Dame Alicia Markova

Presenter0:17

My castaway this week is a ballerina. She's been acclaimed as one of the world's greatest exponents of her art, a huge achievement for the girl born Lillian Marks in Finsbury Park, North London. At the age of ten, she caught the eye of the great Diagilev. Stravinsky wrote her first ballet, Matisse designed her costume, Balanchine was the choreographer. Her greatness assured her international future, but in the thirties she chose to work in Britain, starring at Sadler's Wells and taking ballet all over the country. Later she co-founded what is today the English National Ballet. And in between all of this, she performed on all the world's great stages, her fragile, ethereal presence keeping audiences spellbound until she retired from performance at the age of 52. Since then she's been tireless in promoting both the artistic and educational side of ballet. I know I have done my share when needed, she says. All I can say is thank God for that. She is Dame Alicia Markova.

Presenter1:19

It was in fact Dame Alicia, I think I'm right in saying Diagolev who gave you that name, Alicia Markova, wasn't it? How did that come about?

Dame Alicia Markova1:28

Oh, definitely if I may say I think the whole of my life I must thank.

Dame Alicia Markova1:37

That great gentleman. He saw me first here in London when I was ten.

Dame Alicia Markova1:45

When I'd just been in pantomime, I was launched in pantomime. And uh he was going to take me into the company. Unfortunately, I went down with diphtheria, and at that period that was almost the end. And of course, that was the first terrible thing in my life, disappointment.

Dame Alicia Markova2:10

And fortunately I took good care and recovered. And then he saw me again when I just became fourteen.

Presenter2:23

But at that time you were still Lillian Alicia Marks, weren't you?

Presenter2:28

Tell me about when he got you to Monte Carlo and how he came to change your name.

Dame Alicia Markova2:32

Yeah.

Presenter2:32

Immediately.

Dame Alicia Markova2:33

I thought, oh, I'll be given a wonderful Russian name. You know, and I thought it'll be Olga somebody or that

Dame Alicia Markova2:44

And I waited for the very first programme. When I opened it, I was very disappointed because I saw I was Alicia, which was my own name, and the marks he just took S off the end and put OVA on. And there I was. And here I am still. And what did you call him?

Dame Alicia Markova3:11

Oh, I didn't speak anything but English at that time.

Dame Alicia Markova3:16

And I didn't understand and I heard all the Russian members addressing him in a certain way, the ones that spoke English to me. I asked them, I said, What is that strange thing you address him at? They said, That's always in Russia. You take the name of the gentleman's father and his own.

Dame Alicia Markova3:42

And I thought, Sergy Pop, if his father if his name is Sayers, I thought, well, if I say Pop in Britain, you c you're Papa, your Papa, or you know

Dame Alicia Markova3:58

He looked at me. I said, Is that all right?

Dame Alicia Markova4:02

And he looked down, he said yes. So he was searching part.

Dame Alicia Markova4:08

As long as he lived to me.

Dame Alicia Markova4:11

Tell me about the first record you'd like to take to this desert island. The Sleeping Beauty.

Dame Alicia Markova4:17

Well, it was the Sleeping Beauty that I met the great Diagliff through that. That is what brought us together. And in the first I was to be the

Dame Alicia Markova4:31

a smallest fairy who ever came to the christening in the first act.

Presenter6:47

The Philharmonia Orchestra conducted by Herbert von Karian playing part of the second act of Tchaikovsky's Sleeping Beauty. I'm sure you loved that piece, Day Melissia, and many other of the uh the classic ballet pieces when you were a little girl. But when you got to Monte Carlo, aged fourteen, with Diagalev, you found yourself having to dance to Stravinsky. How did you react to that?

Dame Alicia Markova7:10

The belly was to be made new for me.

Dame Alicia Markova7:15

the new young choreographer from Russia, George Balanchin. We were brought together to do the Song of the Nightingale, and the first rehearsal, private rehearsal in Monte Carlo.

Dame Alicia Markova7:32

We arrived no pianist.

Dame Alicia Markova7:35

They had the uh, you know, on the roller. The pianola.

Dame Alicia Markova7:40

Yes, I tried and I tried to listen to him.

Dame Alicia Markova7:45

And at that time he didn't speak English. And I started crying like mad. And poor Balanchine, he didn't know what I was crying about. But you were crying because you didn't understand Stravinsky's music, were you? I didn't. I never heard Stravinsky, you see. And then suddenly the great Mr Djaglov walked into our rehearsal after he'd had a dinner appointment. Sergy Pop came in. Sergi Pop.

Presenter8:01

Nice to

Presenter8:03

Never heard.

Dame Alicia Markova8:19

and he came in to see how we were getting on, and all we were both more or less tears and no work done. And he said, What what's gone wrong?

Dame Alicia Markova8:37

And Valenchin in Russian immediately told him. He said the next rehearsal to morrow evening I will bring somebody along that will help you both. Diaglev arrived the next evening.

Dame Alicia Markova8:55

Who did he bring? It was Stravinsky to help us. And did he help?

Dame Alicia Markova9:01

From that moment he

Presenter9:03

He was like family to me.

Dame Alicia Markova9:04

Yeah.

Presenter9:05

And of course that particular ballet, the the The Nightingale, the Rosignol of Stravinsky, was designed by Matisse. So then you had a one of another great god, as it were, a god of design and art, the god of dance, the god of music, standing around you, this little

Dame Alicia Markova9:21

Yes, you

Presenter9:23

Fragile little protege, did you feel the sort of weight of responsibility of delivering what these people wanted?

Dame Alicia Markova9:30

of delivering what must have been very strange, because that all the first performance took place in Paris. I was allowed to wear all over white silk tights, only with jewels.

Dame Alicia Markova9:46

Which was very avant-garde as the nightingale.

Presenter9:47

Benny has a

Dame Alicia Markova9:50

But when we arrived in London for the performance in nineteen twenty seven

Dame Alicia Markova9:58

I could wear the tights, but they had to be covered with chiffon with diamonds in it.

Presenter10:05

Why?

Dame Alicia Markova10:06

Because of the Lord Chamberlain my my age, and they disclose one's whole figure.

Presenter10:14

Now tell me about the the Merry Widow. Tell me why you want to take this to your desert island.

Dame Alicia Markova10:20

Well, it was my daddy.

Dame Alicia Markova10:23

I was about

Dame Alicia Markova10:25

Two And if I couldn't sleep he'd pick me up.

Dame Alicia Markova10:29

put me on his shoulder, and he'd waltz around the room and hum.

Dame Alicia Markova10:37

And it was the Merry Widow Wolves.

Presenter12:39

It was part of the overture of the Merry Widow, written and conducted by Frantz Lehar with the Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra. But let's de Melissia now go back to the beginning, because it's far more prosaic than everything we've been talking about with these great names you've known. In fact, you took up ballet for medical reasons, didn't you?

Presenter12:58

Yeah.

Dame Alicia Markova12:58

When I became seven, we used to go with my youngest sister, mother, and Guggy, my dear person that looked after us. And in the summer Daddy'd take a little house at the beach for us and we'd be down there for a month. I loved the beach, but uh I never went in the water. I was never a swimmer. On the way home, I heard Guggy say to mother, Just look at that little one in front. She's rolling about. So mother said, When we get back to town, take her and find out why she's rolling and walking like that. So they did. Mother took me to Harley Street to the expert for that kind of thing. He said, Would you be willing to do an experiment with me? Find the nearest school that gives exercises in the ballet, and let's see whether it will do what maybe I have in mind. So my mother said, Yes. And then suddenly I heard him say, Of course, if our thing doesn't work, he said, All I can tell you about that little one, she will have to wear

Dame Alicia Markova14:37

The anch.

Dame Alicia Markova14:38

Leg ions. the aunt and before too long she'll have to be in a wheelchair. That would be the end of her.

Presenter14:48

So that is where the steely determination came from to succeed. The threat of leg irons.

Dame Alicia Markova14:54

If it rested with me, whatever hard work, I would do it. Tell me about record number three. Oh, that was uh when I was dancing at the uh Opera House in New York, and they did a beautiful ballet for me.

Presenter17:36

The Dance of the Blessed Spirits from Glux, Orpheus, and Eurydice, played by the NBC Symphony Orchestra conducted by Arturo Toscanini. Let me go back again to your childhood, because it does seem to me you suffered quite a lot of crises during the course of it, not just the medical one you've just told us about, but

Dame Alicia Markova17:52

Oh yeah.

Presenter17:53

Your father died, I think, very suddenly when you were in your very early teens. Uh thirteen and

Dame Alicia Markova17:59

And that was the reason Diaglif took me. He became, in a way, my ballet father. And how much did he pay you?

Dame Alicia Markova18:08

I received the same as the Corps de Ballet at that time, and I think it was two pounds.

Presenter18:17

Shall we?

Dame Alicia Markova18:17

Okay.

Presenter18:17

But then, of course, you were incredibly successful then when you went to Monte Carlo, and within about four, four and a half years, Diagilev had you marked out as his principal dancer, didn't he? And it was all going to happen the next season.

Dame Alicia Markova18:30

It was all going to be for the next season. Before he died, here in London at Covent Garden, he told me that when we returned, I would be entering the company as their ballerina with a proper contract. I went off and I just thanked God and thanked everybody. And then suddenly...

Presenter18:57

Then suddenly he was dead. Must have felt like the end of everything.

Dame Alicia Markova18:58

I must

Dame Alicia Markova19:00

It was the end of that. And it was Daimy Nett who had been with me.

Dame Alicia Markova19:09

When I went to Jaglevalois, you see, and suddenly she knew what Jaglev had in mind for me, you see.

Presenter19:19

But it was hard work and I want you to tell me about that in a moment. But let's pause there for your fourth record. This is Walton's Polker. That's what we want. Yes, I'd love to.

Dame Alicia Markova19:29

Here's the game.

Presenter20:52

That was Walton's Polka from Facade Suite No. One, played by the Halley Orchestra conducted by Orway Narwell Hughes.

Presenter20:59

The public was

Dame Alicia Markova21:00

so taken back and shocked they weren't expecting what they got from me.

Dame Alicia Markova21:08

Expected me in a tutu, you see, like you always did, Polka.

Presenter21:14

Could you have on, then?

Dame Alicia Markova21:15

I had little pants covered with the skirt, but on this special music it's diddly diddly de I walked out from the back and I dropped the skirt and danced in this modern little pants.

Presenter21:36

Let's just stay where we were there in in the nineteen thirties when ballet was still very much in embryo in this country. You'd come back, you became the star of Saddler's Wells, but then in the mid thirties you decided to go out on tour and take your ballet to the people. They called you the People's Ballerina, didn't they? You almost seem to have had a kind of missionary zeal about it. Now, why did you feel it that strongly?

Presenter22:02

Yeah.

Dame Alicia Markova22:02

I'd done what Dame Linette wanted, the classic ones, to found the company on. Also, all the modern works were going well, and the dancers were coming, the younger ones. Fontaine, who I gave a first lesson when she came to my teacher in Chelsea from China.

Presenter22:27

As Peggy Hookum, I know.

Dame Alicia Markova22:28

And before I left the company, every role she was going to I taught her so that she got the cor

Presenter22:38

Right thing

Presenter22:39

You were often, for British people, the first prima ballerina they'd ever seen, weren't you?

Dame Alicia Markova22:45

Yeah.

Presenter22:45

Oh, I'm the first British.

Dame Alicia Markova22:46

Yes. And I've always felt

Dame Alicia Markova22:51

If possible, we should give them the best, because there are many people without money who couldn't journey in or leave a family or something. Tell me about your fifth record. Well, The Sugar Plum Fairy, my first performance was at Sadler Swears. I had been told before it was one of the variation is one of the most difficult things ever. And there's a great step which is called the Gaguyard. And in that variation, if you answer it correctly,

Dame Alicia Markova23:33

You have to do doubles each time while you're turning in the air. So it's never given to a ballerina who couldn't do that. That's why you always had to, in your training, learn the Gaugu yards.

Presenter25:25

The Dance of the Sugar Plum Fairy from Tchaikovsky's Nutcracker Suite, played by the Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra, conducted by James Levine. You say when you dance that, not a sound must be heard.

Presenter25:35

even when you're landing from a great height, as it were. People always said you were like thistledown, you know, so light you stayed higher in the air and for longer than anyone else.

Presenter25:46

Is it possible to describe how you can do that?

Presenter25:49

I

Dame Alicia Markova25:49

I think it's been very fortunate to have been trained by the two greatest professors for dance. Maestro Czuketti, I was the last person trained by him at Jagler. I had Legat, and he arrived here when I was

Presenter26:11

Twelve. But these choreographers were always asking you to do more, weren't they? And it seems to me that that that was the kind of person you were. You were always willing to ask yourself to do more. Well, I suppose

Dame Alicia Markova26:16

Yeah.

Presenter26:24

They were testing me.

Presenter26:26

And you never said no?

Dame Alicia Markova26:27

No.

Dame Alicia Markova26:29

Well, if they were the greatest, I thought they must know better than I do.

Dame Alicia Markova26:35

Yeah.

Presenter26:35

Tell me as well about dancing with Anton Dolin, who was your partner for thirty years, of course. It it was said that you were two halves of a single figure when you danced together. Again, can you explain is what is that born of? Is it born of of trust?

Dame Alicia Markova26:41

I don't see.

Dame Alicia Markova26:53

thing was that we both studied we met in Chelsea at the Pheasantry with the Staff River

Dame Alicia Markova27:03

When he was a little boy and you were a little and he used to pull your hair, didn't he? I was ten.

Dame Alicia Markova27:09

And I think he was sixteen.

Dame Alicia Markova27:12

When I used to go to the bar I'd suddenly feel a pinch, and I thought, I don't like that.

Dame Alicia Markova27:21

And I thought I'm not going to go to the bar. I'll let everybody take their place. I will see where he is then, and I'll go the opposite end of the Uh

Presenter27:35

Judea.

Presenter27:37

But what did it feel like to dance with him? Did it did it feel that you were one figure together, as it were? Because that's, as I say, what we did.

Dame Alicia Markova27:44

As I said, we didn't feel like oh no, we were very much each other.

Dame Alicia Markova27:50

but I think understood each other, you see, of what we were trying to achieve.

Presenter27:57

And what about when you were on stage performing well, your great role, of course, Giselle, when towards the end you always seem to have the audience absolutely in the palm of your hand, as she goes mad, you know, that emotion that that is delivered through your dancing has made people cry in that moment.

Dame Alicia Markova28:11

Then that is

Presenter28:17

How do you convey that emotion?

Dame Alicia Markova28:20

You see, what interested me, once I had learnt the uh technique.

Dame Alicia Markova28:28

the step so that

Dame Alicia Markova28:31

I was really interested in the person I was to give to the audience, either Giselle or Juliet. You have to convince your audience that all they can see is not me, but either Giselle or

Presenter28:52

or Juliet Suffolk.

Dame Alicia Markova28:53

Yeah.

Presenter28:54

Tell me about the next piece of music. Now, this is an aria from Verdi's Aida. Why do you want that?

Presenter29:00

You know

Dame Alicia Markova29:00

I spent so much of my life at the Metropolitan Opera House in New York first, of course, with the ballet.

Dame Alicia Markova29:10

And then when I uh announced my retirement from Bali, they asked me to take o would I take over

Dame Alicia Markova29:20

as director because they knew I kn knew all the operas and would know

Dame Alicia Markova29:29

Maybe how to bring some new people in.

Dame Alicia Markova29:34

And so uh

Dame Alicia Markova29:36

I think Aida.

Dame Alicia Markova29:38

Kane.

Dame Alicia Markova29:40

up, and that was always very popular. And we had Tabaldi, which after all is very nice, and it went wonderfully.

Speaker 429:53

Ritona Vimchito Edalnyala Prushi Lenkia Pala

Speaker 430:10

Oh, Deruit Punjor Mi Merme Peritama Patria Unavilos Reke Puice Arme force.

Speaker 430:35

Be on the make launch of this song we wore.

Speaker 430:44

Neo Paulie Blue

Speaker 430:50

Tuel Tizi for Tizi, and yet requesting your pizza!

Speaker 431:04

Oh Lord Isa, Marshall.

Speaker 331:06

Uh

Speaker 331:10

Oh free.

Speaker 331:16

Uh

Speaker 431:16

Uh Uh

Speaker 431:21

Uh

Speaker 331:21

Uh

Speaker 431:21

Through Jean there is more than rest without resource.

Speaker 331:21

Turn it in this po

Speaker 431:36

What is

Speaker 431:49

Oh one voice on the darkest sing.

Speaker 431:55

Pervi homo cables.

Presenter32:23

Retonna Vincito, Return Victor, sung by Renata Tibaldi, from Verdi's Aida, with the Orquestre de la Suisse Romande conducted by Alberto Erede.

Presenter32:32

You gave everything you had, Dame Alicia Markova, to your career, didn't you? And and i in that's it possibly that's why you never married that you felt there wasn't enough of you to spare.

Presenter32:45

Uh

Dame Alicia Markova32:45

I'd think oh, I could have married several times. I think the good Lord.

Dame Alicia Markova32:52

Didn't intend me to do that. I've been given some other gifts.

Presenter32:58

Is it is it true that your partner, Anton Dolin, asked you at one point albeit he was a homosexual, I know, but he asked you to marry him, didn't he?

Dame Alicia Markova32:58

It isn't.

Dame Alicia Markova33:06

He was always devoted to me, yes.

Presenter33:08

Yeah, it's

Dame Alicia Markova33:09

And he knew he could uh rely on me.

Dame Alicia Markova33:14

anything good or bad. I mean we're never travelling that sometimes we'd have to uh try to help each other, you know, if you weren't too well or anything. The public never

Presenter33:30

But the bottom line in all of this, it seems to me, is that you have never loved anyone or anything as much as you love ballet and music. Probably.

Dame Alicia Markova33:42

Yeah.

Presenter33:43

Yeah.

Dame Alicia Markova33:43

That sh could be.

Dame Alicia Markova33:45

Because the music got me too soon.

Dame Alicia Markova33:50

Yeah.

Presenter33:50

You retired nearly half your life ago now. Well, this is a good idea. But your life has been just as friendly.

Dame Alicia Markova33:54

But your life has been just as fast as you can. And I suddenly realized that it was my performances I'd retired from.

Dame Alicia Markova34:07

But then, when, within the week, I was director of the Metropolitan Opera House in New York, I said, Thank you, dear God.

Dame Alicia Markova34:19

Heat the

Presenter34:21

Tides it for me.

Presenter34:23

Now your next record is um something called Bolero 1830.

Presenter34:28

Um, why do you want that? Tell me about that one.

Dame Alicia Markova34:31

When I had the Bolero eighteen thirty made for me, I said I need a variation for my things, and if possible, give me, I want to show something little different and I said jumping, okay. So that was why we arrived at the Bolero eighteen thirty.

Speaker 336:52

Uh

Presenter36:53

That was the London Symphony Orchestra playing that for you there. That was Bolero, eighteen thirty, arranged by James O. Turner and conducted by Richard Bonning.

Presenter37:03

You know, Dame Alicia, people almost, I think, like to think that all those decades on your toes mean that you've got terrible bunions and arthritis now. I don't see any sign of that in your feet or anywhere else. Are you as supple as ever?

Dame Alicia Markova37:19

You can imagine when I take w my little eight or ten years older that they must learn. And I say it goes like this

Presenter37:31

And you flutter your arms around

Dame Alicia Markova37:33

No.

Presenter37:33

No

Dame Alicia Markova37:34

But I mean

Dame Alicia Markova37:35

At this age, you see it and here your neck is going round. And in the morning.

Presenter37:40

Getting loud.

Dame Alicia Markova37:43

When I

Dame Alicia Markova37:45

I open my eyes.

Dame Alicia Markova37:48

And I look, I think, ooh.

Dame Alicia Markova37:51

I sh

Presenter37:52

Thank you, dear God, I'm still here. Tell me about your last record. This is Marion Anderson, singing Softly Awakes My Heart.

Dame Alicia Markova38:01

Every Uh

Presenter38:01

Yeah.

Dame Alicia Markova38:01

Uh

Presenter38:02

Uh

Dame Alicia Markova38:02

In the house in New York at the rehearsal.

Dame Alicia Markova38:06

And I thought

Dame Alicia Markova38:08

That is beautiful.

Dame Alicia Markova38:12

And I thought I need that for the uh belly.

Speaker 338:21

Oh, swing my trembling heart.

Speaker 338:26

I saw it on it.

Presenter40:36

More armchair ballet going on here to Marian Anderson singing Softly Awakes My Heart from Sansons Sampson and Delilah, and that was recorded in nineteen thirty. Now, if you could only take one of those eight records to your island, Day Melissia, which one would you take?

Dame Alicia Markova40:52

Oh my.

Presenter40:53

Oh, you look so shocked.

Presenter40:56

Yeah.

Dame Alicia Markova40:56

to me is very beautiful.

Dame Alicia Markova40:59

That last one.

Presenter41:01

What about your book? Because we give you the Bible, and we give you the complete works of Shakespeare. I think you know that.

Dame Alicia Markova41:07

I really think if I'm going to be there on my own, I'd like speaking of Diaglif, because if I'm alone there I will be reminded of that great gentleman who

Dame Alicia Markova41:25

gave me my life really, bringing me to today, and all the other wonderful, great people in my life. Speaking of Diaglev by John Drummond, and what about your luxury? My luxury, I think, for a person who's danced a lot and had to perspire a lot.

Dame Alicia Markova41:49

So I always felt a perfume would be very good to have.

Dame Alicia Markova41:56

It was Estylawder.

Dame Alicia Markova41:59

made it for me, and it was called Knowing.

Presenter42:05

Wonderful. Dame Alicia Markova, thank you very much indeed for letting us hear your desert island discs. It's been. A great

Dame Alicia Markova42:12

It's a pleasure doing this with you.