Rene Redzepi

Presenter0:00

Hello, I'm Kirsty Young. Thank you for downloading this podcast of Desert Island Discs from BBC Radio 4. For rights reasons the music choices are shorter than in the radio broadcast.

Presenter0:10

For more information about the programme, please visit bbc.co.uk/slash radio four.

Presenter0:35

My castaway this week is the chef Rennie Redzeppi. His restaurant, Noma, in Copenhagen, has just been named the best in the world for a fourth time, and is garlanded with Michelin stars.

Presenter0:47

His cooking captures not just the essence of his homeland, using ingredients like reindeer tongue, sea buckthorn, or fish scales, but also a strong flavour of nao. He believes traditional notions of luxury are outdated a sense of time and place are his kitchen's guiding principles.

Presenter1:05

His childhood was split between Denmark and Macedonia, where he spent his summers foraging in the woods and catching fireflies for fun.

Presenter1:13

He as good as stumbled into catering just before it was fashionable, because he couldn't think of anything better to do, but pretty quickly realized that cooking, creating allowed him to dream.

Presenter1:24

He says, The day when there is no more to do is the day when you're burned out. There are endless possibilities. It's just whether you can see them or not, and right now I can see plenty. You say that cooking allowed you to dream then. Now any chef that I speak to tells me that working in a kitchen is a sort of hell-hole, really. It's pressurized, it's blisteringly hot, there are constant demands for service. I'm wondering when you dream.

Rene Redzepi1:47

Um

Rene Redzepi1:49

Well, that happens constantly all the time. You know, when it's winter I dream of spring, for instance.

Rene Redzepi1:55

And when it's spring, I dream of summer, and when it's summer, I dream of the berry season.

Rene Redzepi2:00

And I think dreaming using your imagination is something that's splendid to do in cooking, because there's so many ways of using ingredients, and there's so many ingredients. When you actually start seeing the world as your one big larder, then you can really start dreaming.

Presenter2:18

Yes, you've said that cooking is one of the most magical things you can do. Are you talking about the alchemy of putting tastes together?

Rene Redzepi2:24

If you go to where the ingredients are, and it's early winter, and you're brushing the leaves out of the forest floor, and you can see the young shoots coming out ready for spring, and you follow them in the weeks coming, and then when they're ready, you harvest them, you transport them back, and then you clean them, you process them, you cook them, and then you serve them right there that day for dinner, and people have a little moment.

Rene Redzepi2:50

To me that's just magic. You know, a moment that can only happen that day. I

Rene Redzepi2:55

Uh

Presenter2:56

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi2:56

It's just magic.

Presenter2:57

I'm a little bit worried for you because you're only thirty six and yet you've reached the very top of your profession already. Y you once said that I think perhaps if you reach number one it's the beginning of the end. Do you worry about that?

Rene Redzepi3:07

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi3:08

Oh, yeah. I had one of those burnouts where people were telling me, That's it. You're so young and you've already reached the ultimate goal. What are you going to do with the rest of your life? And the funny thing is that I had never opened NOMA with the ultimate goal of receiving accolades. You know, the ultimate goal was the understanding of what is the mouthful of our region. How does our region taste?

Rene Redzepi3:33

And I truly believe that we don't understand that yet we're infants in that respect.

Presenter3:38

Let's have some music, then, Renny Redzeppi. Tell me about your first choice today. What are we going to hear?

Rene Redzepi3:42

Well, it's a song called Linda Nena, which is a very classic tune in the Latin American countries and

Rene Redzepi3:49

Especially Latin America everywhere, but particularly Mexico, has become my second home, that's where I go to tap out from kitchens.

Speaker 43:58

I'm not sure if I can do it.

Presenter4:34

Kwanejo iso combo with Linda Nena. So tell me, Reni Redzeppi, um, before something makes it onto a plate in front of a customer in your restaurant, how long will it have been tried and tested for?

Rene Redzepi4:47

Well, hopefully, not too long, although sometimes it you know, an idea comes into fruition, it can take months at times. I prefer the moments where the intuition comes into play and immediately it happens. Unfortunately, to be able to have a team where the intuition is so strong and so vigorous, it takes years and years of practice to get there. So, typically,

Rene Redzepi5:12

Sometimes we spend literally months and months and months working on a carrot dish.

Presenter5:18

Now it's interesting you choose carrots, because I understand eighty percent of the food that makes it onto your menu is vegetable based. That's very unusual unl unless you're a vegetarian restaurant, because people who come into a Michelin starred restaurant would expect the filet mignon and the foie gras. Do you get disappointed diners? How do you explain to them that actually you do things differently?

Rene Redzepi5:23

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi5:26

Because people

Rene Redzepi5:36

I mean, of course we do get disappointed diners. It's impossible not to at any restaurant.

Rene Redzepi5:41

But the sort of old-fashioned ideal of what luxury is, it's something that I do not agree with at all. And once starting to explore the place that we were in Scandinavia, we're twenty-five million people in a landmass that's enormous. There's so much wilderness, and most of it is covered in vegetation. It was a natural inspiration for us. And then I also started thinking about my childhood. What did I eat when I was a kid? And we ate mostly plants and vegetables and lintels and beans. Why did we do that? Well, if we wanted meat, we had to slaughter one of the animals. And if you slaughtered one of them, there would be less milk, there would be less eggs, and so on. So it was a rare treat.

Rene Redzepi6:24

And then I started just changing completely my view on vegetables, whereas before I had seen them as simple garnishes, I could now suddenly see them as something strong enough to stand alone to be the lead guitarist of a dish.

Presenter6:38

You employ uh somebody who's called a forager, who goes out into these beautiful um forests and so on and finds the right stuff to cook. Do you test whether or not it's

Rene Redzepi6:43

The one in f

Rene Redzepi6:46

Poisonously. Oh, yeah. I mean, I would not encourage anybody to go out there without knowing what they're doing. There are things out there that can literally kill you. Do not do that. We have professional people that have studied this.

Presenter6:54

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi6:59

That forage for us.

Presenter7:01

There are people, and I'm sure you've had them as customers, people who think, well, if I'm paying top dollar, then I expect the expensive ingredient and there you are sort of slinging something on my plate that's been on the beach or in the forest. Is it not just a a very convenient dressed up way of just keeping the cost on a little bit?

Rene Redzepi7:10

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi7:17

Oh, I wish we were piling in the money. Unfortunately, it's all like that. But I will have to say something here, because.

Rene Redzepi7:24

Cavia is expensive, anybody who has enough money can get it.

Rene Redzepi7:28

But every year for two weeks, Chicken of the Woods comes into season in Denmark.

Presenter7:33

And it's a mushroom that's a little bit more.

Rene Redzepi7:34

And it's a mushroom, and they can grow up to five, six kilos big. Now, there's three people that know where to get it, two places in Denmark, and maybe they'll get there, maybe they won't get there. And then when you get it in, you have to age it for two weeks because you want to dry up some of the water, and then you roast it whole and you carve it like a steak. It might be for free in nature.

Presenter7:34

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi7:56

But don't tell me that's not more valuable than a kilo of caviar that everybody who has enough money can buy.

Presenter8:02

Time for some music. Second Disc of the Morning, Rainy Red Zeppi. Tell me what we're going to hear now.

Rene Redzepi8:03

Two.

Rene Redzepi8:06

Yeah, it's a chunk of the Sorcerer's Apprentice.

Rene Redzepi8:09

When I was a kid, every winter we used to go to my grandparents' house.

Rene Redzepi8:14

And he was the only one in the family who had a V C R, and we would watch the Disney shows. And so this just reminds me of my childhood tremendously.

Speaker 48:50

Uh

Presenter9:20

That was part of The Sorcerer's Apprentice composed by Paul Ducas from the soundtrack of Disney's Fantasia. So, Rennie Redzepe, your mother's Danish. Your father was originally Albanian?

Rene Redzepi9:30

Was originally Albanian? Yes, originally grown up in former Yugoslavia, in what is today known as Macedonia.

Presenter9:38

And how did they come to meet your mum and dad?

Rene Redzepi9:40

Well, there was uh a little ad in the local newspaper in Macedonia, and it said Denmark is looking for labor. And it was a bad time to be in Macedonia after the Second World War, so my father thought, Cool, I'm trying that one out. And he went, and he did all the typical immigrant jobs. And at one point he found himself being a dishwasher at an espresso bar. And I actually live right nearby now. And my mother, she was the young seventeen year old cashier that fell in love with this dark stranger.

Presenter10:10

And that that Macedonian background actually proved to be very important to you. I mean, it w you were very connected to your father's background. You traveled

Rene Redzepi10:16

You can travel

Rene Redzepi10:18

Yeah.

Presenter10:18

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi10:19

In fact, when we were children we used to say We're going home.

Rene Redzepi10:23

And so we used to go there and we used to spend long summers there, sometimes months, sometimes six months there, some years. And you go there to Macedonia, you live in a mud house. The animals have the two rooms in the first floor, and on top there's two rooms where the whole family of three generations live together.

Presenter10:44

So that's a very traditional farming setup. You know, the animals are on the ground and you're above. Oh yeah.

Rene Redzepi10:48

Oh yeah. It was quite traditional. It was a tough life.

Rene Redzepi10:51

In the daytime, the men they would be out on the fields and and working with, you know, metal tools with their hands. And what were you doing?

Rene Redzepi10:59

That's the special thing. Back then I thought of it as just being

Rene Redzepi11:03

When I came back to Denmark I thought, oh, everybody's been somewhere exotic and they've been to a real swimming pool. I've been out on the fields picking wild berries and chestnuts. I thought it wasn't sort of glamorous enough. And today, of course, I could totally see how that had made me become the cook I am to day.

Presenter11:20

Um parents now, of course, think it's it's getting harder and harder to give their kids those sorts of experiences. You're a father of two, about to be a father of three, very young kids. Do do you try somehow to connect them with that experience?

Rene Redzepi11:28

Very young.

Rene Redzepi11:31

That experience.

Rene Redzepi11:34

Right now, when they're so young, one of the the best things that they enjoy is actually to go with me in a forest and just eat things. Now, later on in life, when they be grown up and become jaded, I'm sure they will reject it, but right now they love it. And they both go to this kindergarten where a bus picks them up in the center of the city, and then they drive to the forest, where it's a little cottage in the forest. And I know that my daughter, she's very proud. When the march violets come out or when nettles come, she's the one who picks them and eats them and explains to the others what's edible and what's not.

Presenter12:11

And your own rather idyllic sounding Macedonian experience, as you say, of course, the former Yugoslavia wa it had to come to an end because of course the trouble started. Do you remember that?

Rene Redzepi12:20

I remember it vividly, actually. We we had had a we had had a smashing day, going to the bakery and getting bread and the women there making rose water for you when you're when you're thirsty and catching fireflies playing soccer, and then we went to bed.

Rene Redzepi12:35

And in the middle of the night we got woken up.

Rene Redzepi12:37

He was my father and my uncle.

Rene Redzepi12:40

And they took us and they said, We are leaving.

Rene Redzepi12:43

Then we went to the car.

Rene Redzepi12:45

And then we start driving, and I remember that I stood up in the back of the car and looked behind me, and there was my whole family, aunties, cousins, everybody, standing there crying and waving.

Rene Redzepi12:58

And that was because the trouble was about to start in what was known as Yugoslavia, and they were worried that my father would be locked in the country, so we had to leave abruptly, like just then.

Presenter13:10

Let's have some music, Ranny Redzeppe. We're on your third choice. Tell me about this.

Rene Redzepi13:14

Ooh, yeah, this is a special one. This is another childhood memory. I was with my friend, his name is Michael, and he said, Do you want to listen to some music? I was very young. I said, Sure, what is it? And he said, It's something called hip-hop. And then he played run DMC. It's like that.

Speaker 313:36

Coming!

Speaker 313:39

God

Speaker 313:40

Don't ask me because I don't know why, but it's like that.

Speaker 313:46

And that's the way it is.

Speaker 313:49

Yeah.

Speaker 314:01

And that's the way it did.

Speaker 314:04

Yeah.

Presenter14:05

That was Rundy MC and it's like that. Now clear something up for me, Rennie Redzeppi. Did you get thrown out of school?

Rene Redzepi14:09

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi14:12

I wanted to finish my tenth grade in school, and they told me after ninth grade they said.

Rene Redzepi14:18

We do not want you more in our school. I I was I was not a good school kid. Let's just say like that. There was a few moments where I actually fell asleep and I woke up and everybody had left.

Presenter14:29

In Denmark ninth grade is how old.

Rene Redzepi14:32

You're fourteen?

Presenter14:33

Oh, you were young then. And you had a twin brother. Was he falling asleep in class? No.

Rene Redzepi14:36

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi14:37

No, no, star student, he swallowed books, he was like incredible.

Presenter14:39

Pussy

Presenter14:43

And how did you two get on?

Rene Redzepi14:45

Good. I mean, you know, when you're say when you're from eight to fourteen.

Rene Redzepi14:52

There there there's been some punches thrown. Let's let's just say like that. I mean, today he's my twin brother I've seen all he actually works at the restaurant with me. He's sort of a m guy who takes care of everything that needs to be taken care of. He's the go to guy.

Presenter15:03

He's the go-to guy.

Presenter15:08

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi15:08

Sports girls. Uh there was a few years where I was very interested in weed, but mostly sports. You know, I had a big dream of becoming a basketball player, but of course I became a short, uh, hot tempered Balkan boy that doesn't really fit with playing basketball.

Presenter15:25

Um when did you realize that actually cooking might be quite interesting? You ended up like a lot of people do, or certainly used to do, not any more, I suspect you sort of fell into catering because it's what people who didn't know what else to do did.

Rene Redzepi15:36

Yeah, it was my best friend at the time. He wanted to be a cook always. So I just followed him. I told myself, what I have to lose, I can be with my friend. And then the magic happened. In the first week of school, I can't remember what day, the teacher wanted us to do a competition. And by team with my friend Michael, and we would be asked to choose a recipe, and then we'd be judged on the flavor of it and how it looked. I remember it so vividly. That was one of the first adult moments of my entire life. And then the question came: so, what do I like about food?

Rene Redzepi16:12

And you're there, fifteen years old, and you're thinking, why do you suddenly ask yourself these questions?

Speaker 416:17

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi16:17

And then I came back to Macedonia to one specific moment that still to this day stands out as one of the moments of my life. Back then there was no phone, so people just dropped by.

Rene Redzepi16:31

And when when family members dropped by us, the kids, we were happy because we knew a feast was coming up.

Rene Redzepi16:38

And so I j remember vividly the way that my uncle took the two fattest chickens, and I remember how he slaughtered them, how he chopped the head off, and the flapping corpses would be running around and us, the kids running after them.

Rene Redzepi16:52

And then the moment when you know my aunt and the other women they would pluck the chicken and put salt and rub them with spices and condiments and chuck them in the wood-fired oven, and you just watch mesmerized as they went from that pale yellow to golden and brown. And then when they were carried to the table as a trophy almost. Wow, it's just one of those moments. And it's still the best chicken I've ever had. So when we were in the library at the school, I found the chicken recipe. And the chicken was a cashe with a cashew nut sauce. And that's where my second adult moment comes to life. Because I thought it has to be with the cashew nut sauce, because it's something new.

Rene Redzepi17:37

I didn't understand why that intrigued me, but I wanted to cook something new, something I hadn't seen before.

Rene Redzepi17:43

And so we cooked it, and then the third adult moment came.

Rene Redzepi17:48

And it was my friend Michael, he was about to spoon that chunky sauce over the chicken. And we had just neatly organized that bowl of rice. We'd stuffed it on to a bowl and put it on the plate and lifted the bowl so it stood there like a perfect monument. And I said, Stop. No, no, no, no. Don't you see there's just a little place right here. And that's also one of those moments where I stand there and think to myself.

Speaker 418:05

Uh

Presenter18:05

Uh

Rene Redzepi18:15

What's going on with you, Renee?

Speaker 418:16

Mm-hmm.

Rene Redzepi18:17

Why does it matter where the source is?

Speaker 418:18

So

Presenter18:19

Uh

Rene Redzepi18:20

Why are you suddenly thinking like this? I almost got scared!

Presenter18:23

You said that you loved sports. Did it matter that it was a competition? Had that fired something?

Rene Redzepi18:27

I think so. I definitely think so. I mean, I wanted to win.

Presenter18:27

I think so.

Rene Redzepi18:31

Which I didn't.

Rene Redzepi18:33

Let's have some music then. What are we gonna hear now? We are going to hear um it's one of the first time I ever bought an album. I went to the record shop and I wanted to buy Iron Maiden Phantom of the Opera and the guy at the record shop he gave me Andrew Lloyd Wepper Phantom of the Opera presumably because he thought this guy you're not supposed to listen to Iron Maiden but I really like Iron Maiden.

Presenter18:36

We are going to

Speaker 419:06

But this is a lot of you now you won't get anywhere in from my

Presenter19:30

That was Iron Maiden's Phantom of the Opera. Noma is internationally renowned. The people that know at Restaurant Magazine have have just voted it the best restaurant in the world for the fourth time. You have uh two Michelin stars. Tell me what it was like when you first opened.

Rene Redzepi19:46

An empty restaurant? No other customer. No other customers. And it was a messy place. We were messy. I mean, here we were trying to understand what is the flavor of this region. And I did some major mistakes initially, such as I thought that if I just took the local ingredients and put them into existing recipes, say I would take the crembrolet, which we all know, and I would put Danish cream and Danish sugar and a Danish berry in there, and thought I had done something that was Danish.

Presenter19:48

Can I know other customers?

Presenter20:18

It doesn't sound too bad.

Rene Redzepi20:19

It was cr it tastes good. We got a Michelin star out of that. But it wasn't a new flavor. It wasn't something that felt like you're tapping into a culture and into a people.

Presenter20:29

And why was that important to you? Because at that point you were y in your very early thirties you had cooked at some of the best restaurants in the world. Why was that not enough for you?

Rene Redzepi20:36

In the world

Rene Redzepi20:39

Well, I wanted to do something that was my own. I wanted to have my own sort of cooking voice.

Presenter20:44

And how was your behaviour in the kitchen? Of course, these days, you know, there's a reality programme about everything, and there's certainly plenty reality programmes here in the UK and in the US about cooking. And we think we know how chefs behave. They are very, very bad tempered. They shout a lot. How was your kitchen?

Rene Redzepi20:49

Flynn

Rene Redzepi20:51

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi20:55

They are very

Rene Redzepi20:57

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi20:58

I was the same. I was terrible. I'd always told myself I wasn't gonna be like that, because all the kitchens I'd been in I'd seen it, and some kitchens I'd been in I'd even seen people getting beat up.

Rene Redzepi21:11

And I told myself, One thing I learned is not to be like that, and then suddenly you're there, and the pressure just grows and it grows and it grows, and there's no money, and I started becoming very angry and very miserable.

Presenter21:24

And what was your moment of epiphany then? Was there a point at which you you you scraped the bottom?

Rene Redzepi21:29

There was one specific moment where I knew that it was it was going into something that I couldn't control any longer. It's not that many years ago. And it was spring. It was a great day, actually. And we were busy as usual, understaffed as usual. And I was walking to work and people were bustling around me cars and bikes and out of the blue.

Rene Redzepi21:50

Out of the blue I had this overwhelming sensation of not being able to walk any more. And I remember telling myself, I feel like laying down and crying.

Rene Redzepi22:02

And I stood there and I felt so weak, like I've never felt before. And I probably stood for five, six minutes, and I'd already sort of surrendered to the thought that this was going to happen. And I was thinking, who's going to take care of me? Who can carry me back to my apartment? I was really, really, really having one of those crazy moments. I haven't had it since, luckily, but then we used to have a girl called Astrid, and she was an apprentice. And I thought, I can't do this. She's going to be alone on the section. Come on, snap your way out of this. And I did.

Rene Redzepi22:38

And that was also one of the moments where I said, Okay, there there's no there's no longevity in this, I'm just going to run myself down. And I started really analyzing what is it, what's the fun of all this? Why is the point of things?

Presenter22:51

Much more in a moment. For now, Renny, let's fit in some music. Tell me what we're going to hear now. We're on uh your fifth.

Rene Redzepi22:56

Yeah, one of my favorite movies growing up was The Labyrinth. David Bowie was in it. It was the first album I ever bought. It was difficult to choose between Queen and David Bowie because I listened to both of them quite a bit. So I put them together and we're gonna listen to Under Pressure.

Speaker 423:13

That's a

Speaker 423:15

Pressing down on me, pressing down on you, no man has fallen.

Speaker 423:21

I'm the brazil

Speaker 423:23

When's it fielding down? Streets of Very into Push people up streets.

Speaker 423:34

Yeah.

Speaker 423:36

Be that I

Speaker 423:37

That's the terror of knowing what this world is about. Watching some good friends for you, let me out for tomorrow.

Presenter23:49

That was Queen and David Bowie and Under Pressure. So Rennie Redzepe, um rather appropriately named, I have to say, that track, because you were just describing to us that moment when you realized that actually the bell had rung in your head, it could not go on like this. You were successful, you'd certainly made your name, and yet things had to change. So what did you do to change them?

Rene Redzepi23:59

It could not

Rene Redzepi24:03

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi24:07

Well, I did many, many, many things. I first of all told myself, okay, everything that I can afford to change uh for the staff, I'm gonna do that. I'm gonna spend all the money on staff. So what I did, I tried to take as much of the bad pressure away. One of the bad things we had was a banquet room.

Rene Redzepi24:26

that huge amount of work for, you know, a hundred covers at one time. It's just not fun. It might be lucrative and great and all that. I close that room.

Presenter24:32

Mm.

Rene Redzepi24:38

I didn't tell my partners, I didn't tell my accountant.

Presenter24:38

I didn't

Presenter24:40

Right.

Rene Redzepi24:41

I just said we're gonna do this because it's it's a matter of survival and we built a staff room.

Rene Redzepi24:46

A place to sit and eat. There was an espresso bar, I built a library in there. And then I also put music in our kitchens, which was probably the biggest hurdle for me mentally, because having grown up in the very sort of classic brigade system, the whole military discipline. And so putting music into that equation was considered unserious. If you had music in your kitchens, you were basically just like a little cafe of some sorts. So it was a big moment to me to install those speakers and buy that system and say, guys, here's the remote. Now let's see what it does to us.

Presenter25:24

Um do you enjoy eating in places other than your own restaurants and your own kitchen at home? Do people get scared cooking for you? They get nervous, I guess. I bet they do.

Rene Redzepi25:35

Yeah, I yeah, they actually do. I hear that all the time.

Presenter25:37

There

Presenter25:38

I bet you never get Astrain to dinner, do you?

Rene Redzepi25:43

My wife only now, after nine years and two children, she's comfortable in cooking for me.

Presenter25:47

Oh.

Presenter25:48

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi25:48

Let's have some music. Tell me what we're going to hear next. We're going to hear a tune that's called Spitting Blood. And I had five years of my professional career where Spitting Blood happened.

Speaker 426:15

Yeah, iPhone letter. She needs that up.

Speaker 426:23

No matter what I say, stay line up on the job. Got the dollar.

Presenter26:32

That was Woo Life and Spitting Blood. So, Reni Radzeppi, you work an eighty hour week, but you only work those eighty hours in five days now. You're not in the kitchen seven days a week. Is that right?

Rene Redzepi26:43

Yeah, well that's my family time. I do also t have family times in the morning. That's my time with the kids. I wake up early, we do breakfast. And I actually I have to say that I enjoy that better. The few times that I've left work early, in the rush hour where any father or mother is leaving work, rushing to get their children and then shop and then cook food, you know, that moment is just the most stressful moment and breakfast is much easier.

Presenter27:12

And Noma didn't just give you this worldwide reputation, it gave you your wife too. That was where I understand you met your future wife.

Rene Redzepi27:18

We used to do all these weird things initially when we opened 10, 11 years ago to stay afloat. One of them was to have an outdoor cafe in Copenhagen. It was just such a bad idea. We thought, let's put up a barbecue. And then, of course, it rains for six weeks. And then you have the young student that's hired in.

Presenter27:18

What

Rene Redzepi27:39

Yeah, and then you make her your wife.

Presenter27:41

Uh

Rene Redzepi27:41

Yeah.

Presenter27:43

And still, you have two children and one on the way, and your wife still works with you. Yeah, she does, she does all the bookings, yeah.

Rene Redzepi27:48

Yes, she does. She does all the bookings, yeah. And then I do I do actually take forty days off every year where I just take off. And it's not just me that gets this. The staff gets five or sometimes they want six weeks off.

Rene Redzepi28:01

I think if you want to have a joyous, creative life, that's what you need. You need vacation. Do your parents come to the restaurants? They do.

Presenter28:10

What do they think of the food?

Rene Redzepi28:11

My mother, she's so proud my father, it's not for him. Remember, he g he he grew up after Second World War in former Yugoslavia, eating the same pot of beans every day.

Presenter28:23

It's too rare of

Rene Redzepi28:24

Fight. It's just not for him.

Rene Redzepi28:26

I mean, I'm happy that he feels like that. And I remember when we got our second Michelin star, and I called him up, I said, Father, father, we have our second Michelin star and then he said, That's good, son. Now you can support your family.

Rene Redzepi28:40

And, you know, it's a little lesson to him. The measure of success is that you support your family. That's what worried him most of his life.

Presenter28:48

Let's have some more music then. We're on your seventh.

Rene Redzepi28:51

Yes, this is one of the favorites in the kitchen. You have to listen to this and envision a Tuesday morning, forty cooks sleepy, getting ready for a long week. How do you wake them up? And we do that by playing Metallica, and this is one.

Speaker 429:08

I can't remember anything.

Speaker 429:12

Can't tell if this is true or dream Deep down inside I'll feel the scream This terrible silence stopping me

Speaker 429:22

Now that the war is through with me I'm waking up I can now I see That there's not much left of me Nothing is real but pain now Hold my breath as I wish for dead

Speaker 429:40

Oh please God play me

Presenter29:43

That was Metallica and one, something to get your your kitchen brigade pumped before they start service on a sleepy Tuesday morning, Rainy Red Zeppi. You mentioned that in your life outside of the kitchen, one of your favourite parts of the day is breakfast time, the start of the day. What would I find you making for yourself and for your kids?

Speaker 429:48

Sarah.

Rene Redzepi30:00

Well, it could be a steaming hot bowl of porridge of various grains. It could also be, which is something that I actually did on Sunday, it was a broth of chicken, and uh with that I took grated cauliflower that I sauteed on a pan and I put that into the broth with a poached egg.

Presenter30:21

And will your kids eat that for breakfast? Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Rene Redzepi30:22

Yeah, yeah.

Presenter30:23

Um you know I'm going to cast you away, Rennie Redzeppi, to this island. But you will be where you like to be. You'll be among nature. Now being in nature is something that is well, we've heard it is, terrifically important to you. So presumably you'll rather like that experience of being on your own in nature.

Rene Redzepi30:31

You be

Rene Redzepi30:32

B

Rene Redzepi30:37

The presumptive

Rene Redzepi30:41

Oh yeah, I I would I love that for the rest of my life.

Rene Redzepi30:46

Without my kids and my wife? Hm. I'm not too sure. But but of course being in nature, just walking in parks or going to a shoreline, that's not only where I find inspiration, that's also where I fuel up as a as a human being.

Presenter31:00

Of course you're part of this big team. We've heard a lot about them today. How are you with your own company?

Rene Redzepi31:06

It's been so many years I don't even know. I I I have kids. I wake up, I go to work. I don't have any time for myself any more. Do you crave it? Hm, I don't mind, actually. But when you ask me how am I being all alone, I can't remember the last time I did that.

Presenter31:23

Let's have your final piece, then, Rennie Redzeppe. Tell me about your eighth disc of the day.

Rene Redzepi31:27

Yeah, this is a a band that I grew up with listening to a lot. And my brother specifically grew up with this. He was so fueled by them, and he was trying to do music on his computer back then. And so it's really a sound of my childhood. And this is Kaftwak with Autobahn.

Speaker 432:13

Uh

Speaker 432:15

Can I go back?

Presenter32:17

That was Kraftwerk and Autobahn. So, Rennie, I'm going to give you the books now. Yeah. You get to take the Bible and the complete works of Shakespeare to the island, and you get to take another book along with it, a book of your own. What would you like to take?

Rene Redzepi32:22

Yeah.

Speaker 432:22

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi32:22

Yeah.

Rene Redzepi32:25

The island

Rene Redzepi32:30

This was extraordinary difficult. And I thought, well, why don't I bring something that I know that I would never read because I don't have time, like Proust or something? And then I thought, no. You know, if I'm alone on an island, I need something fun.

Rene Redzepi32:42

So I'm gonna choose the complete works of Mad Magazine.

Presenter32:46

Okay, that's yours then. And a luxury too, something that will make this Spartan life just a little bit more bearable.

Rene Redzepi32:52

Yeah, that was also difficult. First I thought I would like a sun-driven espresso machine.

Rene Redzepi32:58

But then I thought no.

Rene Redzepi33:00

I need something that also reminds me of home, so I think I'm actually gonna choose one full day of snow.

Presenter33:06

One full day of snow, right, you shall have it. That, indeed, will be your luxury.

Rene Redzepi33:11

Yeah.

Presenter33:11

And a track to save. If the waves were to wash the shore and you had to pick one disc, which one would it be?

Rene Redzepi33:17

It would be metallica.

Presenter33:18

It's yours, Rennie Redzeppi. Thank you very much for letting us hear your Desert Island disc.

Rene Redzepi33:22

Thank you for having me.

Presenter34:04

You've been listening to a download from the BBC.

Presenter34:06

You'll find more information on the Radio 4 website bbc.co.uk slash Radio4.