Barry Manilow

Presenter0:00

Hello, I'm Kirsty Young, and this is a podcast from the Desert Island Discs archive. For rights reasons we've had to shorten the music. The programme was originally broadcast in two thousand nine.

Presenter0:27

My castaway this week is Barry Manilow. His stellar music career has taken him to the very pinnacle of Shobi's achievement.

Presenter0:35

To be a hugely successful performer is one thing, to sustain that success over thirty-five years.

Presenter0:41

is something else entirely.

Presenter0:43

His life began, he says, when, aged thirteen, his mother bought him a piano.

Presenter0:48

It took her five years to pay for it, but there's been a pretty good return on her investment. Despite Rolling Stone Magazine describing him as a giant among entertainers, I am, he says,

Presenter0:59

Just a musician, a one of the band kind of a guy, who got lucky.

Presenter1:04

Really?

Barry Manilow1:05

That's exactly the way I feel. And on my passport, it doesn't say entertainer or showman or even singer. On my passport, it says musician.

Barry Manilow1:15

I mean, I think all of us that came from Brooklyn, New York, like I come from Barbara, Neil, Mel Brooks, we all seem to be shot out of a cannon and we we go catapulting over the Brooklyn Bridge into a life. That's what it seems like.

Presenter1:32

Um the same magazine I mentioned Rolling Stone there describing you as this giant among entertainers. They've also described you as the greatest showman of our generation. And yet I hear, I read, that you never really intended to be a performer.

Barry Manilow1:46

No, I never did.

Barry Manilow1:48

I wanted to be a arranger, a conductor, a producer, maybe a songwriter if I was lucky, but I was very happy staying in in the background. I wanted to leave all that performing to the crazy people that I used to accompany. They were all crazy. And uh that was not me. That was not me.

Presenter2:03

Uh

Presenter2:06

Just explain then to people who don't know how come somebody who who trained classically to read music, who understood music, who saw himself as a a a backroom boy, if you like, the guy whose face would never be on the album cover

Presenter2:21

How did it come to be on the album cover then?

Barry Manilow2:23

Um, well, w what happened was that I was I really wanted my songs to get out there. I really believed in them and nobody wanted to record them. And so I would make demos myself. I would sing them only because I knew the words. And I sang in tune.

Presenter2:37

But I know.

Barry Manilow2:40

But I didn't think I had a style or anything. And I made these demos to show my songs off, and through various channels I got offered a record contract, and I was about to turn it down. But I mean, the idea of getting my songs on a record

Barry Manilow2:59

I couldn't. And so I said yes, and they slapped my photo on the front cover. That's how that happened.

Presenter3:04

And thirty-five years later, do you feel like that person now then? Do you feel like a performer, an entertainer, a superstar?

Barry Manilow3:05

Yeah.

Barry Manilow3:11

In my gut, no. In my gut. I feel much more comfortable conducting my band, rehearsing with them, giving them the notes to play, arranging the music. That's really what I do. Putting on makeup and walking out in front of an audience.

Presenter3:23

Putting on

Barry Manilow3:27

It is not my favorite thing to do. But, you know, I do the best I can and, you know, here I am.

Presenter3:33

No makeup today, but lots of great music. Tell me about the first track that we're going to hear. Why is it?

Barry Manilow3:37

My first track, which is Sinatra.

Presenter3:39

Yeah.

Barry Manilow3:39

Well, you know, he did a batch of albums that were very intimate, very intimate, and this particular track he had nothing on. It was just a singer and the piano on a brilliant song, one for my baby.

Barry Manilow3:56

And here was this guy killing me with just a piano.

Speaker 34:00

I got the routine.

Speaker 34:04

Put another nickel

Speaker 34:08

In the machine.

Speaker 34:14

Feeling so bad.

Speaker 34:18

Can't you make the music?

Speaker 34:21

Easy inside.

Barry Manilow4:25

And you know he's in tune all the way. No editing, no engineers who are fixing his voice up. It's just him.

Barry Manilow4:34

It's the perfect vocal.

Presenter4:35

That was Frank Sinatra, of course, singing one from My Baby. I've heard, I've read that he said when you came on the scene in the 70s, of you, he's next.

Barry Manilow4:43

Yeah. I needed to hear that back then,'cause that's when I was getting killed. Killed by the critics.

Presenter4:49

The critics.

Barry Manilow4:50

The public really loved what I was doing, but the critics didn't. But he came along and said he's next. It really meant a lot to me right then.

Presenter4:59

I bet it did. And and how do you make sense of that? Because you you fill concert halls. Your fans are known for being beyond devotional about you and your music. They buy your albums, they come and watch you in Vegas, and they've done that for thir more than thirty five years now.

Presenter5:14

How do you n unite those two things, the fact that the press, even in the early days, loved seemed to love to give you a really good kicking?

Barry Manilow5:21

Yeah.

Barry Manilow5:22

It was confusing. It it was of course it was hurtful. I'm a human being. You know, I would go and like pull the covers off of my head and, you know, feel sorry for myself. And then the next day in the paper there would be like, you know, thousands of letters, you know,

Presenter5:22

Yeah.

Presenter5:23

Yeah.

Barry Manilow5:36

The public has always been very much on my side and they still are.

Presenter5:39

So tell me about little Barry Allen Pincus then. What was he like when he was a little boy? My mouth full of braces, you know.

Barry Manilow5:45

Oh, yeah, a mouthful of braces. I wore braces from 11 until I was 16. Can you imagine the worst years of any kid's life, 11 to 16, looking like that? It's one of the reasons that it pushed me in the background. You know, I didn't ever see myself in the foreground. But I was musical. I was a musical kid, and my family knew it. And they all didn't know what to do with me because they had no money. There was no money in the family. It suddenly emerged as having some kind of ability, some sort of talent. They didn't know what to do with me.

Presenter5:51

Thank you.

Presenter6:13

And how did it emerge? I mean, was it music lessons in school?

Barry Manilow6:16

It was. My mother sang, and that was good. They got me an accordion. That was all they could afford. And my mother would sing. She would sing the songs on the radio, and I would accompany her.

Barry Manilow6:27

That was it.

Presenter6:28

And so who's at home? Mum was at home in the early days.

Barry Manilow6:31

With grandma, grandpa, and my mother, and lots of family members.

Presenter6:34

Okay, and your grandmother, I get the impression was I would call it a big character. Would that be fair? Was she a big character?

Barry Manilow6:40

Um, yeah, everybody was afraid of grandma. I was not afraid of grandma. She loved me. She loved me. And my mother had to work and and support everybody. And so she was out working and I was being raised by grandma and grandpa.

Barry Manilow6:54

I'll always remember them very fondly.

Presenter6:56

And is it true your grandmother broke

Presenter6:59

Your mother's nose when she found out she was pregnant with you?

Barry Manilow7:03

That's what they told me. Yeah, that's what they told me. You must have read some of the book. Yeah. I read all of it. That's what she told me. Yeah.

Presenter7:07

Yeah, that's what she's read all.

Barry Manilow7:11

She didn't

Presenter7:11

What was that about? I mean, she was married. She was born, yes. Yeah, but she wasn't she was a married woman, your mother. It wasn't she wasn't bringing disgrace on the family for having it.

Barry Manilow7:12

Well, I was born yesterday.

Barry Manilow7:18

She may have been bringing disgrace on the family because she was marrying an Irish truck driver.

Presenter7:23

Right.

Barry Manilow7:23

Right. And my grandparents they believed in m a Jew marrying a Jew and my mother was like not doing that and she was pregnant. So I don't think that that went over too well with them.

Presenter7:35

Okay. And and ha within the confines of obviously not having

Presenter7:39

A bunch of money and your mother s supporting the household. Was it a happy household? Did did you like being at home? Did you smile a lot, laugh a lot?

Barry Manilow7:48

Um, was it a happy household?

Barry Manilow7:51

When there was music there, it was a happy household. When there was no music in the air, I'm not so sure.

Barry Manilow7:58

I think it was a lot of fear and a lot of work. There was never any money. Everybody was always struggling. I'm not sure you can be happy when you're worried like that about putting food on the table and paying the rent for this little apartment that we were all squeezed into. But when the music happened, whether it was my stupid little accordion or when Edna was singing, when the radio was on, yes.

Presenter8:04

Hmm.

Barry Manilow8:22

Everybody was okay. Everything was okay when the musics began.

Presenter8:26

Tell me about your next track then.

Barry Manilow8:27

Well, the next track you have is Judy's Over the Rainbow. And Edna, my mom, took me to see her when I was very young. And just even at that young age, I'll just never forget the emotions that were hitting me coming from the stage and coming from the orchestra. And I can actually remember, because we were in the box seat, don't ask me how, looking down on the stage, right there, right there, I could see Judy sitting on the stage singing Over the Rainbow. And it was an epiphany for a young musical guy. I'd never felt anything quite like that.

Speaker 49:02

Somewhere over the rainbow

Speaker 49:12

Eyes are blue.

Speaker 49:18

Have the dreams that you dare to dream.

Speaker 49:28

Really do call

Presenter9:32

Judy Garland and Over the Rainbow. That was recorded 1960, I think.

Barry Manilow9:36

Here in London.

Presenter9:38

And her voice is it's is mature. Mature, you can you can hear you can hear a life in that voice. That's right. Do I mean, do do you worry about that for yourself? Do you do you ever wonder about your voice? Do you think, will I know the point at which it's not right anymore to to to have an audience listen to me?

Barry Manilow9:44

That's right.

Barry Manilow9:55

So far, everything has been okay. You know, I just don't take it seriously. I take the audiences seriously. I take my work seriously. My voice.

Barry Manilow10:05

Because you

Presenter10:07

Because you think you've never that's not what it's been about, really, the voice.

Barry Manilow10:10

It's not I try to to tell the truth in everything I do, but as far as a vocalist, well that's the greatest vocalist. Sinatra and Judy, those are the two greatest voices that are telling us the truth that we ever had.

Presenter10:11

Yeah.

Presenter10:24

Uh when did your musical education, if you like, begin then? When did you start to understand and be interested properly in music?

Barry Manilow10:32

When Willie brought home this stack of albums, Willie Murphy was my stepfather, my mother remarried. And he brought with him a funny little stereo system, which I had never seen. It was a little square with speakers that I thought were like the greatest speakers ever. Now I know that it must have been awful. And he brought with him a stack of albums from jazz giants like Bill Evans and Chet Baker and Jerry Mulligan to singers like Judy and Frank and loads more of Broadway musicals. These were like a stack of gold to me. I mean, I was stuck with the accordion playing Havana Gilla, and suddenly here was Willie, and he said, What's he doing with an accordion? Get him a piano. And they got me a piano.

Presenter11:03

I mean, I was

Barry Manilow11:14

That was the beginning for me.

Presenter11:16

Did music seem like real life to you? I mean, there was all the other stuff going on. You know, there was school or you had to do your homework or playing with friends, but when you listened to the music, did that sort of seem like life in colour to you?

Barry Manilow11:27

Well, it was yeah, it was where I was the most comfortable. Just like when I told you about my younger household, when the music was playing, everything was good. Well, when the music was playing when I was uh thirteen or fourteen, everything was good. Same thing happened with Edna and Willie. Edna and Willie, when they got married, they were always arguing, they were alcoholics, you know, and but when the music was playing, everything was better.

Presenter11:49

Let's have some music. Tell me what's next.

Barry Manilow11:51

Well, Willie took me to my first uh jazz concert uh and it was to Town Hall to see the Jerry Mulligan quartet. And again, it was just like Judy. Uh it was an another epiphany to hear that kind of talent coming off the stage from

Barry Manilow12:06

Instruments this time.

Barry Manilow12:07

See, that's what I mean. When you're talented and you tell the truth, it doesn't matter what whether you got a saxophone in your mouth, it still was doing it to me.

Barry Manilow12:44

Doing

Barry Manilow12:55

Mm-hmm.

Barry Manilow12:57

Uh

Barry Manilow12:58

Uh

Presenter13:15

The Jerry Mulligan Quartet and What Is There to Say. Many years later, after, as you say, watching him on stage as a young boy, you worked with Jerry. How did that go?

Barry Manilow13:25

I had

Barry Manilow13:27

Oh, it was such an honor. It was a thrill. It was when I met him, you know, he was one of my first phone calls when I decided that I was going to take a chance and get out of the pop record world and just do one for me. You know, Michelangelo said one for the Pope, one for myself. So I did one for Clive Davis, the Pope, and one for me. So the one for me was my first jazz album.

Presenter13:29

Yeah.

Presenter13:50

And is this the the same album that you recorded in one take?

Barry Manilow13:53

I did want to do it.

Presenter13:53

And if you had a a room full of greats, I mean you had Serravaugh and you had Mel Tournier

Barry Manilow13:56

Mel Tourmey. It was called 2 A.M. Paradise Cafe and that was it. That was the album.

Presenter14:02

You had been you trained at the obviously highly prestigious Juilliard School. What did you imagine for yourself while you were training? What did you think life was going to hold?

Barry Manilow14:10

I I I really didn't connect with learning uh what I learned at Juilliard. I'll tell you what, the biggest education I could ever have was when I was doing commercials.

Barry Manilow14:19

I mean, I learned the rudiments of music when I went to school and I needed to do that. But after a while it got pretty boring'cause they were going in the classical music area and I just didn't fi find that that's that was not my thing. But I needed to learn the the the language.

Presenter14:34

There is so much to cover in your career because it's stretched over a great amount of time. I want to sort of spool forward to you sold out, was it, ten nights running at Radio City Music Hall?

Barry Manilow14:48

Oh yeah, Radio City, oh man, yeah. Then my family took me to the Christmas show at Radio City, big very big deal. The orchestra is galore. They would come up from the bottom, they'd come in from the top, musicians, like all every musician in the world was on that stage. Oh yeah, so it was a big deal when I stood up on that stage for rehearsal. And I stood on the stage of Radio City looking at the seat that I used to sit in way up in the fourth balcony, standing on the stage and looking at the seat up there. Yeah, that was a big, big deal.

Presenter15:16

Tell me about it. What what did what went through your head? Can you remember?

Barry Manilow15:19

I'll tell you what went through my mind. What the hell are you doing here? That's what went through my mind.

Presenter15:26

Because you felt, and some some people say that, don't they? They somehow feel like a a sort of a fraud, they feel like it's not meant for them.

Barry Manilow15:34

I I I I've always known that I was a good musician. Going to this other level has just never never made any sense to me.

Presenter15:43

Let's have some music. Tell me about your next track. We're on track number four now.

Barry Manilow15:46

This is the final piece from one of the most brilliant Broadway scores that Leonard Bernstein ever wrote. The musical is called Candide. I mean, the last cut on Candide is Make Our Garden Grow. The end of that one is the one that rips your hair out. It's this gorgeous, gorgeous music. So go to it.

Presenter16:30

The original Broadway cast recording of Make Our Garden Grow from the finale of Candide. You were talking about I was asking you about uh performing on these great stages.

Presenter16:39

Did your mother come and see you when you were playing these big gigs?

Barry Manilow16:42

Yeah, my whole family, they were still there when my performing career took off. They were all very, very, very proud.

Presenter16:48

Because of course it doesn't just profoundly affect the life of the performer. It by ripples in a pool affects the people that surround them. How did your mother deal with your incredible fame?

Barry Manilow16:58

Very very proud. She's a funny girl. I was his first producer. She would run around saying, you know, and and my grandparents were there. The whole family was was were very proud.

Presenter17:07

You say she was a funny girl. You mean funny, ha ha, funny, humorous. Yeah, funny, yes.'Cause she had on paper, she had a dramatic life. I mean, she was somebody who struggled. You you mentioned it a a few minutes ago that she was an alcoholic.

Barry Manilow17:11

But it's

Speaker 417:12

Two.

Barry Manilow17:18

Hmm.

Presenter17:19

She she struggled with mental illness.

Barry Manilow17:21

But you know, those people are funny. Talk to any comics.

Presenter17:23

Talk to any comic.

Barry Manilow17:25

You know, they come from

Barry Manilow17:27

A lot of hardship tragedies, you know. She was one of those. She was funny.

Presenter17:31

Did you get a

Barry Manilow17:31

Uh

Presenter17:31

Mm-hmm.

Barry Manilow17:32

Oh, sorry.

Barry Manilow17:34

It was a typical mother-son relationship, you know, we battled and we fought and we laugh a lot.

Presenter17:40

Jewish mother, Jewish son? I mean, was she all did she all have expectations?

Barry Manilow17:43

Think grandma was that.

Presenter17:44

Okay.

Barry Manilow17:45

No, Edna was more sophisticated. She was in Manhattan and she was a secretary. She was wearing spike heels and she was not the typical Jewish mother.

Presenter17:55

Did you want to please her? Was it important to please her?

Barry Manilow17:57

Yeah, I mean that's what you do when you're younger. You try to please your parents, sure.

Presenter17:59

Hmm.

Barry Manilow18:02

Sure.

Presenter18:03

And you did say in your book that you were

Presenter18:06

You know, you were a good boy, you were well behaved, I was yeah.

Barry Manilow18:07

I was. Yeah. I was.

Presenter18:09

Convention

Barry Manilow18:10

I still am. I pride myself in being a gentleman. I like it. I feel the same way about my career. I take responsibility for this career that these strangers have given me. I don't do things that will wind up in the front page of the tabloids. I don't say things that could get me in trouble. I take it very seriously.

Presenter18:32

Tell me about what you yourself have called I think it was the asshole years.

Barry Manilow18:35

My asshole period, yeah.

Presenter18:37

Yes, tell me about that.

Barry Manilow18:39

Well, it was some. I think all of us go through it when this hurricane of success hits you. The worst of your personality comes out. That's what happens. And it did. It hit me too. It hit me too after Mandy came out and I had a million people fawning over me and guessing me, and the life I knew just disappeared, and I was thrust into another universe. And I didn't know how to behave. I just didn't know how to behave.

Presenter19:09

Completely disorientating. Totally. Yeah.

Barry Manilow19:12

I looked up four years later and I didn't have any friends. I was somewhere on the road in some hotel room. I didn't even know the area code and I was alone.

Presenter19:21

But apart from being alone, were you also to to kind of form a a carapace around yourself? Were you a sort of kind of empty the room before I get in there, kind of a guy to

Barry Manilow19:28

I didn't. They did. The people that worked for me did. But I didn't stop them. You know, I knew it was happening. I didn't know how to handle success, not that kind of success. And I had to figure out that this life that had disappeared was not coming back. I really wanted it to come back and have my small life back. But it wasn't coming back. And I just had to learn how to accept this.

Presenter19:55

We'll talk about embracing the theme and learning to love it in a moment. For now tell me about your next track, number five.

Barry Manilow20:01

Laura Nero. When I heard Laura's uh album, I stopped writing songs for a year.

Barry Manilow20:06

It stopped me from writing songs. It was so brilliant. Because you thought, I will never come. I'll never come close to this.

Presenter20:10

Have a look.

Barry Manilow20:12

I mean, everything about it just killed me. Killed me. So I chose Laura Nero's Emmy.

Speaker 420:22

And he

Speaker 420:25

Love to be Love to be Carved in a heart.

Speaker 420:34

On a berry tree.

Speaker 420:41

It's only a

Presenter20:48

Laura Nero and Emmy, you've mentioned quite often Barry Manlow as we've been chatting this name Clive, Clive Davis, of course, who is this legendary producer who has very recently overseen the rebirth of Whitney Houston, but who has been responsible over the years for some of your biggest.

Barry Manilow21:04

Oh, I would say for most of my biggest hits, yeah.

Presenter21:08

How do you get on with I mean is he how do you get on with him? Is it is it a an easy relationship?

Barry Manilow21:12

No, it's not an easy relationship. We fight constantly. But year after year, I become more and more amazed at this man's talent. And I tell you, I am the grateful recipient of this guy's abilities. I mean, I've done, I would say, three albums in my career that I didn't care about the public's taste. I mean, he represents the public's taste. Paradise Cafe was one of them. I didn't care whether anybody bought that. An album called Here at the Mayflower was another one. And there's one that's coming up. But the other ones, I say, well, what am I killing myself for if it's not going to land somewhere?

Presenter21:22

That's how you I am.

Presenter21:35

Yeah.

Presenter21:49

And does it you say, killing myself. You're a perfectionist, I imagine you're an absolute perfectionist.

Barry Manilow21:55

I don't like that expression, but I think you're right. It feels like a perfectionist is a little crazy man, just a wild man who won't let the thing go and

Presenter21:58

Boom.

Presenter22:00

Yeah.

Barry Manilow22:04

I don't think that's me. I don't think that's me. But I do hear mistakes. I do hear that where I can make it better.

Speaker 422:05

Yeah.

Presenter22:05

I don't think that

Presenter22:07

Uh

Barry Manilow22:11

If that's a perfectionist, then I try to put the best work out that I can.

Presenter22:14

Yeah, well one one person's crazy man is another person's the guy who gets it right. So I suppose that's your choice. Tell me about meeting your father.

Barry Manilow22:18

Otherwise

Barry Manilow22:19

Okay.

Barry Manilow22:22

Yeah, that was an interesting thing. Did you see that special too?

Presenter22:26

I saw that special, yes, and I read it in the book.

Barry Manilow22:27

Yes, and I read it in the book. You did your homework.

Presenter22:29

I hate to come across like.

Barry Manilow22:31

Not many people ask that question. Tell me about the first time. The first time was when I was 11 years old. My grandmother and my mother and my grandfather, they had me scared to death of this man. He was a monster that deserted me when I was like one years old. And one afternoon I was walking by myself outside our little brownstone.

Presenter22:31

Yeah, well that many people asked many

Presenter22:48

Yeah.

Barry Manilow22:53

But he introduced himself and he said, I know it's your birthday coming up and I got you a tape recorder. I remember standing there stunned, not saying very much. I was a kid, I was 11 years old. He handed me this big reel-to-reel tape recorder and I could see Grandma coming out of the Brownstone apartment across the street and he said, have a good time. He jumped back into his truck and pulled away because he knew she was going to just probably just holler at him. So he didn't seem like a bad guy to me. But that was it.

Presenter23:19

And then the next time?

Barry Manilow23:20

Then the next time was after Amandy had come out and he just snuck backstage and he opened the door to my dressing room. I had my girlfriend Linda there at the time and he poked his head in and I recognized him immediately, you know, and he said, You did good. You did good out there.

Barry Manilow23:37

And that was that, and then he left.

Presenter23:39

And that was that. You didn't think I need to talk to this guy, I need to

Barry Manilow23:41

I think the top

Barry Manilow23:42

Yeah.

Presenter23:42

That was it.

Presenter23:44

Are you fine with that?

Barry Manilow23:46

I guess I am, you know. What what would it have been like? I don't know. I don't know any different. Willie was pretty great. I thought he was a decent guy. He had a life. He had a son. He had a um wife and, you know, I guess he was happy and I certainly am.

Presenter24:00

Let's have some more music then. What have you chosen next? We're on uh track six now.

Barry Manilow24:04

Yeah, you know, it could have been um a lot of different classical pieces. I chose Brahms because the melody is so g just so gorgeous and I'm a melody guy.

Presenter25:04

That was part of the third movement of Brahm's Symphony No. Three. I promised Barry Mandler that we would come back to embracing fame and how you managed to do that, because there you were amid all of this chaotic success, the millions of fans, the constant touring. How did you learn to somehow

Presenter25:22

Except that your life was never going to be the same again.

Barry Manilow25:25

Um

Barry Manilow25:26

It was the people around me that helped me to accept it. I was surrounded with love. My friend Linda, they didn't leave. They just waited for me to land. And I did. I would say about four years later, I landed and I started to make friends with this fame and call everybody that I ever knew and apologize to them for behaving badly. And little by little, I got a life. Maybe it wasn't the life that I lost, but I got a lot of it back. And, you know.

Barry Manilow26:08

I got everybody back that I wanted.

Presenter26:09

Right. And what about, you know, when those n I mean, normal things happen to superstars too, you know, the car breaks down or you want to order a pizza or you just feel like stopping for a cup of coffee.

Barry Manilow26:18

I do as much normal things as I know how to do. Really, I just I do. I've got a greenhouse.

Barry Manilow26:24

And I've learned how to play around down there.

Presenter26:27

Yeah.

Barry Manilow26:27

How do you like that? Look at you. Look at me like I'm talking Chinese to you.

Presenter26:30

No, because I'm because I'm really well, I'm envious actually. What, so you you think you take plants from seedlings and say,

Barry Manilow26:36

I do.

Barry Manilow26:39

I know I do. I actually am not bad at it. You know, I wouldn't say I have the greenest thumb in the world, but you know, by myself, it's a very meditative thing. You know, I put on my classical music and I go down there and I actually.

Barry Manilow26:51

Before I know it, things are popping up.

Presenter26:54

So what is it? Is it is well, I suppose in California, is it oranges or is it beautiful uh orchids or?

Barry Manilow27:00

Well, it's a little bit of all of that. I've got gardenias going and I've got loads of fruits and vegetables going. It's it's great down there. It still allows me to be quiet. Yeah. You know, it's very healing.

Presenter27:08

Yeah, I know.

Presenter27:10

Do you have to to plan to take yourself away from music? I mean, if you didn't think about it, would it just be you know twenty hours of a twenty-four hour day?

Barry Manilow27:16

I would run up to the studio 24 hours a day. I love it so much. I'm very safe there.

Presenter27:20

Yeah.

Presenter27:24

That's a really interesting phrase. When you say y yeah, I mean maybe it just stands on its own, but I can't help thinking that somehow there's a parallel between there being happiness in the house.

Barry Manilow27:36

Oh, you know that. Listen, my theory is that we all wind up doing what we were safest with when we were about thirteen to fifteen. I was comfortable making music and I was f I felt safe then.

Presenter27:47

And minus the braces, which

Barry Manilow27:48

Really? In minus 1 braces, yes.

Presenter27:50

Tell me about your next piece of music then.

Barry Manilow27:52

Well, it stings fragile. I thought we'd get out of the 50s and 60s finally and go to something more contemporary. And I don't think there's any better that can beat this song and him. I don't think anybody has ever topped Fragile.

Presenter27:52

Things

Speaker 428:10

Like tears from the side

Speaker 428:13

Like tears from a star

Speaker 428:17

On an on the rain sea

Speaker 428:21

How fragile we are

Speaker 428:24

A fragile

Presenter28:31

Sting and fragile. I mentioned, Barry Manlow, that you are in, what do they call it in Vegas? They call it in are you in residence at Vegas? I guess I.

Barry Manilow28:37

I guess I'm in residence, yes. Artiste in residence.

Presenter28:39

Artiste in residence. And what does that mean? I mean, apart from I'm sure your name is in 40 foot letters.

Barry Manilow28:44

Oh please, my face is the size of like my old apartment building out there.

Presenter28:50

Over the hotels, it's the Hilton, is it?

Barry Manilow28:51

It's the Hilton, is it?

Presenter28:53

Ugh.

Barry Manilow28:53

Can you imagine my nose? My nose is like, must be like 10 of the 35 stars.

Presenter28:59

Um, so is is that fine to still be working at that rate? Do you not sort of think you want to do a bit more in the potting shed rather than be at the faces?

Barry Manilow29:07

No, no, I like it. I like being with my band. I like being with my singers, their friends, their crew, and I enjoy it. As long as I'm not on the road, the road was the thing that killed me.

Presenter29:17

Right. And do you look back at at the career you've had with a sense of satisfaction, or is there so much more still to do?

Barry Manilow29:26

Oh, I'm very proud of the work that I did. I look back at thirty-five years of mu albums and ma music and I guess it was that Copa shirt. I could regret that Copa shirt. Or the shoes, or those big platform shoes.

Presenter29:36

I love the copa shirt. What were the big roughs? Do you still have the copa shirt?

Barry Manilow29:38

Yeah, well, what were the

Barry Manilow29:39

Yeah.

Barry Manilow29:41

I do. It is now you want to hear a silly story. The Smithsonian asked me if they could have it. So I sent it to them. What am I supposed to say? This stupid Copacabana shirt. So I gave an interview to some radio station and I said I always knew it was going to wind up in an institution some day, and they were so insulted they sent it back.

Presenter29:59

Ah

Barry Manilow29:59

How snooty, yeah. Really, they said they couldn't, they had no sense of humor, so I still have it.

Presenter30:01

Really they said they couldn't

Presenter30:04

You say that, um, interestingly, that that it was sort of love that saved you as as love will from from going nuts over the sort of whole explosion of your fame and fans and all of that sort of stuff. I'm wondering about never having kids. Do you look back at that and think that would have been nice?

Barry Manilow30:18

Oh, no, I would have no, not with my career. I couldn't have done both. I would have given up one for the other.

Barry Manilow30:24

And I chose music.

Presenter30:25

And what about I mean, I I understand that you you give um generously to programmes for music, for young musicians.

Barry Manilow30:32

Which is very important, yeah. Very important to me.

Presenter30:34

Do you go and see the people who benefit from that?

Barry Manilow30:36

I do. I do. I go to their concerts now and again. They invite me. I go to these high schools and they're terrible, but they're wonderful. But they're wonderful.

Barry Manilow30:49

Yeah.

Presenter30:49

What do you think your your your legacy I mean, obviously those are literal legacies to learn at institutions where people can study and and you're paying for them to study and that's a good thing. But what do you think your musical legacy will be? Will it be the guy in the shirt? Or will it be the guy that did something much more than that?

Barry Manilow31:06

Uh

Presenter31:06

Uh

Barry Manilow31:06

I hope that people remember me as somebody who made them feel. That's really all I've wanted to do. Like my early records that you've asked me to choose, Sinatra, Judy, Jerry Mulligan these are people who made me feel. I hope that I was one of those guys that made you feel. That's what I'd like to leave.

Presenter31:26

Let's hear your last piece of music then, what is it?

Barry Manilow31:29

This actually meant a lot to me. Peter Gabriel's Don't Give Up. I was down, man. I was down during that year. I heard this one. It helped. That's what I always hope my songs do for people. This one really helped me.

Speaker 431:43

It is so strange the way things turn.

Speaker 431:49

Drove the night toward my home, the place that I was born, on the lake side. As daylight broke, I saw the earth

Speaker 432:01

The trees had burned down to the ground.

Speaker 432:08

Don't give up.

Speaker 432:11

You so

Presenter32:13

Peter Gabriel and Kate Bush and Don't Give Up. You said, Barry Manlo, going into that, that it that that was a song that was significant to you i i i in a year when things were difficult.

Barry Manilow32:24

Well, whatever that came out, you know, I was down.

Presenter32:26

Yeah.

Barry Manilow32:26

It was always I don't know, but it got me through.

Presenter32:29

And music seems to have in a lot of your choices a sort of redeeming quality. Somehow it can take you back, it can restore you to a place. Is that is that fair?

Barry Manilow32:38

For me, yeah.

Presenter32:39

Yeah.

Barry Manilow32:40

And I lose myself in these people's work.

Presenter32:44

And you have that ambition for your music, you think if I do.

Barry Manilow32:47

I do. And, you know, I get letters and people stop me all the time. Last night, cab driver right here.

Barry Manilow32:55

Right here in London.

Barry Manilow32:57

Just bent my ear for a good ten minutes about what my stuff has done. It was great. What I want.

Presenter33:06

So I am under protest, I understand, going to maroon you on the desert island now, and I'm going to give you.

Presenter33:13

I'm not so mean that I won't give you something to take with you. I'm going to give you the Bible and the complete works of Shakespeare. You can choose another book to take, your own choice. What are you going to choose as a book?

Barry Manilow33:22

a book by a guy named Bear Grills, and it's called Man vs. Wild Survival Techniques from the Most Dangerous Places on Earth. And so I thought, well, that's this is the book for me.

Presenter33:34

Okay, because it's you you can I will just let you have that. And you're also allowed a luxury to make life a little more beautiful.

Barry Manilow33:41

The only thing I could think of was my lab, my black lab.

Presenter33:44

You can't you can't take anything living you can't

Barry Manilow33:46

Or you can't take anything living.

Presenter33:47

No, you can't take a a dog or a friend or a lover or a you can't do that.

Barry Manilow33:51

Okay. So my second choice other than my black lab would be my piano. The second thing that brings me comfort.

Presenter33:58

And if the waves were to crash to the shore and wash away your disks, what would be the one of these eight disks that you would run through the sand to save?

Barry Manilow34:07

I have to be Judy.

Presenter34:09

Barry Manelu, thank you very much for letting us hear your desert island discs.

Barry Manilow34:13

Great.

Presenter34:21

You've been listening to a podcast from the Desert Island Discs Archive. For more podcasts, please visit bbc.co.uk slash radio four.