Lord Prescott

Presenter0:00

Hello, I'm Kirsty Young. Thank you for downloading this podcast of Desert Island Discs from BBC Radio 4. For rights reasons the music choices are shorter than in the radio broadcast.

Presenter0:10

For more information about the programme, please visit bbc.co.uk/slash radio four.

Presenter0:35

My castaway this week is Lord Prescott. Deputy Prime Minister for ten years, he had a central role and a unique style.

Presenter0:43

Henry Cooper, crossed with Claire Rayner, just about covers it. He was the agony aunt in the fraught Downing Street relationship between Blair and Brown.

Presenter0:52

And he didn't shy away from connecting with the voters famously landing a punch on the jaw of a protester.

Presenter0:57

His political beginnings are rooted in Union activism, and even further back there are hints of the man he would become. As a boy he played the part of Grumpy in a school production of Snow White. He says For the last forty years my routine has centred around Parliament, which is strange, I suppose, as I never had any ambitions to be a politician. John Prescott, can that surely be true, given the heights to which you rose within uh the political hierarchy? You never had the ambition to be a politician.

Lord Prescott1:26

My ambition was to be a trade union official in my own union, the National Union of Seamen, but I don't think they want to be anywhere near the leadership. So in a way I then chose a little bit of education. I went to Hull University. The MP retired and the union encouraged me to become a Member of Parliament.

Presenter1:43

I'm wondering then, because you didn't start out with the idea of going into politics, and certainly not with rising to the top of politics, have you always felt something of an outsider, even when you've been at the heart of of Westminster?

Lord Prescott1:56

A bit. I think it's more to do with an inferiority complex. Nobody can understand that perhaps you've gone this far that you can have an inferiority complex, but all the attacks on me because of my grammar and a kind of background, aggressive style, it used to rough off a few feathers and um

Lord Prescott2:13

Whilst I never let it show, it was certainly deeply inside me I felt a bit of fear in it.

Presenter2:17

You are a self-confessed, awkward bugger. Do you think throughout your career you've sometimes been your own worst enemy?

Lord Prescott2:23

Oh yeah, I don't think there's a doubt about that. I certainly made for more difficulties, but that's my personality. Uh if I do it, it's because I believe it and I think that's important and um

Lord Prescott2:32

I say it in a rather direct manner, which I think gets up the nose, but uh that's the way I'm being. Gets up the nose of who? The the people at the top. Yeah, those above me, I suppose.

Lord Prescott2:42

The ones at the top. I never realized I was gonna get anywhere near the top, but I've always fought fought the people who are the bosses, or indeed at a higher level and

Presenter2:51

I said there in my introduction about you playing Grumpy in the school play, and here you are today. You couldn't be more sort of smiley and a bullion. What's happened?

Lord Prescott2:58

That's a very interesting question because when I do smile, people say, Oh, you smile They walk away shocked. But when I'm on politics, when I'm on that television and the enemy's before me, I just got to hit him as hard as I can.

Presenter3:12

Sometimes literally, as we know. Let's then have Perhaps that wasn't the best joke. We'll have your first piece of music, John Prescott. We're going to kick off with what this morning? What are we going to hear?

Lord Prescott3:22

Duke Ellington Satin Doll. Why have you chosen this? Well, it's my wife, really. We both love jazz. But she had this green satin dress, and I took her out to her club on one of her early dates when we were courting. So I was impressed. Got her all the style. I've come home from sea, got a few Bob tickets at the club. Some waiters spilled a glass of red wine all down this dress, which ruined the dress. And Satin Doll, she loves jazz, she loves Ellington. And you know, we've got musician friends that when we walk in, they immediately break into satin doll and we dance.

Presenter3:41

No family.

Presenter4:53

That was Duke Ellington and Satin Doll. So, John Prescott, it's more than five years then since you voiced your concerns that your phone had been hacked. You have just received, as I understand it, a forty thousand pound settlement from News International, and you've also now received an apology from the police. Do do you feel vindicated?

Lord Prescott5:10

Well, the apology for the police is important and uh and we've got to have trust in the police. You've got to know that they're going to be impartial about it. But of course the damages from Murdoch Press, who I think cause a great deal of problems in the relationships between police, press and the public.

Presenter5:25

So in recent months, then we have seen very publicly this unpicking of what appeared to be more than a cosy relationship between the politicians, the editors and the higher echelons of the police service. Is it v your view that it was about time?

Lord Prescott5:40

Oh, yes, I always said that. And Leverson is now beginning to expose that in the interviews. I observed all leaders tend to have a good relationship with Murdoch. I think it's a subservian relationship, but they would say, We need these editors to put our story. And then the paper said, Oh, hey come talking to us. We'll decide whether you're going to win the election. That's a slippery slope I'll not go down. And I never went to any of their socials run by the Murdoch's. You didn't, not ever? No, I didn't.

Lord Prescott6:06

Do you think Uh

Presenter6:07

It made a difference to the sort of press you got.

Lord Prescott6:08

Yes, there's any doubt about that.

Presenter6:09

Yeah.

Presenter6:11

Let's talk for a minute then about the situation right now. For you you've just recently put your name forward. You're going to try to become the elected police commissioner for it'll be the Humberside area.

Presenter6:23

I'm wondering, given that you will be what around about seventy four then, if you were to be elected, what on earth would possess you? At that stage in your life when most people are just, you know, kicking back and relaxing a bit, to to take on a job that could be as onerous as that.

Lord Prescott6:36

Now, first of all, I'm not a slippers' man.

Lord Prescott6:38

Uh secondly my wife says to me, Um, you know, she's worried about the stress and I thought she meant me. She said, No, you live in a dome for six and seven days a a week.

Lord Prescott6:48

Does Paul want you out of the house?

Presenter6:48

Does Paul want you out of the

Lord Prescott6:50

But look, there's a job to be done here. I've learnt a lot from this battle with the Met and the press, and we've got to get a better framework. I'd love to do that.

Presenter6:58

I wonder if it might also be to do with proximity to power. When you've been right at the heart of power, when you've known what it feels like to influence the comings and goings at the very beating heart of the nation.

Lord Prescott7:06

Do we

Presenter7:10

Do you miss it terribly when you're not there anymore?

Lord Prescott7:12

No, no. I've enjoyed those parts of my life. It's a great pri privilege for someone who never expected that kind of life. Uh but now I'm happy to do new things, so, you know, I'm still going to be active. I just can't stay at home.

Lord Prescott7:26

As wonderful as my wife is, put the slippers in and ask for another cup of tea.

Lord Prescott7:31

That's a quick death, isn't it?

Presenter7:33

Um you're in the Lords now, of course. Your proper title, I I should give you it, is is Baron Prescott of Kingston upon what are you sniggering for?

Lord Prescott7:40

It's crazy a lord's name. It gives me a political base there. But to be called a lord, it's got all these connotations. Lord, I shiver each time anybody says to it. I was on a station in Hull, and a man who'd known me for many years came out, Ah, good morning, Lord Prescott. I said, You've called me John for forty years. Can we just keep to that? He turned to my wife and said, What about you? Oh no, I like to be called a lady.

Presenter8:02

Does she? She enjoys that. She does. Di'cause you you did say, I think, that you sort of did it for her. Is that true, Danny?

Lord Prescott8:03

Do you enjoy sir?

Lord Prescott8:05

Did they say

Lord Prescott8:07

I didn't know. You can't say you did it for her. It's one of that. But I know she wanted that. And by God, she's entitled to at least get things some of the things she's wanted. It's her backing for me over many, many years that it's made it possible for me to enjoy the lifestyle I've had.

Presenter8:21

Um so it's Baron Prescott of Kingston-upon-Hull. You were just just rudely interrupted by your snitch yes.

Lord Prescott8:24

I was rudely interrupted by your cynicism of

Presenter8:27

And who do you think the next Labour Prime Minister will be?

Lord Prescott8:31

Uh I think it'd be it.

Lord Prescott8:34

Ed Millibunt. You really do? Well, yes. I think look, it's early stages. It's not easy, in particularly in the circumstances we're in. So, you know, my money's on it.

Presenter8:43

Um did they ask your advice, the Labour front bench team?

Lord Prescott8:47

Uh yes, from time to time. But I stood down because I thought it was a time for them to get on with it, and not for the kind of old man interfering. Uh though they made that speech we're a young party, and when Ed came to me and asked me could I have a bit of advice, I said, Well, I'm an old man, I thought you only took advice from young people. But since you're asking me, let me tell you two bits of advice in private. One, put your bloody jacket back on,'cause leaders shouldn't be walking around with no jacket, in my view. And secondly, throw the bit away, that bit of paper that you say, Give me your thoughts and ideas. Leaders are expected to have'em. You've got to show your own grit, and I think he's beginning to show it now.

Presenter9:21

Let's have some music, John Prescott. Our second disc of the day, what's it gonna be?

Lord Prescott9:25

Oh, um I know it surprised some people. Bee Gee's Stayin' Alive. And why have you chosen this? Oh, it's exciting. I like the combination of music and dancing. And you know, Robin, who's not well at the moment, but um we wish him well. Uh he's fantastic and you know it just makes me want to dance.

Speaker 49:48

Time to talk, the music loud when me walking throughout since I was born

Speaker 410:08

See it breaking and everybody shaking

Presenter10:13

That was the Bee Gee's and Stayin' Alive. Let's go back then, John Prescott, to uh to the early years. You were born in Wales in nineteen thirty eight, but you moved to Yorkshire when you were very uh young indeed. Tell me about the first memories you have of

Lord Prescott10:25

The war years, of course uh going and looking for the bits of metal from bombs that were dropped on Sheffield. Uh quite an exciting time, and when the bell rang, you had to run down into some cellar which was the bomb shelter. That's what I remember basically of the war.

Presenter10:25

Yes, of course.

Presenter10:39

Do you remember your dad coming home? He lost uh partially lost a leg.

Lord Prescott10:42

Yes, he lost his leg at Dunkirk,'cause he was in the anti tanks and gangrene setting, so he lost part of his leg. All I remember at that time was my father had a Strump stocking,'cause they weren't as sophisticated as them. And that used to be our Christmas stocking with the orange stuck in the bottom of the stocking.

Presenter10:58

Was it a shock to you to see him like that, though, to see him injured?

Lord Prescott11:00

No, I don't think it registers just your dad, isn't it? And then you got used to the leg and the stumps and the big straps that go with these artificial legs of those times. My father was a remarkable man.

Presenter11:10

Is it true that he used to uh smuggle cigarettes and booze through customs in his leg?

Lord Prescott11:15

Dean, he used to fall he used to have all the all his duty-free stuff or or got some stuck into his artificial leg.

Presenter11:23

And a moment ago you paid tribute there to your father, but you have said that.

Lord Prescott11:24

But

Presenter11:28

He would never pay for anything if he could possibly avoid it. I mean he was a bit of a chanceler wasn't he?

Lord Prescott11:32

Oh yeah.

Presenter11:33

Yeah.

Lord Prescott11:33

Yeah. I mean it was all on horses, he was always gonna win everything. So to everybody else he was wonderful, but he had such a character in life, I don't think he gave the same identity into the home.

Presenter11:43

Right.

Presenter11:47

No. The sisters being who, you mean the feminist sisters? Yeah.

Lord Prescott11:49

Yeah.

Presenter11:50

Yeah.

Lord Prescott11:50

Yeah. There are quite a few of them in the house.

Presenter11:52

So, um he wore

Presenter11:54

You say that with a resentful look on your face, don't you?

Lord Prescott11:56

No, I don't. I actually admire in fact I fought like hell for the discriminatory policy we have to have more women into it. But, you know, I don't like some men and don't like some women.

Presenter12:05

Is it true that when you yourself were going to the Labour Party conferences, isn't it indeed the case that he

Lord Prescott12:10

But what he used to do at the at my conferences, he always said, Can I have your list of social engagements?

Lord Prescott12:16

And then what he used to do is go ahead of me when I was going to every engagement and saying, Is my son here? Who's your son? He said, Uh, John Prescott, is he coming here? Yet, he is. He said, Oh, come in, Mr Prescott And'cause he'd stumble a bit on his leg, Would you like a drink? You'll have a double brandy And then he'd move before I came to the next one I'm going to.

Presenter12:34

And uh money was pretty tight, was it? When you were gra I mean I imagine like like most people after the war, most normal family.

Lord Prescott12:39

Well, I I think people who talk about poverty at that time, everybody was in it, so it wasn't like today where in a way you're ashamed of and you've got to buy the most expensive things in families'cause that's what the kids want. Then everybody was the same. We used to share an apple core, you know, somebody eating an apple, you say, Can I have the car? All this was part and parcel, and I identify it as a rather happy period.

Presenter13:00

So tell me about your next disc, John Prescott. Oops.

Lord Prescott13:02

Yes, it might be a bit surprising really, but it was by the jam a town called Malice. And why have you chosen this? I've chosen it because of the film Billiard Elliot. You know, here again is a clash of culture going on. A working class, this lad shouldn't be going to bally. Isn't he gay if he goes ballying? Well, you know, it was tremendous. And that young lad rebels against that working class culture that says you're not to do that. And in that toilet, he's kicking everywhere, dancing. And this magical music by the Jam plays. And it really does match with the fury of the boy and the clash of culture in a working class mining area.

Speaker 413:53

Never died, time is short and life is global. Have to ask to change the time.

Presenter14:09

That was the jam in a town called Malice. Uh, John Prescott, both your parents came from strong union families then. W was it a house full of political debate and?

Lord Prescott14:16

But it was always the Labour Party committee, if that's the set.

Presenter14:16

Yeah.

Lord Prescott14:20

Uh yeah, I was always known in the area. My mother became a councillor, my dad was the treasurer of the Labour Party. I think you could say that's a political house.

Presenter14:20

Also,

Presenter14:26

And did they involve you? You were you part of the discussion?

Lord Prescott14:28

Yeah, yeah, I used to meet the visiting MPs if they stayed at the house, but it never excited me to say I want to be an MP. To be quite honest, I never thought I could be an MP. I thought you had to be of a kind of special level.

Presenter14:38

And putting the politics to one side at home, it was quite a a tempestuous marriage, your parents' marriage.

Lord Prescott14:44

Yes, I think it was, really. My father lived his own life in a way. My mother was wonderful, but uh there were two strong personalities, actually, that just constantly clashed, and I don't think my father lived up toward his responsibilities.

Lord Prescott14:57

We're in the house, and he lived a life outside.

Presenter15:00

Uh

Lord Prescott15:00

So what he was a g he was a game.

Presenter15:01

Gambler, you said he would

Lord Prescott15:02

Yeah, I mean lived as home.

Presenter15:04

Yeah. It can if there is a sort of constant background noise of argument between the parents, it can make a child feel insecure. Did it make

Lord Prescott15:10

I can remember I'm not a religious man, but I was praying to anybody that my mum and dad wouldn't split up and it was clearly happening that way. My mum was basically unhappy. And um, you didn't want your parents to split up. And in those circumstances, children definitely feel it. You just pray there won't be another argument and uh

Lord Prescott15:30

The way it affected me was to play a bigger part in supporting the family at home and the daughter you know, when family got married, my dad was never there to assist in that process, but you became the father.

Lord Prescott15:42

That was something was your responsibility,'cause you're the eldest.

Presenter15:46

And is it true that during the divorce your mother asked you to I don't know actually if to say testify is the right thing, but she she asked you to she to speak out.

Presenter15:55

Yeah.

Lord Prescott15:55

And there had to be a guilty party.

Presenter15:57

Yeah.

Lord Prescott15:57

And my mother rightfully said, and my father had it some affairs, that he was the guilty party.

Lord Prescott16:03

And my mother then said I wanted to go to the court to give evidence. And I wouldn't do it. I took the view you're both my mother and father, and you've just got to play that

Lord Prescott16:13

Almost the kind of middle road, isn't it? Trying to keep two parties together, which is something I got quite adept to.

Lord Prescott16:20

And I drew light.

Presenter16:21

Yes, I can't help sort of drawing that comparison that actually you, you know, bringing war warring parties together is

Lord Prescott16:26

Well, it's an arbitrator, isn't it? I've done it at sea, you know, trying to find a gate. I'm a negotiator.

Presenter16:30

And as the father of two sons, then, thinking about family life and thinking about everything you went through, did you try yourself to be

Presenter16:37

involved with your sons to be closer emotionally to them than than your father was to you?

Lord Prescott16:41

You know that that

Lord Prescott16:42

That's a very important question.

Lord Prescott16:45

I was a bit about the farther detached of it, I think, really.

Lord Prescott16:48

though not indifferent, but a kind of detach that comes from your background and culture, I think. I've got two brilliant sons. I'll quite frankly, uh I love them to death, but

Lord Prescott16:58

To my great regret, I cannot somehow

Lord Prescott17:01

Put my arms round my son's.

Lord Prescott17:04

I don't know where it comes from, but I very much regret that I've never had that as part.

Lord Prescott17:09

But I think that's part of British kind of culture I think and uh that was reflected a bit in me and I'm sad about that.

Presenter17:15

And you've got grandchildren now, yes.

Lord Prescott17:17

Are you sort of are you are you do you give them a hug? Isn't it you? I mean, you know, I see these fellows with the granddaughters or grandsons and I say, God blabby I see Blair and Brown on the hands and knees, you know, with with little babies, their own at that time.

Presenter17:17

So do I use

Presenter17:19

It's bad.

Lord Prescott17:28

And I couldn't quite understand that.

Lord Prescott17:31

But by me, when Ava Grace, the granddaughter, came along, you know, I was on my hands and knees chasing her round, she's now about two and a bit, and she's a great pleasure to us, and um

Lord Prescott17:41

I now realize the kind of feelings that grandparents can have and the relation with the grandchild that does develop.

Lord Prescott17:50

My wife can't get down here fast enough.

Lord Prescott17:53

And I'm following quickly.

Presenter17:53

Uh

Presenter17:55

Let's have some more music. We are on your fourth choice of the morning. What are we going to hear?

Lord Prescott18:00

Uh Marion Montgomery. Oh, she's wonderful. You know this is a lady first time I saw her in a club in Hull. I was bowled over and loved her ever since. I used to follow her round the country to see what she was singing. She tragically died recently, but uh when I hear Marion, the lady in Nashesse, it's everything about warmth, about feeling, about blues, about jazz.

Speaker 318:22

Since she came, it is a shame How she can cool em down.

Speaker 318:28

Famous

Speaker 318:29

She can't get all the felons that she ain't

Speaker 318:34

Georgia named her Georgia Queen The sweet Georgia brow

Speaker 318:39

No gown made has got a shade on Georgia Brown

Speaker 318:44

Too lefty, but she's so neat that jaws.

Speaker 318:50

Folks all sigh and wanna dance for George Brown, I will tell you why

Speaker 418:53

John

Speaker 318:58

You know I never hardly ever lie It's been since she knocks him in When she lands him down Since she came it is a shame as she can

Speaker 319:10

Move them down. Finally

Speaker 319:13

She can't get all feelings down She ain't fit

Speaker 319:17

Georgie named the Georgie claim the sweet, sweet Georgie Brown.

Presenter19:22

That was Marion Montgomery and Sweet Georgia Brown. You said, John Prescott, that any ambition you did have came from failing the Eleven Plus. How did it fire you?

Lord Prescott19:32

Well, I felt um a failure.

Lord Prescott19:35

I failed it. My brother got the eleven plus and he got the bike from my father. And my sister she got a present for passing the eleven plus. Uh I'd gone to the secondary modern and uh you knew you'd failed. So it brought it home to me that that one test was deciding what you were going to do in your life. I felt angry about it.

Presenter19:54

You once said, If there's anything driving me, it's that I think I'm not. Do you still feel that way?

Lord Prescott20:00

Yeah, people can't understand that really. And there's a characteristics of me. I can't go and walk into a restaurant by myself and wouldn't. And then I walk on a stage and talk to thousands. I've got no problem with doing that.

Lord Prescott20:14

But in the private circumstances I'm just embarrassed.

Presenter20:17

That's such a contradiction, isn't it? Because there'll be plenty of people who can say, well, you know, I don't like booking restaurants, or I feel a bit shy walking into a restaurant. They are not.

Lord Prescott20:18

Costa B

Presenter20:24

The same people who could stand up at conference in front of thousands, sometimes tens of thousands of people. How do you square the contradiction? What is what do you think when you think about it?

Lord Prescott20:28

Yeah.

Lord Prescott20:34

Most people tell me it's quite wrong for you to feel like that way. Look what you've done. I don't care. But just know feeling inferior, you know, and uh you do feel it and it's still there.

Lord Prescott20:44

And then you're attacked by public schoolboys, many of them in the Tory party, some in Labour, and they have a go about you because of the language when they've had such a privileged education. It that makes it in a way m I react in a class way. It's a class war then, and that is part of me.

Presenter21:00

And you left school then w well, you had no qualifications to speak of, no skills and no interest in bettering yourself. So when did you start to have an interest in bettering yourself?

Lord Prescott21:10

Well I be first got become a commicheff and then my father got me a chance to travel to sea and then that's when it all started. I wanted to change, I wanted to get involved and it was the politics of the union that brought me into this life.

Presenter21:23

It's one thing to be politicized, isn't it? Say, well, I want to join the union and I believe in the power of collective bargaining, all that stuff. You know, this I'm signing up to this. It's another thing to think that I'm going to be the person who leads.

Lord Prescott21:31

Simming up

Presenter21:35

Whether it's a strike or whether it's a

Lord Prescott21:38

But that's been part of me, you know. You know, we have snowball fights at school. I always think I'd be leading the charge, right, on snowball fights, and we were the stronger one. I'd then switch sides because I want to be on the losing side and fight that stronger one. I want to be fighting and winning, but not in a commanding position, just leading.

Presenter21:57

You did box actually. You were literally a fighter.

Lord Prescott21:58

Literally a fighter. Wh when did you box? Well, I used to fight at sea and for passengers, one of them was Antony Needon, who gave me the prize of two bottles of beer for fighting at sea and two hours overtime from the company.

Presenter22:12

So you used to you used to fight as the entertainment, it would be a boxing match.

Lord Prescott22:12

See

Lord Prescott22:14

Were you quite successful? Well, I never got beat.

Presenter22:15

Were you quite successful?

Presenter22:18

Time for some music, John Prescott. Um what are we going to hear now?

Lord Prescott22:22

Unusual choice really. Tom Jones.

Presenter22:24

Well, it's not unusual, is it?

Lord Prescott22:26

Exactly well done. It's not unusual. I associate with that. I had no education qualifications. There was a place called Ruskin College in Oxford. I shouldn't really have been there, but it's a Labour college. And to get in there, you lead a few strikes. It doesn't matter about the O and the A levels, as long as you've been in the industrial struggle. At that time, it was Tom Jones. It's not unusual. And I played it all the time, starting my education, trying to write the downwards, scrapping up the paper, and then it's not unusual.

Presenter22:27

Yeah.

Speaker 423:00

It's not unused you want to be loved by anyone.

Speaker 423:05

It's not unusual out to have fun with anyone.

Speaker 423:11

But when I see you hanging about with anyone

Speaker 423:16

It's not unusual to see me cry on a die.

Presenter23:23

That was Tom Jones, and it's not unusual. So, John Prescott, you met Pauline, your wife of fifty years, when you were just nineteen. Can you remember the first time you ever saw her?

Lord Prescott23:30

Didn't you remember?

Lord Prescott23:32

Oh yes, she was standing at the bus stop and I'd just come home and she was standing at the bus stop and said, Oh, how are you? What are you doing tonight then, love? You going out? She said, Yeah, well let's go to the pictures. And she joined me then and stayed with us. I remember saying to her in the pictures, You know, you remind me of a film star. And of course she preened up a bit, you know, and obviously everybody thought she was like Elizabeth Taylor. I said, Yeah, you're just like Joyce Gremble. So that was a good start.

Presenter23:55

Yeah.

Presenter23:58

You charmer. Um Pauline, as everybody who reads the newspapers will know, w when she was very young she had a child well, the expression people used to use was out of wedlock. She had a child out of wedlock. And at the time that was a considerable social stigma. What did you think about it at the time?

Lord Prescott24:11

Not

Lord Prescott24:14

I just thought of the woman. She was marvellous, she was beautiful, she had style.

Lord Prescott24:21

It was just one of those things. I did see the baby. That's the decision she felt she had to make. Difficult decision for her, and she hung on as long as she could. But then all of a sudden, right out of the balloon, the press, peculiarly enough, had found out who it was and went up to him, knocked on his door, and said, Do you know who your mother is and father in law?

Presenter24:40

This is very many decades later in the year. Fortunately, I want to come on to that. But but you say you you met a little boy, and this was a little boy who was first of all the baby was fostered and then eventually adopted. Did you

Lord Prescott24:41

Forty years ago.

Presenter24:50

Did you spend time with him? Did you sort of get to know him?

Lord Prescott24:52

No, because uh right from the beginning it was into a home in Derby.

Lord Prescott24:56

And uh they really said, you know, it was getting s difficult for the child and it was better to be adopted. Uh but it was a difficult time.

Presenter25:04

So only just a few years ago then, um, you were forced to go public with this private family situation by uh the News of the World.

Presenter25:13

News International, as I understand it, did know know about the story, but they didn't publish it for eighteen months. They sat on the story for a while.

Lord Prescott25:21

No, no. They thought it was my baby. That's what they were really after, and discovered when they went through all the birth records that it was Paul's, right? They traced it and found the man was at the tattoo. Madame Tattoo is a lieutenant colonel, uh very successful in his own life. And um

Lord Prescott25:37

They just went and knocked on his door, said we're printing the story on Saturday, Typical News International. So I did intervene, with Peter Mendelssohn's help, frankly, and said to my wife, If you want to go out with your son, once you go out, they'll take a photograph. So why don't we say to them, We will come, delay the time to get you know your son and it was that arrangement that came out of it. Uh and I think that was the best way to do it and my son David was the one that negotiated the agreement with them.

Presenter26:04

And more importantly probably than all this press stuff is is how it works within your family. Does y you now of course have two sons, uh grown-up sons with Pauline. Is is her first son part of the extended family?

Lord Prescott26:13

Part of the extent of my wife's fear was that her sons would want to disown her or something. So I then had to meet the two sons and explain to them.

Lord Prescott26:22

And uh

Lord Prescott26:24

Then they went home to the mother and obviously she's had great intrepidation about it and they just went up and said, You know, we love your mum. I mean, it's they're the words that can solve an awful lot of things, aren't they? And then I had to meet him separately and then just take her to the house and then the two of them get together and she feels her life is completed by being with Paul again. And it's he can see them together. So he is our third son.

Presenter26:47

Let's have some music, John Prescott, then. We're on your sixth disc of the morning. Tell us about that.

Lord Prescott26:53

My wife's influence and with me, when I was caught in and go in, she'd have Sarah Vaughan, Land of Hi Phi, singing this song Cherokee about an Indian, but Cannibal Adley, fantastic player, so the two of them come together, it's still a record that could make me cry.

Speaker 427:09

Braven and warrior, since first I've met you, I can't forget you, Cherokee Sweetheart, child of the prairie.

Presenter27:24

Uh

Speaker 427:26

Your love keeps calling.

Speaker 427:30

My heart enthralling, you cherish me dreams of summertime, of love and time gone by, thrown my memories so tenderly and sigh, my brave Indian warrior.

Speaker 427:53

One day I'll hold you in my arms, fold you by checker a kiss.

Presenter28:07

That was Sarah Vaughan and Cannibal Adderley and Cherokee. So, John Prescott. Then came, in April two thousand six, the moment that you discovered that the press was about to report this eighteen-month affair that you'd had with your diary secretary, Tracy Temple. What did you do?

Lord Prescott28:22

Add to it.

Lord Prescott28:23

There's no point in trying to hide. I think there's somebody from the Daily Mail that rang me up. It was sold to the press. I was shocked and surprised, there's no doubt about it. Completely to blame. But I just admitted to it. The difficult part was going home and telling my wife. And.

Lord Prescott28:40

She was so generous with me, and it's the nature of her, really, and she was certainly hurt by it, and said, You know, um, I can't forgive.

Lord Prescott28:49

Ah, I will remember.

Lord Prescott28:51

But you know you get on with your life in a way.

Lord Prescott28:54

And I think the experience of the divorce and separation in my own family.

Lord Prescott28:59

As one, you've seen what can happen to a family when it breaks up for whoever's to blame, which in this case was me.

Presenter29:05

You have written about it.

Presenter29:08

And very interestingly to me, you haven't been one of those politicians who said

Presenter29:12

Well, you know, you see, it's the pressure of Westminster. You see, there you are. You're away from your family for long amounts of time. The temptations are great. There's a huge amount of stress. You do want to lose yourself in the moment. You didn't say it. You said absolutely that was not the case. I was just an idiot.

Lord Prescott29:25

That's it. I was an idiot.

Lord Prescott29:27

Um

Lord Prescott29:29

When you think back on it, and it's not like a flowing affair, going out for dinner or anything it wasn't, it was just acts that took place, uh I can't justify it at all, and I'm to blame.

Presenter29:41

And what about Pauline? Do you think then through through your your marriage do you think you'd underestimated her?

Lord Prescott29:47

Undoubtedly. But that goes back to Macho Image and all those things we've been talking about. But she's been one of those women, she resents anybody saying, you know, be looking after a house and the family i as a lesser thing and not a career, not for her. She's always enjoyed and loves doing that. It led me when I get home, don't talk about the politics to it, you know, just not I'm tired and fair, you know, all that kind of thing. That was so wrong, but I made the terrible mistake of underestimating her own intelligence and ability and interest in things.

Presenter30:18

Is it a different sort of relationship you have now then?

Lord Prescott30:20

I think so. I mean, she made it clear it can't continue this way. But that wasn't only just about what happened in London. It's about a relationship, you know, inside the home. Um I'd shout a lot. I'd shout into her and assume she

Lord Prescott30:34

And it was wrong. It's not that I don't shout even more, it's part of my character, and I have no excuse for it, but

Lord Prescott30:40

She's just a remarkable woman, and I underestimated that, and it became, in a marriage where one was always dominant, but it's give and take. I was more on the take than the giving and the

Presenter30:51

Some music, I think. We're on the penultimate disc. What are we going to hear?

Lord Prescott30:56

Miles Davis. I saw him in America and as a seaman, you could go and see all these great jazz artists playing above the bar. It became a coolness in jazz, and Miles Davis epitomized it more than anyone. He didn't like his audience, used to tick turn her back on them when I watched him in concert. But you know, on this one, on a green dolphin street, cool jazz couldn't be cooler.

Presenter32:18

That was Miles Davis and on Green Dolphin Street. You were Deputy Prime Minister for ten years, longer than anybody else has ever held the post.

Presenter32:27

What about this more than tricky relationship then between Tony Blair and Gordon Brown? There you were at the centre of it, there you were trying to m manage a functioning relationship when it really wasn't functioning.

Lord Prescott32:36

Funk.

Lord Prescott32:37

I was well aware that both, and both of them were brilliant, quite frankly. Gordon in the economics, Tony in the politics, in a way. And we needed them. I had to keep these two horses going in the same direction. When it got really difficult, I'd have them in for a meal, and I'd sit in the middle and Gordon on one side, Tony on the other. And Gordon, you know, it could be a miserable bugger from time to time. He'd sit down and go, this chair's a bit low.

Lord Prescott33:02

You know, and I said, Oh, as my waiter experience, I'll get you another chair. So I got him a higher chair, turned to Tony and said, Do you want a higher chair, Tony? No, I'm used to Gordon looking down at me. So, to that extent, I had to manage that and go in there. And I think they were both brilliant. I'm an admirer of both. But I wonder if it ever

Presenter33:18

Occurred to you that you were in amongst all these privately educated political theorist types of people. If you were.

Presenter33:26

Something of a fig leaf for New Labour. You know, you wear that.

Lord Prescott33:29

People would say that, but I think Tony Blair, you know, was a bit concerned about me making the Deputy Prime Minister, because people used to say to him, he'll keep resigning like Effer. No, the leader is Tony Blair. But I have an idea about the policies. Give you an example. When he asked me, could Paddy Ashdown come in and have a kind of enter to the cabinet? I said, Tony, if he comes in that door, I go out this door. No debate.

Lord Prescott33:53

I don't want it, and I stopped that. I kept to the policy of the party, some of the things I didn't like, but I always helped do that. There were compromises and there were difficulties like Iraq. Uh but I always made my views clear to people if I didn't agree, and there were occasions of that.

Presenter34:08

What about thinking that you are not? Are you over that now?

Lord Prescott34:12

Um

Lord Prescott34:14

I feel a bit inferior to myself when I don't get it right and I don't say it right and I can't put the words right. By the way, I never felt inferior actually getting things done. But I've moved on from that. I look now and say, Well, I'm quite happy what I did with my life and I've improved lives for some others as well, which I think I came into politics to do, and I'll continue to do that, you know.

Lord Prescott34:35

I'll have to be shot before I die.

Presenter34:37

What about the anger? What about the the aggression? Are you are you less angry than that?

Lord Prescott34:41

Oh no no no no no no. Some people call it enthusiasm. You know and I maybe

Presenter34:47

That may be a generous interpretation.

Presenter34:50

How would you survive on the island, John Prescott? Could you build your own shelter? Could you fish for food? Could you do all that?

Lord Prescott34:55

Well, I'm a diver, of course, so I take the opportunity to go out and dive in those and are you practical? Practical.

Presenter35:02

Yeah, good with your hands.

Lord Prescott35:04

Not really. I'll have a go though. You know, like put them around your throat, but no, joke, image.

Presenter35:14

I thought we'd got on rather well, but there we are. Let's hear your final piece. What are we going to hear to?

Lord Prescott35:18

Um well, such a jump to the Shirelles. Well, that takes me back to my seamen's days in the nineteen fifties when I was on a ship called a Mauritania cruising round the West Indies. Will you still love me tomorrow? And it brings back those memories of my sea days.

Speaker 435:33

United

Speaker 435:35

Completely.

Speaker 435:40

You give me your love.

Speaker 435:42

How sweet me

Speaker 435:46

Turn out

Speaker 435:47

The light of loving in your eyes

Speaker 435:53

When will you love me tomorrow?

Presenter36:00

That was the Sherelles and Will You Still Love Me Tomorrow. So, John, I'm going to give you the books now. You get to take the Bible and the complete works of Shakespeare, and you can take an

Lord Prescott36:08

I suppose I'll be reading them, but they're there. Yep.

Presenter36:11

Okay.

Lord Prescott36:12

I'm not a reader of books, I must admit.

Presenter36:14

Okay. You you do get to take another book along with you. Have you got a book you'd like to take?

Lord Prescott36:18

Well, thought of a dictionary at first to correct the grammar and the language, but what does it matter? No, the book to take is My Life, as expressed by my wife in her book called Smile Though Your Heart Was Breaking and, you know, Pictures of the Family.

Lord Prescott36:33

My wife, The Rocket of the Family. I'd love to take that and be reminded of it. Pauline's book is yours then, and A Lux

Presenter36:38

Luxury too. What would you like your luxury to be?

Lord Prescott36:41

Uh well it's hard to think about that. Keep off the jaggers. I think what I'd take.

Lord Prescott36:47

I'd like to learn a piano. I always regret I've never played a bit of music. I'm one of those that's got all the background of all the instruments. So you might only play the bit, but I can live my life of music, the one that influences me and music still on the island would be part of my life.

Presenter37:02

Okay, we'll get your Bon Tempe then. And um if you had to choose just one disk to save from the waves, which one would it be?

Lord Prescott37:08

Difficult, but warmth and love, Mary Montgomery. I love to hear her voice every time singing Sweet Georgia Brown.

Presenter37:15

It's yours, John Prescott. Lord Prescott, indeed, thank you very much for letting us hear your Desert Island discs.

Lord Prescott37:20

Thank you.

Presenter37:57

You've been listening to a download from the BBC. You'll find more information on the Radio 4 website: bbc.co.uk slash Radio Four.