And you see, I'd like to have this record with me because, well, being shipwrecked, it would be a chance to hear BB and have her with me in record form, if not in person. And I'd like to have you listen carefully to the lyrics because they're lovely. I used to stand in the wings every night and watch this number, this production number. It was produced beautifully by the late George Black, and I hope you like it.

Ben Lyon3:50

Wonderful night with all the world in white and you beside me Wonderful night to hear the music playing sweet and low As round and round And round and round And round and round we go Swinging along the ice is awfully nice With you besides

Presenter4:20

Yes, that's a charming little song.

Presenter4:22

Then let's go back to the beginning.

Speaker 34:23

What part of the United States are you from, first of all?

Presenter4:25

Well, I'm from the deep south, Atlanta, Georgia.

Speaker 34:29

Any tradition in the family for the theatre?

Presenter4:31

No, I'm afraid I was the only outcast of the family, the only one in the theater. How did it all start?

Speaker 34:34

Yeah.

Presenter4:37

Well, Roy, I suppose I'm no different from millions of other people.

Presenter4:41

I think we all go through a stage in our lives when we become stage-struck. Well, it so happened that my mother had to move our family to New York when my sister attended Columbia University. And of course, I entered school there as well, not Columbia University. And on my way to school, I used to pass the famous player Studios, and I noticed a sign said Casting Office. And I dropped in one day, and I said, How do you get in pictures? They said.

Presenter5:04

You'll do.

Presenter5:05

So, uh, I was taken in, scared to death, and given a day's work. A as what? Oh, as an extra. Uh-huh. How old were you then?

Presenter5:12

I was about uh sixteen. Did you do any more extra work after that?

Presenter5:16

Oh yes, quite a bit. Uh quite a bit.

Presenter5:19

I used to be paid the large sum of $2.50 a day. Oh, a lot of money.

Presenter5:24

Well, it's a lot of money, Roy, but uh I must tell you uh something else about that. It used to cost me two dollars and fifty cents a day to rent my dress suit, thirty cents for lunch and twenty cents for car fare, so every day I worked I lost uh fifty cents, about three shillings. Something wrong there.

Presenter5:38

When did you start in the theatre?

Presenter5:40

Well, I was an unsuccessful extra for about three years. You know, there's nothing lower than that. And fortunately, Sam Goldwyn put me on the stage and then took me from the stage to Hollywood under contract. And then I began playing parts in the silent films out there. Well, having got you to that stage in your career, having got you to Hollywood, let's break off and have another record. What's your third one?

Speaker 15:56

In the

Presenter6:04

Well, my third record is one that

Presenter6:07

is a rather unusual one.

Presenter6:09

But one of my favorites. It has a

Presenter6:13

Sort of a Corsican atmosphere to me, and I imagine I would be shipwrecked on that type of island, something in the tropics, I hope, where it's nice and warm. Yeah, they wouldn't call Corsica tropical, exactly. Well, no, I beg your pardon. I meant in the warm climate. I was wrong there. But this is called Amond's Theme.

Presenter6:30

And uh it's most unusual. I I think you'll like me.

Ben Lyon6:34

I see your face, it's everywhere I smell the fragrance of your hair, and feel your touch.

Ben Lyon6:45

In everything I do

Ben Lyon6:51

I wonder what your heart is saying I wonder if you hear them playing the song that frames me yesterday and

Presenter7:07

Armin's theme, played by Ken Jones in his music, with the tonet.

Presenter7:12

Well, getting back to your career then, you went to Hollywood.

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with Sam Goldwyn.

Presenter7:17

Um I remember you starred in a lot of famous silent pictures then with Paula Negri and Gloria Swanson.

Presenter7:23

Cardian Moore, Gene Harlow

Presenter7:26

Oh yes, yes. You know, I discovered Gene Harlow, right? Did you? Yes. And she was a lovely artist.

Speaker 37:28

Did you?

Presenter7:30

I remember seeing her in Hell's Angels. Oh, yes, yes. I don't know how many times I saw that picture. Do you know? I can remember every shot of that picture. Really?

Speaker 37:32

It is

Presenter7:38

Some splendid performances. I remember, of course, Gene Harlow, James Hall, John Farrow was there, Frank Clark.

Speaker 17:43

Oh yes, yes.

Presenter7:46

Roscoe Turner. I I I can see it now, you know. Yes, well don't you remember anyone else, uh Roy? No, I I don't exactly.

Presenter7:53

You see, there was a chap at the end of the picture that was shot in the back by his brother. Gave a very fine performance. Think carefully.

Speaker 38:01

Thank you.

Speaker 38:02

Yeah, so I'm I'm thinking.

Presenter8:04

It uh well, his uh initials are Ben Lyon, you remember?

Speaker 38:04

Yeah.

Presenter8:08

Oh, you were in it? Yes, Roy, I was. Did you have any lines?

Speaker 38:10

Yeah.

Presenter8:13

Oh yes, I had uh about as many lines as I have in my face now.

Speaker 38:18

Funny thing though. I'm gonna see it again.

Presenter8:20

Well changing the subject Ben, where did you first meet Bibi? In a in the studio? No, Roy, I first met Beabe at a bridge party in Hollywood, a dinner party one night. You know, Hollywood used to be mad over bridge, and uh they asked if I'd make a fourth, and I said yes. Of course, I didn't tell them that I didn't play bridge.

Presenter8:37

But I was anxious to be at the table with Beebe.

Presenter8:40

And uh they started playing and I didn't know one card from another, so

Presenter8:45

I did have sense enough to follow suit. When they played a spade, I played a spade. A heart, I played a heart. Well, it was all right until I ran out of cards to follow suit. Then I played a card that apparently took a trick, and it was a fantastic double finesse or whatever it may be in bridge, and they thought I was fantastic until the next play, and then they caught on. I didn't know a thing about bridge. But that was the start of our romance. Peepee forgave you. That led to Wedding Build. That's right, June the 14th, 1930. You see, I even remember the date.

Presenter9:13

Well let's have some more music.

Presenter9:14

Well, let's see my next record.

Presenter9:17

would give me the opportunity of having another member of my family with me, and it's a record by Barbara.

Presenter9:23

Call Storway. I'm rather proud of this record because it was her

Presenter9:28

Debut as a singer.

Presenter9:30

And one I particularly like.

Ben Lyon9:33

I'd like to go away.

Ben Lyon9:38

Bear a stow away

Speaker 19:39

Yeah.

Ben Lyon9:43

Take a trip on a ship.

Ben Lyon9:48

Let my worries blow away There are still many treasure isles

Ben Lyon9:58

Good boy.

Presenter9:59

Well while that bit that very nice record of operas was playing, I was doing doodling some figures here, Ben. Uh he married in 1930.

Presenter10:06

That's right, yes. I'm thirty-six now. Oh, you were eight years old. It's all right, yes. When did you

Speaker 310:11

Two first

Presenter10:11

Come to England. All right, I catch on. First came to England in June

Presenter10:19

1933, Beebe and I came over here to make some films. Beebe made two and I made one.

Presenter10:25

Then we went back to the States and returned again in June.

Presenter10:30

1936, we came for three weeks' appearance at the Palladium Theater. You were some of the first American stars to appear at the Palladium, weren't you? Yes, I think we played the Palladium before it became the American Embassy.

Presenter10:41

You came just for three weeks. That's all. But while we were there some

Presenter10:45

managements came to us and said, Will you play a week in Glasgow, a week in Edinburgh and Sheffield, Leeds, various places and I suppose we were hams, we were getting a great kick out of a live audience and uh we accepted and before we knew it, a year had passed and we were committed for the next year, so we came back and

Presenter11:04

Well, twenty-one years later, we're still here.

Presenter11:06

Well, we owe you a lot for high gang, Ben. That did a lot to cheer us up during the war. Well, we had a lot of fun doing it, I believe me. It was comforting during the Blitz to hear that opening line of yours. This is Highgang coming to you from the heart of London.

Presenter11:18

Well, Roy, we thought it was a good answer to Germany's claim that London was flat on the ground. Hm. Well, then you you left us after after that to go to the United States Air Force, didn't you?

Speaker 311:27

Yeah.

Presenter11:28

Yes, Beebe and I were doing uh another show at the Palladium called Gangway, which closed December fourteenth, nineteen forty two, and I

Presenter11:34

Joined the Air Force the following day and remained in service until the war ended. And then I went to Hollywood in 1945 and

Presenter11:41

And uh was given the job of casting director with one of Hollywood's major film companies. I believe you discovered, among others, Marilyn Munro. Yes, I'm very proud of Marilyn. It she came into my office completely unknown in August 1947 and

Presenter11:58

I signed her immediately on a seven year contract.

Presenter12:01

And uh then we discussed her name. Her real name is Norma Jean Doherty, which is rather a long name for lights. And uh I said we'd have to change it. She agreed. So

Presenter12:13

I named her Marilyn after a very famous stage star in New York named Marilyn Miller. Oh, yes. And it's rather strange, Roy, that uh

Presenter12:21

Today, she has really become Marilyn Miller since her marriage to Arthur Miller. Arthur Miller, of course.

Presenter12:28

Well, you certainly have an eye for picking blondes, haven't you? Quiet BB may be listening. Let's have another echo. All right. Well, let's see now. I would like to play next the Coronation Scott by Sydney Torches Orchestra.

Presenter12:40

You see, Roy this record

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It takes me back to our first visit up to Glasgow and Edinburgh.

Presenter12:47

And all through the Highlands we had a tour there. It's a wonderful record and I think it's very exciting.

Presenter13:52

The coronation of Scotland to Scotland. Where do we go now?

Presenter13:55

Well, Bibi and I have always been a great admirer of a lovely girl in this country named Vera Lynn.

Presenter14:03

And since I will be spending a lot of time on this desert island, I imagine, before being rescued,

Presenter14:11

I would like to take with me her recording of As Time Goes By.

Presenter14:16

It's a wonderful one.

Ben Lyon14:18

You must remember this.

Ben Lyon14:21

The kiss is still a kiss.

Ben Lyon14:25

A sigh is just a sigh The fundamental things apply as time goes by

Presenter14:44

Ben, you're sitting on this island listening to Vera Lynn. How do you think you're going to manage? Are you a practical man? Can you build things, make things? Well, I'm not a very good do-it-yourself man, but I'd find a way. I'd have to.

Presenter14:56

I first of all would look for a mound and then I'd dig myself a cave. You see, Roy, I've listened to a lot of your programs and I've heard your various guests talk about how they will build a hut with the palm leaves and all that sort of thing, but it worries me a little bit because they have terrific tropical rains and I'm certain those huts would leak. I'm living in an old house that my roof leaks, so I want to be protected down on this island. Something solid? Solid, yes. What are you going to eat? Eat? Well, I'd look for root vegetables, fruit, nuts, coconuts, drink the milk. Ever do any fishing?

Presenter15:31

Yes, I'm a fairly good fisherman. You have no tackle, of course. You'd have to improvise that. Well, I think I would take, I'd probably have one of my gold cufflinks or a tie clasp, and I'd tie that onto the end of a creeper and drag it through the water, sort of troll it, and as a fish came along to attack this shining object, I'd hit him over the head with a club. Well, it's a nice idea, at any rate.

Presenter15:52

Could you uh light a file?

Presenter15:55

Oh yes, I was a Boy Scout once. Good. Well, you seem to have all the right ideas, Ben. You have your Castways badge, first class. Thank you very much. Let's have record number seven.

Presenter16:05

Well, record number seven would be another exciting one because I feel there must be a change in tempo. I wouldn't w always want the melodious, slow numbers. I'd want something to excite me, and I've selected Fiddle Fab.

Speaker 316:46

Fiddle

Presenter16:47

Full Saddle by Leroy Anderson, played by the Kingsway Symphony Orchestra.

Presenter16:51

Now your last one, Ben. What have you saved until the end? Well, the last one is uh

Presenter16:55

Another lovely one.

Presenter16:57

And it's sung by Maxine Daniels. I don't seem to be able to get away from the Daniels here.

Presenter17:02

It's called The London I Love and the lyrics express my feelings about it.

Presenter17:07

London.

Ben Lyon17:07

Mayfair Hotel.

Ben Lyon17:11

Their windows beaming

Ben Lyon17:15

Chiming of bells, the river gleaming.

Ben Lyon17:22

You are my dream, I'm always dreaming.

Presenter17:43

There are your eight records, Ben. You've got one more choice to make. Every castaway has one luxury article to take to the island. What have you chosen? Well, Roy, I'd want to take with me one of those little film projectors that you hold up to the light and crank my hand. To show yourself Hell's Angels in 10-foot lengths. Oh, no, no, no. Don't bring that up again. No, I'd take some film that the family made together, and then I'd be able to run it and see them as well as hear them on records. Fine, useful habit. And thank you, Ben Lyon, for letting us hear your choice of Desert Island Disc. Give my love to the family with you. I will, Roy, and thank you for letting me stay a while on your Desert Island. Goodbye, everyone.

Speaker 318:38

The guest in today's recorded programme was Ben Lyon, the interviewer Roy Plumley and the producer Dennis Jones. Next Monday, the castaway will be Margaret Rawlings and on Saturday at 3 o'clock, we shall repeat a programme previously broadcast in this series in which the castaway will be Al Hines.

Speaker 119:02

You've been listening to a download from the Desert Island Discs archive.

Speaker 119:06

For more downloads, please visit the Radio 4 website.