Lewis Gilbert

Presenter0:00

Hello, I'm Kirsty Young. Thank you for downloading this podcast of Desert Island Discs from BBC Radio 4. For rights reasons the music choices are shorter than in the radio broadcast.

Presenter0:10

For more information about the programme, please visit bbc.co.uk slash radio four.

Presenter0:35

My Castaway this week is the director, producer and writer Louis Gilbert. He has spent seventy odd years in the movie business, with his credit rolling on no less than thirty eight feature films. But it's the quality as much as the quantity that's striking. Reach for the Sky, Alfie, The Spy Who Loved Me, Educating Rita, and Shirley Valentine are some of his most notable hits. It all began way back in Silent Films, when he was a child actor.

Presenter1:03

The fact is, since the age of four I've been in the business of entertainment, he says, and I knew that entertainment was where I belonged.

Presenter1:11

I'm wondering, Louis Gilbert, how you knew that you belonged in entertainment. What was it about the business that spoke to you?

Lewis Gilbert1:19

Well, I never knew anything else from birth. For the first four years of my life I toured around England with my father's vaudeville act and I stood at the side of the stage. My grandmother had ten children and she put every one of them into vaudeville. They're all different acts. It made me very conscious of being i in show business.

Presenter1:43

Can you remember the first time that you've stepped out, yourself, in front of a live audience?

Lewis Gilbert1:50

Yes, I can remember very, very well, because it in a way it changed my life. I used to stand at the side of the stage and watch other acts, and th one day the the trick cyclist

Presenter1:50

Yeah.

Lewis Gilbert2:03

said to me, you see that little car over there, would you like to drive it round the stage? And I said, oh, oh, I would love that. I was only about five, but I thought that would be wonderful. And he said, okay, well, when I come off, you go on. And I did that. Well, the audience went mad. They thought that was the most wonderful trick they'd ever seen. They took it as a trick, in some way. So of course they went mad and everybody upstairs heard this and my mother and father suddenly saw the value of a small boy at the end of an act. So at the end of their act, they would come off, I would come on with a little tap dance and that always brought the house down. And that was my first appearance in front of an audience, really.

Presenter2:49

Your your grandmother, I think, used to used to tell you that that one day your name would be in Lights.

Lewis Gilbert2:53

Yeah.

Lewis Gilbert2:55

My grandmother always used to when I used to go and stay with her, she'd say to me, Forget the others. You're the one. Forget them. You're the one. You will have your name in lights. I didn't quite know what she meant by that, but I mean it stuck in my memory. And, you know, about thirty or forty years later, I was walking across Leicester Square and there was my bond picture. The spy who loved me, yes. And underneath it said directed by Lewis Gilbert. And there it was, my name in lights. And suddenly I thought of my grandmother and I thought, what a shame she was never around to see it. But she was right.

Presenter3:24

Yeah.

Presenter3:39

Yeah.

Lewis Gilbert3:39

But maybe sh

Presenter3:39

It was around, I don't know. Let's have some music then, Louis. Tell me about the first piece we're going to hear today. What is it?

Lewis Gilbert3:45

Elton John's friends, yes. That was kind of interesting because my son J uh John was in music at the time and he recommended Elton John to me. I'd never heard of Elton John. In fact, when he introduced me to Elton John, it was at my son's house. And he kept talking to this man and he kept talking to Reg and I said, But you know, when is Elton John coming? And he said, You've been talking to him. His real name is Reg Dwight.

Speaker 44:15

Friends for the world to see Let the people know

Speaker 44:23

You gotta watch me

Speaker 44:27

With a friend like him

Speaker 44:30

You will see the light

Speaker 44:33

Get your friends up there, then everything's alright

Presenter4:40

That was Elton John and Friends. We've had a little window on this remarkable career that you've had, Lewis Gilbert. As you say, you started.

Presenter4:49

Aged just a tiny tot, aged four in Vaudeville Theatre. You went all the way to directing Hollywood Blockbusters. A lot in between, and we will talk about that. But I want to ask you a bit about the Bond movies. You you directed three Bond movies, as we heard that The Spy Who Loved Me when your name was up in lights, and also you only live twice.

Presenter5:08

I mean, how exciting was it to be asked to direct a Bond movie? Because they were the the epitome of glamour at the time you were involved in them.

Lewis Gilbert5:17

Yes, well, it was very good and uh in fact, when I go round the world now when I'm working, it's amazing they're not interested in any of my films until I say James Bond, and the minute I say James Bond they practically geneflect and go, My God, you did you really do three James Bonds?

Presenter5:36

I mean, there there were some hair raising moments. Obviously, I mean, the Bonds certainly in the days that you were were doing them were known for these gigantic special effects and the huge sound stages filled with so many extras, but th there was a point at which now what movie was it you were filming when when there was a special effect

Lewis Gilbert5:54

It was the Spy Who Loved Me. The Spy Who Loved Me. The Spy Who Loved Me, there was the biggest set that had ever been built in England, maybe in the world. It was a huge, huge set. And we had a small gyrocopter called Little Nelly in the film. It was Wing Commander Wallace drove this thing, which was quite difficult. And he'd say, Well, it's very difficult. I must have the wind for the lift. But he'd always do it. And once we came to the volcano, then we asked Wing Commander Wallace.

Presenter5:55

The spy who loved me.

Lewis Gilbert6:25

Could he fly around the perimeter of this volcano, which had water in it down below? And this was just to be clear, this wasn't the set that you were then going to build. This was the real deal. This was a real volcano. That's what gave us the idea for the set. But it was a real volcano. Well, he did. He started to fly round the rim, and then he went down about six feet below it, and he was going round and round and round. And I said, Well, that's it. They tell him to come out now. He said, He can't get out. I said, What do you mean he can't get out? He said, Well, he's stuck because there's no lift and he can't come out. And he was going round and round and round and round. And oh my goodness, I suddenly thought, This is terrible. I'm going to be responsible for this man's death. Anyway, just as I was practically weeping, finally he just suddenly bobbed up and he got himself out. But it was a wonderful piece of luck because otherwise he would have gone down into the into the water and that would have been it.

Presenter6:36

This was the real volcano.

Speaker 16:38

Uh

Presenter6:39

But that's there.

Speaker 16:39

Uh

Lewis Gilbert7:27

Uh

Presenter7:27

Did he ever work for you again? Did you employ him again? Or did he simply think it's not worth it?

Lewis Gilbert7:31

But he wasn't a film man at all. He was a wing commander in the in the Air Force. I have met him since and we always have a joke with together and how I how he nearly lost his life with me, you know.

Presenter7:33

Joe

Presenter7:34

Yeah, it's

Presenter7:43

Bond was was Sean Connery, but you worked with Roger Moore too in uh it was The Spy Who Loved Me and and Moonraker. He was notable of course'cause he was a very different kind of Bond and and that was where the humour came in.

Lewis Gilbert7:53

Damn it.

Lewis Gilbert7:55

Yes, I must say working with Roger was a wonderful experience because he is a delightful fellow and I'm not friendly with many actors, but with with Roger I'm still friendly with him. In fact we had lunch the other day together. But if I did anything with the bonds I think I made the humour work very well with Roger. It's no good trying to make him the great physical thing that Sean was. It's far better that he won everybody over with his sense of humour. And I think that's what made those two bonds. They were very different from Sean's bond.

Lewis Gilbert8:31

Let's pull

Presenter8:31

Pause for some more music. We're going to hear the Delius now. Tell us why you've chosen this.

Lewis Gilbert8:36

Well, I was looking for something for Roger, and suddenly I thought, Ah, Delius. He's that's nice and light, and it reminds me of Roger in a funny sort of way. It's it's charming and it's got and Delius had that way with him. This is for Roger Moore, then, here it is.

Presenter9:54

That was part of Brig Fair by Delias. I want to hear more about your early years, Lewis Gilbert. You were born well, it was ninety years ago, wasn't it, in Hackney. Both your parents, as you told us, were part of this Vaudeville Theatre act.

Lewis Gilbert10:06

Yeah.

Presenter10:07

You did spend quite a lot of the time touring with your parents. Can can you describe what life

Lewis Gilbert10:13

Yeah.

Presenter10:13

was like

Lewis Gilbert10:13

Well, it was wonderful to to tour with my parents. I would get in the train with my parents, and then they would put me up on the rack and cover me with coats, so that when the man with the tickets came round, they wouldn't have to pay for me. And uh I loved that. I used to think that was very great fun.

Presenter10:33

And your father contracted tuberculosis when he was young?

Lewis Gilbert10:36

Yes. My father had TB when he was well, he he died at thirty-four and I was seven. And that was very, very difficult for me, very difficult for my mother, because up to that time we were r passably well off. And then suddenly the TB got worse. Wi it was very virulent in those days and you couldn't treat it. So gradually he went downhill.

Presenter11:01

Can you remember hearing about I mean, how did you find out that your father had died? As you say you were only seven.

Lewis Gilbert11:06

No, I I remember very distinctly how I when I was playing in the street, and um suddenly m a very distant cousin came up to me,

Lewis Gilbert11:18

And she said, I've got sad news for you. Your father died to day.

Lewis Gilbert11:24

And it didn't really mean anything to me, because I was only seven. But she said to me, Here you are, and she delved into her pocket and she brought out fourpence and gave me this she said, Go and buy yourself a bag of sweets and I can tell you I ran all the way to the sweet shop to buy the sweets, and that's what I thought of, and not my father, because it doesn't come home to me that I would never see him again. But it was then times were bad, but then they were very difficult.

Speaker 411:29

Mm-hmm.

Presenter11:58

We'll talk about that in just a moment. For now, though, let's pause for some more music. What are we going to hear now, Lewis?

Lewis Gilbert11:59

Uh

Presenter12:03

Yeah.

Lewis Gilbert12:03

Joe Beam, I had a terrible film called The Adventurers, which was a big, sprawling, very expensive film, which was a disaster. I should never have made it. And uh one that I'm not proud of.

Speaker 112:30

Help me.

Speaker 112:39

Yeah, I'm gonna

Presenter12:48

Antonio Carlos Jobim and Ellis Regina and Agoas de Marceau. So, Louis Gilbert, after your father's death, as you say, he died very young, he was only uh thirty four of T B.

Speaker 112:58

Yeah. Yeah.

Presenter13:00

It fell on you to be the breadwinner of the family.

Presenter13:03

You got parts in was it silent films you began acting in, is that right?

Lewis Gilbert13:07

Yes, that's absolutely true. And I remember being in one silent film and uh the boy who sat next to me in class, I told him that the film I was in was playing at a local cinema. So we both bunked off from school and went to see the film. So

Presenter13:25

Quite good fun, actually. And I mean, you mentioned school there. We hadn't really touched on school in your childhood. Did you manage to to get a sort of proper education? Did you go to school?

Lewis Gilbert13:34

School full time? No, I never did, really. Because I I was the breadwinner at such an early age. Did you feel the weight of that? Did you feel the weight of being the one who was bringing home the bacon? No,'cause it was my life. I think but that one's life is one's life, and you accept it and you make the best of it, and I thought I was very lucky in many ways.

Presenter13:55

And and did your mother remarry after your father's death?

Lewis Gilbert13:57

Never. She never went on the stage again and she never remarried again. Theirs had been a real love story really, and it was very, very tough on her. But she had a stroke of luck. She became a film extra. I see. And uh that was in a way my entry into it. You were seventeen then when you got a party.

Presenter13:57

No.

Presenter14:17

In The Divorce of Lady X Laurence Olivier, who Buffs will remember, start in that what was Laurence Olivier like?

Lewis Gilbert14:20

Love you, Month.

Lewis Gilbert14:24

Well, that was one of the great moments in my life because the thought of working with Lawrence Olivia, you know, when you're seventeen is a thing you'll think, oh my gosh, I'll be terrible, it'll be going to be awful. But it taught me a very great lesson of being kind to your fellow actors means a lot. I mean, I knew it again when in later life I did the film with Awesome Wells, which was a nightmare beyond all who never cared about his fellow actors, just went his own way, didn't want to listen to the director, didn't care, and it was a nightmare.

Presenter15:01

Yeah. Uh you were directing him and he yes. I mean, did you take him on? He of course, infamously, he was a very, very tough, big character. Did you did you have fights with him?

Lewis Gilbert15:03

Yeah.

Lewis Gilbert15:10

Yeah, I tried, but, you know, it's very difficult'cause he's clever, and he knows that if he goes sick you'll get the blame,'cause he knew that one day there was no insurance, and one day

Presenter15:23

This was the movie Ferry to Hong Kong that you were. I mean, how did it turn out, given that you got.

Lewis Gilbert15:25

Yeah

Lewis Gilbert15:27

Dreadful. Was it? Oh, it was my nightmare film. It was a dreadful film, and everything was wrong with it. But principally him. Principally him.

Presenter15:37

Let's have some more music then, Louis. What are we going to listen to next? You've chosen some Rachmaninoff. Tell me why you've chosen this.

Lewis Gilbert15:43

I was at Uxbridge camp during the war and we used to get free tickets to a concert hall and I sat down in the auditorium but it was the first night of the Blitz and the bombs started to rain down and I turned round and there was a girl, young girl, a wren, sitting next to me. Then the sirens went and I can't remember who the conductor was, but he said, we'll play some dance music and you can all dance in the aisles. And I said to this girl, shall we dance? And we danced around in the hall. It was wonderful. Actually, the bombs are dropping all round me, but it was wonderful to be with this wren. And then the all-clear went, and I left the the hall with her. So I walked home and through the streets of London burning. All around us there was fires. And then she said to me, I left her at Dolphin Square and I said, well, you're all right now. And she said, well, why don't you come in and have a cup of coffee?

Lewis Gilbert16:50

Uh uh I thought to myself, we're in luck and I did, and I obviously I stayed the night, and we stood on the terrace and watched London burning, which was quite an experience.

Presenter18:05

That was part of the third movement of Rachmaninoff's second symphony, played by the London Symphony Orchestra, conducted by Andre Preven, and memories there, Louis Gilbert, of this young wren that who sort of disappeared into the night. You worked, as we were talking about, on the divorce of Lady X, and it was there that you met Alexander Corda, then the biggest director really of his time in Britain. I mean, the list of people you've worked with is I mean, in those early days was astonishing. You were a very young man. You were working with people like Graham Greene, who at the time was writing scripts. You wrote with Vivian Lee.

Lewis Gilbert18:37

Yes.

Presenter18:38

Did it ever overwhelm you working with these situations?

Lewis Gilbert18:41

No, because I'd been in show business all my life, so it didn't overwhelm me. I knew.

Presenter18:45

Yeah.

Lewis Gilbert18:46

I mean, for instance, Vivian Lee, who is the most beautiful, beautiful girl, was the first woman I ever heard swear. I couldn't believe that this beautiful girl could say these things. I can't say it because it's it's that bad, isn't it?

Presenter18:58

It's that bad, is it? Terrible. It was of course not cut short, but certainly interrupted by the war. Y you've said that serving in the RAF was a terrible eye opener, a grim education in the bloody horror of war. Yes. You found it tough, did you?

Lewis Gilbert19:13

Yes.

Lewis Gilbert19:15

Well, it's a whole book in itself, the war years for me, because eventually I was seconded to the US Air Corps and I was with the US Air Corps Film Unit, and that was a big, big step up for me. But there in the US Air Corps I was very lucky because my CO was a very famous director, Keely, William Keely, directed many big Hollywood films. But he hated the cold. He couldn't stand the cold. And he'd say to me, You do it, you do it, you can do it. I was his assistant. And it went on like that. And that's when I got my first

Speaker 119:38

It would

Lewis Gilbert19:50

Directorial job.

Presenter19:52

And what sort of things would you have been filming with that film unit during the war?

Lewis Gilbert19:55

Well, the main one which changed my life was a scene where these boys, when they took off in a plane to fly over Germany, they had to empty their pockets of everything and leave it all behind. Pictures of their baby, of their wife, of their house. And it was a great moment that very dramatic. And I said to him, You are going to do that scene, aren't you? No, no, you can do it, he said, you can do it. Well, of course I could do it. I mean, you'd have to be a real idiot not to do it. They were actually doing it for you. So naturally I knew I couldn't make a mess of that. And then I said to him, Would you like to see the rushes? Oh, no, no, I'm sure they'll you go up and see them.

Presenter20:17

Diplomatic, of course, yeah.

Lewis Gilbert20:42

I went up to town and

Lewis Gilbert20:44

There was a man sitting there.

Lewis Gilbert20:46

And he said, Would you mind if I stay? I said, No, not at all And I ran this stuff well, of course it was marvellous. They weren't acting, they were practically in tears, you know, it was a wonderful scene.

Lewis Gilbert20:58

And uh at the end of it, this man said to me, Oh, that was very impressive He said, Who shot this stuff? And I said, I did he said, Oh, really? Very good He said, My name's Arthur Elton, I'm head of the films division for the MLI He said, If you ever come out of the Air Force, come and see me'cause I could use you as a as a director And that's how I be

Presenter21:19

He became a director. The next astonishing instalment of Louis Gilbert's Life coming after this piece of music. It only gets better. Tell us what we're going to hear next. It's disc number five we've got now, Louis.

Lewis Gilbert21:30

This is Alfie of course. Yes. This was after Alfie. From Alfie I was a a big time director because that was a really big hit round the world. And um Sonny Rollins did it live. He didn't didn't write out a score. He projected the film onto a screen and he did his stuff. And I thought that was wonderful. Sonny Rollins Alfie theme from the film soundtrack.

Presenter21:32

Yeah.

Presenter22:26

That was Sonny Rollins and Alfie's theme from the film soundtrack. Is it true, Lewis Gilbert, that Terran's stamp was penciled in to play Alfie?

Lewis Gilbert22:33

Yes, he was. It was very difficult because I didn't think he was right. And again my son J John Gilbert said to me, Why are you getting so worried about somebody to play Alfie? You've got one on your doorstep. Michael Kane would be absolutely perfect for it. That's how Michael Kane got the part. I don't think he realized it was the director's son that recommended him.

Presenter22:58

It was your wife, Hilda, who who actually discovered the play itself. If if we rewind a bit, h how did she find out about it?

Lewis Gilbert23:05

Well, that was very odd because my wife went to the hairdresser and in the next chair there was an actress, Michael Courtney, and she was in this play. She said, I'm in a wonderful play at the moment, I think. You ought to come and see it, she said. So my wife went, she came back and said, You've got to do this play. It won't make a wonderful film. And it did. And Michael Caine never looked back. I never looked back. Alfie was a big success for everybody.

Presenter23:36

I mean, it defined a moment in in culture as as well as a moment in your career. Di did you know was it your aim, as you were making Alfie, that you wanted to capture something new and something quite conflicted about where British society was at the time?

Lewis Gilbert23:51

Yes, I think so. It was anti British in a way. The biggest thing we did was to make Alfie talk confidentially to the camera. That was new. And Michael was able to do it, and he did it wonderfully well.

Presenter24:08

Alfie was nominated, of course, uh five Oscars, wasn't it nominated for five Oscars.

Lewis Gilbert24:11

Fuck.

Lewis Gilbert24:11

Wasn't it nominated for five Oscars? It ran the board in America and we got the Golden Globe and we got many, many awards on the film. What do you remember of all

Presenter24:21

Oscar Knight itself was

Lewis Gilbert24:23

Of going to the Academy Awards.

Presenter24:24

Uh

Lewis Gilbert24:25

I didn't go to that. You didn't? No, I didn't go to that. Why not? I dunno. I d I just I just didn't go. It was a long way to go. Did you not want to be part of the s?

Presenter24:34

Yeah.

Presenter24:35

Dirkus

Lewis Gilbert24:36

No, I just felt I'd got all the things I wa already wanted. I got the Golden Globe and I got many other rewards. And life is not about awards, is it? It's really about choice.

Presenter24:49

And what about the choices that you had everywhere and indeed in Hollywood after Alfie? Because Alfie was a it was a big hit, obviously, in the States as well as Europe.

Lewis Gilbert24:56

Yes.

Lewis Gilbert24:57

Well then I made the biggest mistake of my life, which comes really to the next piece of music, which is Georgia Brown singing It's a Fine Life. From Oliver, of course. From Oliver, because if I was born to make a film, it was to make Oliver. I longed to make Oliver and Lionel Bart said to me, Nobody else will do it, you will do it.

Presenter25:07

From Oliver, of course.

Presenter25:20

And you were working all the time on the development and

Lewis Gilbert25:22

When I was making the Bond film, in fact Cubby used to say to me, Which film are we working on today, Lewis? He was great, Cubby, he was good natured and he didn't mind me in his time working on Oliver with Lionel Bart, you know. And that was a fil a film that I longed, longed to make and I messed it up because I signed a contract where the chap said to me, Oh, don't worry, you can do Oliver.

Presenter25:22

Getting it registering.

Lewis Gilbert25:49

But he reneged on it.

Presenter25:51

And what what had you signed the contract for? What were you tied into?

Lewis Gilbert25:55

I don't want to say the name of it. It's too hurtful for me to say that I gave up Oliver to do that film.

Lewis Gilbert26:05

That was the other thing. So they said, We can't get anybody at this late stage. I said, Well, there's plenty of directors around, surely. It's it's a wonderful subject. I said, By the way, Carol Reed is available and in the end they gave the film to Carol Reed. And on the Academy Awards for Oliver,

Lewis Gilbert26:25

Carol Reed got best director. And I happened to have been in Hollywood at the time and I walked into the hotel and there was Carol Reed. He rushed over and he threw his arms round me and he thanked me for recommending him to do the film. But I mean he was a great director anyway and uh that that's show business.

Presenter26:46

It is indeed show business. I'm wondering then, as you sat down, did you just pay your ticket money and went in to see it in a in a normal cinema, did you when you went to see Oliver? Yes. So as you watched it, what was going through your head?

Lewis Gilbert26:59

I may not have made it as good as this.

Lewis Gilbert27:02

I just felt that for a fleeting moment, and then I thought Course you would have done. Yes, you'd have made a great film out of it.

Speaker 127:08

If you don't mind having to go with hard things, it's a fine life. Though it ain't all jolly old pleasure addings, it's a fine life. When you got someone to laugh, you forget your cares and strife. Let the prudes look down on us, let the wide world frown on us. It's a fine fine life.

Lewis Gilbert27:21

I

Speaker 427:21

Bye, guys.

Presenter27:37

Georgia Brown singing It's a Fine Life from the original Londoncast recording of Lionel Bart's Oliver. Lewis, w we've heard in passing about your wife Hilda and the crucial part she she played in in getting Alfie to the screen. She found the play for you. You were married for I think it was fifty-three years. She was a ravishing creature by all accounts, the photographs I've seen.

Speaker 127:49

Yeah. Let's

Lewis Gilbert27:58

Well she was very, very beautiful. Yes. Uh very beautiful. I mean any room she walked into she would stop him stone dead. But she was wonderful for me because she was so well up in show business, going to plays, going to films, recommending this, recommending that. I was lucky. How did you how did you meet?

Lewis Gilbert28:21

Well, funny enough, I was now a documentary director making my first documentary and I was waiting for the lift. The lift door opened and there were these two girls there, very, very pretty. And before I could step in, the gates closed. And that evening, I came out of the Shepherdsburg studios, and there ahead of me were these two girls. So I put on a bit of speed. I got there and well the end of the story is that I said, how about lunch on Sunday? She said, well, no, I can't do that. She said, I'm going to my cousin, but why don't you come with me? I'll meet you on Waterloo Station. I said, fine. Meet at the booking office 11 o'clock. So I go, I turn up.

Lewis Gilbert29:11

Nothing. She doesn't show.

Presenter29:12

Huh.

Lewis Gilbert29:13

So I'm absolutely furious, fuming. And then I thought, No, I'm not going to let her get away with that. So I rang the number, she answered it, and I said to her, And what happened to you to day?

Lewis Gilbert29:25

There was a pause, and she said, You mean what happened to you? I said, What do you mean? She said, Well, I waited an hour for you But it turned out there were two booking offices at Waterloo Station. Now, strangely enough, it couldn't have been better because we both started to laugh, and from then on

Speaker 429:36

Yeah.

Presenter29:45

That was it. There there was a point, though, where love did not run smoothly. Was there not wasn't there a point where she decided that she would go off with somebody else and she did in fact get married?

Lewis Gilbert29:54

No, no, that was me actually. Oh, was it? I struck a very bad patch and I could see that I couldn't afford marriage at all. And I said to her that I have to go.

Presenter29:56

Or was it?

Presenter29:59

Dog.

Presenter30:04

Right.

Presenter30:07

Right.

Lewis Gilbert30:08

which was a dreadful thing to do, and she then married somebody else.

Presenter30:14

You must have been heartbroken.

Lewis Gilbert30:15

Yes, it was terrible.

Presenter30:15

Yeah.

Lewis Gilbert30:17

Anyway, eventually she rang me and said she'd also made a terrible mess of her life. We must meet. And that's what we did. And we both burst into tears. We embraced, and that was it. And we knew we were never going to be separated again.

Presenter30:31

Meh

Presenter30:37

We're going to have some music now. Um the penultimate disc. What are we going to hear now, Lewis? And we're going to hear the finale of the firebird. And this this actually is a piece of music that you used on on was it, Shelly Valentine, I think?

Lewis Gilbert30:49

Yes, I think it was Shadi Valentine, yes, and a film which I loved making, loved working with Pauline Collins. I find that when a film you have a wonderful time and it's delightful to work on, it's always successful. So I do strive for that.

Presenter32:00

That was the finale of The Firebird by Stravinsky, performed by the City of Birmingham Symphony Orchestra, conducted by Simon Rattle, and it was music Louis Gilbert that you used in the soundtrack to Shirley Valentine. I I I'm thinking about the the other women in your life and here I here I'm talking about movie stars. The the of course you you made Educating Rita and Shirley Valentine, very different from the Bond movies, very different from the war movies that you made. Do you feel you're somebody who had a a particular empathy for strong women characters at the centre of movies?

Speaker 132:19

And

Speaker 132:23

Beta f

Speaker 132:24

Bye.

Lewis Gilbert32:32

Maybe.

Lewis Gilbert32:33

Maybe that's true. Maybe that's true, because i it's funny that a lot of films were about women.

Presenter32:40

Yeah, I'm saying

Lewis Gilbert32:41

A lot of my films are about women. Darling Virginia McKenna who did Carver Name with Pride, Another Wonderful Girl.

Lewis Gilbert32:48

I think I was better at directing women than men, strangely enough. Why do you think that was?

Lewis Gilbert32:54

Maybe I like them better.

Presenter32:57

You have, as we know, you brought up two sons. You've got five grandchildren. Is it two great-grandchildren? So far?

Lewis Gilbert33:03

So three now.

Presenter33:04

And how do you get on with all of them? Have any of them

Lewis Gilbert33:06

Have any of them? Very close to them, yes. Oh God, yes, they they see me all

Presenter33:12

For the time. I mentioned that you'd been married for fifty three years. You you must have had to deal with with loneliness when Hilda passed away. I mean, that must have been a that must have very, very hard. Yeah. Very hard.

Lewis Gilbert33:16

You

Lewis Gilbert33:21

Yes.

Lewis Gilbert33:23

Yeah.

Presenter33:24

And what was it was it family that?

Lewis Gilbert33:26

that saw you through that then? Was it you and your sons, yes? I would say yes, it was. My sons, grandsons, they were all wonderful, and I see them all the time. I'm never lonely because they they always keep in touch with me.

Presenter33:27

Was it the sands? Yeah.

Presenter33:39

We're going to hear a piece of music now. It's our final piece of music, which in a way I think is dedicated to your late wife. Tell me about the music.

Lewis Gilbert33:45

Tell me about the music that I've been. And she would have loved this piece of music, as I do too, and I think a lot of people would. It's very much of its time, which I suppose was the thirties or twenties and thirties, I expect.

Speaker 434:01

Let's hear it.

Presenter34:02

Yeah.

Speaker 434:03

You may not be an angel.

Speaker 434:06

Cause angels are so few.

Speaker 434:09

But until the day that one comes along, I'll swing along with you.

Speaker 434:16

I'm looking for an angel

Speaker 434:19

To sing my love song to

Speaker 434:22

And until the day that one comes along, I'll sing my song for you.

Speaker 134:23

Yeah.

Speaker 434:28

For every little fault that you have, say I've got three or four.

Presenter34:34

That was Al Boley with Ray Noble in his orchestra, and I'll string along with you. So, Lewis Gilbert, we come to the point, then, where I'm going to give you a copy of the Bible and the complete works of Shakspere. I'm wondering what the book you'll take will be.

Presenter34:48

Uh

Lewis Gilbert34:48

Well, I've got two things really. I've got to work my mind and other the f my work my physical fitness. So first of all my mind, I would like a book of poems, of which I could probably learn one every couple of days.

Lewis Gilbert35:06

It would help me a lot.

Presenter35:07

Okay, so that's a sort of compendium of poetry. Yes, right.

Lewis Gilbert35:09

Yes, a companion. And then the other one is a physical. So is this your luxury now? This is my luxury and my physical.

Presenter35:15

This is my

Lewis Gilbert35:17

My luxury is a football. Oh. And the reason why I'd like a football

Lewis Gilbert35:23

Is that all these monkeys and chimps on the island would follow me. They would start to learn how to play the game. And I every day I would take my chimps out and I'd have a team. And then

Speaker 135:28

Bro

Presenter35:37

And you're used to working with actors anyway, so.

Lewis Gilbert35:40

That's right. And I can if I can work with actors, I can work with chimpanzees, that's for sure. Now should I be rescued, then I will be a multi-millionaire because I would take my team to England. I think it'd be terrific.

Presenter35:53

It's it's certainly a terrific thought. That's your luxury then. You may have a football. And if you had to choose just one of these eight discs, which one disc would you choose above all others that we've heard today?

Lewis Gilbert35:56

And have a five.

Presenter36:06

I think it would have to be Al Boli. Right, it's yours. Louis Gilbert, thank you very much for letting us hear your desert island discs. Thank you.

Presenter37:00

You've been listening to a download from the BBC. You'll find more information on the Radio Four website bbc. co dot uk slash radio four.