Sir Peter Bonfield

Speaker 20:00

Hello, I'm Kirsty Young, and this is a podcast from the Desert Island Discs archive. For rights reasons, we've had to shorten the music.

Speaker 20:08

The programme was originally broadcast in the year two thousand, and the presenter was Sue Lawley.

Presenter0:31

Mike Castaway this week is a company man. He's worked for only three, each time tackling complex managerial problems with loyalty, relish and determination. He was born in Herefordshire, went to Hitchin Grammar School and after university found himself working in America, where the way of life appealed to him. He still calls it home. Four years ago he took on his latest job, Chief Executive of BT. There, despite working a thirteen-hour day, six or seven days a week, he hasn't avoided criticism. Some say BT has allowed its competitors to make the pace, hasn't taken advantage of the opportunities opened up by the new and rapidly developing technology. But the company's in the process of a major restructuring, and its boss is as unwavering as ever. I am ruthlessly persistent, he said. I never give up. He is the chief executive of British Telecommunications plc, Sir Peter Bonfield. It is, of the three jobs you've held in your working life, Peter, the most exposed, isn't it? Do you relish that or do you resent it?

Sir Peter Bonfield1:28

Well it's it's certainly the most exposed and obviously the the largest. I think when I took on the the position somebody said it's like managing in a goldfish bowl. And I think that is true. But I think you just have to get on with it.

Presenter1:38

How does it rate alongside the other two? The first was at Texas Instruments, of course, and the second as head of ICL. It it's certainly the biggest. Is it the toughest as well?

Sir Peter Bonfield1:47

Yes, I think at the moment it's the toughest because the industry is going through major structural changes. And of course, BT itself is a very, very large company. We often forget the sheer size of it, the number of people that we have and how.

Presenter1:58

137,000.

Sir Peter Bonfield1:59

137,000, and we're spread over a lot of countries now internationally as well. So it's a difficult job to get your arms all around. I don't know all the people, that's part of the problem.

Presenter2:09

But you had a tough time at ICL. I mean, it was practically bankrupt when you first joined it.

Sir Peter Bonfield2:13

We did.

Presenter2:14

You know, you were quoted then as feeling no stress, just enjoying the job. Is that still true?

Sir Peter Bonfield2:21

Yeah, I guess I'm one of these people that maybe it's because of my engineering background, I'm very logical about all these sort of things. You just get on and do the job.

Presenter2:29

It's gotta be a bit ruthless to be like that.

Sir Peter Bonfield2:30

Um

Sir Peter Bonfield2:32

Well, the reason is that I'm I'm I'm very logical. I think that is uh that is true. So I just

Presenter2:35

Unsentimental.

Sir Peter Bonfield2:36

And probably unsentimental. I think probably unsentimental and logical. Yeah, that would be a pretty bad description. But there you go.

Presenter2:39

Yeah.

Presenter2:43

And are you are you a workaholic? It sounds as if you are.

Sir Peter Bonfield2:46

Well, I don't think I am. I just enjoy what I'm doing. I'm very fortunate, actually, in all the jobs that I've been offered have been.

Sir Peter Bonfield2:53

Good fun actually. I mean they're in the area that I like. It's engineering, it's electronics, it's fast moving, it's international. And I'm very enthusiastic and I just get enthusiastically wound up in a job.

Presenter3:02

You're quoted as avoiding holidays, or is that a joke?

Sir Peter Bonfield3:05

Well, I I used to avoid holidays, that is true, but now um over the last few years I'm taking more holidays.

Presenter3:11

Well white water rafting, I gather.

Sir Peter Bonfield3:12

Well, I like action holidays. No, this is true. But no, for a while I I got out of the habit of taking holidays, only for twenty years or so.

Sir Peter Bonfield3:20

Um but now I'm getting in the habit.

Presenter3:22

How does your wife cope with that?

Sir Peter Bonfield3:24

Um well, she must be coping quite well. I've been married for thirty-two years, so um we've sort of got used to it.

Presenter3:30

And she's your best friend?

Sir Peter Bonfield3:31

She's my definite best friend.

Presenter3:32

She's probably her only video you haven't got time for friends. No no.

Sir Peter Bonfield3:34

No, no, no. I've got uh I've got some good friends and in fact we we keep uh a lot of our friends from very early days in the United States. So no, we've got uh wide range of friends, but it is difficult to keep up with them because certainly I guess that it's work on one hand, but it's travelling on the other. I do travel extensively outside of the UK as well.

Presenter3:50

Tell me about your first record.

Sir Peter Bonfield3:52

Basically I chose this one because I used to play the flute a long time ago in the school orchestra, and I was not very good at it, but I liked the instrument and to hear it played by a master such as this I think is just fascinating. So I can listen to this and say how did he actually do that, those fast fingers.

Presenter3:59

Betty

Presenter4:56

Jean Pierre Rampal playing part of Mozart's Andante for Flute and Orchestra, K three one five, with the Israel Philharmonic Orchestra conducted by Zubin Mehta. Were you always ambitious, Sir Peter Bonfield? Did you know in your bones you were going to do something big with your life?

Sir Peter Bonfield5:11

No, not at all. No. I slog through school and uh I just I've always worked hard, I suppose, and have been lucky.

Presenter5:18

But you said slogged through school. Apparently, should I point this up? You scraped through the eleven years.

Sir Peter Bonfield5:22

Yeah, definitely scraped through the 11 plus. I was not a uh a great student early on, that's for sure.

Presenter5:27

So when did you start to shine, and why?

Sir Peter Bonfield5:30

I'm not sure. I think at grammar school really I got involved with a a teacher who was the physics and maths teacher. He also he also teaches rugby as well. And he got me really wound up in science and mathematics, so I did what I thought everybody else did then, which was to study maths, physics and science.

Presenter5:50

But it was really before all this, as I understand it, that your character was truly shaped, and that was by the nuns in the convent that you were talking about.

Sir Peter Bonfield5:56

Yes, I'm sure they shaped most of it early on.

Presenter5:59

Um

Sir Peter Bonfield5:59

Um

Presenter6:00

How? What did they do?

Sir Peter Bonfield6:01

They were very dedicated people themselves, very personalized. So even until recently they kept up to speed with what I'm doing and you, my mother. But they were pretty tough, so discipline was absolute. And even now I've got a phobia of being a couple of minutes late, because if you were late on parade with the nuns, they certainly whacked you for it.

Presenter6:22

What with?

Sir Peter Bonfield6:23

Rulers mostly, rulers, yeah, on the hands. They're a tough lot. And uh I think that got me into the habit of studying hard, working hard and uh and iron discipline. They certainly taught me that.

Presenter6:24

Where

Presenter6:33

Do you think that i that's the case, or surely it was just in you anyway? What about you? Were your was your mother like that? Your parents?

Sir Peter Bonfield6:38

Um well, my mother was a good student. She worked very hard. She came from a a background of of uh miners in uh in South Wales. So, yeah, she was always um

Sir Peter Bonfield6:47

Not so pushy, but my mother always knew what she wanted to do and uh pushed us very hard, yeah.

Presenter6:52

Mm. So you you are always on time, you honour your commitments, you do what you'll set you said you'll do.

Sir Peter Bonfield6:58

Yeah, it sounds a bit boring, but I'm sure that was drummed into me from a very early age.

Presenter7:02

Tell me about record number two.

Sir Peter Bonfield7:04

Well my record number two is Peggy Sue by Buddy Holly. Great record. Of course when I was growing up this was the early days of rock and roll and I always liked Buddy Holly. And then as part of my career I was actually based in Lubbock, Texas which was the birthplace of Buddy Holly. And it's a great record.

Speaker 47:24

Piggy Super

Speaker 47:26

Then you know why I feel blue without Teggy

Speaker 47:31

Find the eggs.

Speaker 47:35

Oh well I love you guys, I love you, Beggie Sue.

Speaker 47:42

Veggie Super

Speaker 47:44

Eggy suit

Speaker 47:45

Oh how my audience for you all behave

Speaker 47:50

Not the eggs

Presenter7:53

Buddy Holly and Peggy Sue. So, Peter, your father was an engineer, and so were your two elder brothers. So, what you were going to do with your life was never probably any question.

Sir Peter Bonfield8:01

No, it's pretty preordained.

Presenter8:03

Your your father worked at Bletchley, didn't he? On on the Egni Enigma Code Bust?

Sir Peter Bonfield8:07

Yes, during the war. He was um uh before the war he was an engineer technician uh for the computer company and then during the uh the war was working in uh in Blexley on the Enigma things, which I didn't find out until way, way after the war because he signed the Official Secrets Act, so he never told me.

Presenter8:23

So you you never wondered why he was sort of at home during the war, going off on his bicycle.

Sir Peter Bonfield8:27

Well I was I was born uh just towards the end of of the war, but um my mum had three of us during the war, um which must have been quite difficult, but then we figured out that the bicycle ride was probably not too far.

Presenter8:39

So as far as you were concerned, you know, w when you were small and indeed during your your boyhood.

Presenter8:45

You lived a very straightforward life. Your father got on his bicycle, I think, for many years, didn't he? Went to work. And neat and tidy, semi detached, all the rest of it. Off you go, Loughborough University, engineering degree. And then suddenly you make this huge decision to go and work in America, which was quite avant garde. I mean, not the norm then, really, quite brave.

Sir Peter Bonfield8:50

Yeah.

Sir Peter Bonfield9:04

Yeah, it was brave. My father had always said that I ought to go and look at the United States because at that stage it was just the sort of burgeoning aspects of electronics and semiconductors. And it was really being driven mostly then from the United States. So if you wanted to get ahead, go to where the action was. So I joined a US company from university. I knew exactly what I wanted to do. I own an interview with US companies. They transferred me more or less immediately after I joined, or within six months. So at the tender age of 23, I had a whole project team, a Mustang convertible, a fantastic apartment with a swim pool in Dallas.

Presenter9:45

And you make

Sir Peter Bonfield9:45

And

Presenter9:47

And your mates were back in what Leicester or Loughborough or whatever.

Sir Peter Bonfield9:51

Yeah, still in digs, doing their apprenticeships.

Presenter9:55

So what effect? It must have changed your whole attitude to life.

Sir Peter Bonfield9:58

Yeah, totally changed. I'm still very US centric. I learnt a huge amount. I take personal risks, I guess, more than most other people. I take risks with younger people myself. Now I encourage everybody that I meet to move and operate internationally to see if they can learn more, take a few personal risks from that point of view. And I think that the style at that stage, the company was growing at 50% a year. So as I said, I was just lucky at being in the right place because you have to be a real idiot not to progress when the company's going that fast.

Presenter10:30

But I wonder why it appealed to you so much, America. You know, you as I say, I quoted you in the introduction, saying America is still my home. I mean, you've been back here nearly twenty years.

Sir Peter Bonfield10:30

I wonder why

Sir Peter Bonfield10:37

I mean you've been

Sir Peter Bonfield10:40

Yeah, but I've still that's uh it's still my my home. I mean, that's where I'm going to end up, I think. Is it? Yeah, that's where I plan to, anyway.

Presenter10:44

They are good at the

Presenter10:45

Is it?

Presenter10:47

To retire.

Sir Peter Bonfield10:48

Yes, I mean I just like the freedom of it, particularly in the southwest, the great outdoors. I'm a great outdoor person. You can do anything in the US. You know, people challenge you, why can't you do it? It's a great can-do attitude, and it pervades into a lot of my character now. And it was, I suppose, it was an impressionable age when I was there in an impressionable business that was growing like Topsy, and it was just great fun.

Presenter11:13

Next record.

Sir Peter Bonfield11:14

My next record is Fanfare for the Common Man. This is Aaron Copeland, who's obviously an American composer. Played by the Dallas Symphony, I moved to Dallas early on in my life and met two players in the Dallas Symphony, so I remember this one particularly. And of course, Aaron Copeland was a great patriot composer, and this was composed just at the start of the Second World War to generate a bit of patriotism in America. And it's loud and it's brassy, and I think it's really good.

Presenter12:46

Aaron Copeland's Fanfare for the Common Man, played by the Dallas Symphony Orchestra, conducted by Donald Johannes. So you were brought up professionally, as you say, Peter Onfield, in the State. How what does that mean your attitudes, professional attitudes, would would differ from someone, say, brought up in Mark Suspenses or Unilever here? How are you different?

Sir Peter Bonfield13:05

Well, I think that that at that stage there was a lot of new management practices being introduced into the United States, you know, flat management structures, a huge amount of delegated authority, letting people have long leashes to get on and do things. It was sort of the culture, I suppose, at that stage. And that has certainly stayed with me for all my career.

Presenter13:26

So it's faster, it's tougher.

Sir Peter Bonfield13:28

It's faster. It's certainly yeah, it's tougher.

Presenter13:30

Bit more gung-ho.

Sir Peter Bonfield13:31

Ho.

Sir Peter Bonfield13:32

Yeah, gung-ho, I think a lot more sort of personal responsibility. You get on and do it, and if you're successful, fine, and if you're not out, get on and do something else. And of course, in the US, you can fail once and bounce back and keep on going. Whereas I think in some of the styles here, you know, if you haven't done anything well, you stay not doing anything well for some considerable time, if or you ever rehabilitated. Whereas in the US, they just knock that down and get on to the next one.

Presenter13:56

But it must have therefore been very different when you ended up at ICL, which eventually and now we're spooling on some years, the Japanese came into Fujitsu. I mean, how how different are the J is the Japanese way of looking at it?

Sir Peter Bonfield14:07

I mean the con the the Japanese style is still very much consensus. They've got the old adage that that the nail that sticks up in the floor gets knocked down so they want uh things much more uniform in their style. So decisions take longer. But it's quite funny because once the collective has decided then they all go off and do it. So the end result may not be any different than the US, but it they get there different in a different way.

Presenter14:34

And which do you prefer?

Sir Peter Bonfield14:35

I prefer a blend. I think that what I've tried to get out of this is I regard myself as an international manager, so I've got a bit from obviously the United Kingdom, a lot from the US and a lot from Japan. So if I can get a blend of consensus style, I like working with people, I like to get on with people. But I'm also, as I said earlier, somewhat specific in terms of getting people to do things, so I like the bit of the US cutting edge as well.

Presenter15:00

There's also a lot more socializing, I think, in both America and with the Japanese, with their colleagues. They go out after work.

Sir Peter Bonfield15:06

Yeah, very p more personal, particular yeah, both actually different ways, but but very much more personal. I mean the Japanese, particularly in the big companies, um you were sort of your life was the company. The company controlled you, maybe even told you who you could marry, but um I think they've moved on a little bit from that.

Presenter15:23

So do you did you end up going to karaoke sessions with a nice thing?

Sir Peter Bonfield15:26

I've been to a lot of karaoke sessions and uh and spent many, many hours uh late at night uh trying to sing, which is not my forte.

Presenter15:33

Trying to sing like perhaps the next man on the list here.

Sir Peter Bonfield15:36

Yes, well he's my my idol not necessarily for his singing actually for his guitar playing actually yeah Eric Clapton I started to listen to Eric Captain when I was at university as I suppose as a lot of people the thing about Clapton I really like is that through all of the ups and downs of his life and he's had a very interesting life I think he's still a fantastic guitar player and he's so varied

Presenter15:37

He's your idol, isn't he?

Sir Peter Bonfield16:00

And obviously, I go to the Albert Hall now, and he sells out amazing crowds.

Presenter16:05

And you're up the front, you're not in the corporate box, no?

Sir Peter Bonfield16:07

No, I'm down on the floor, stomping my feet. He's just an amazing performer.

Presenter16:09

Stomping.

Speaker 416:12

Dollar chilies not all the mag

Speaker 416:19

Be love.

Speaker 416:22

Happy all my news, dear.

Speaker 416:27

Can you wanna be the lord?

Speaker 416:32

Collarbon chilies are good in the

Presenter16:40

Eric Clapton and Layla from his Unplugged album. The story is, Peter, that you left the Japanese at ICL to go to BT. This was back in 96, wasn't it? But you wouldn't have.

Sir Peter Bonfield16:50

I did it.

Presenter16:51

Done that, says the story, unless the Japanese had given you their blessing. You don't break contracts.

Sir Peter Bonfield16:57

No, I don't break contracts and I was on a long-term contract with that company. They'd treated me very well.

Sir Peter Bonfield17:04

And I wanted to make sure that uh that that continued. So uh no I don't break contracts so I had to ask them to uh in the end effect a transfer as they say.

Presenter17:12

I think this has more to do with the nuns than the gentlemen.

Sir Peter Bonfield17:14

Yeah.

Presenter17:15

So you were with Texas for sixteen years, ICL for fifteen, and when you left, um the Japanese gave you a a s samurai saw.

Sir Peter Bonfield17:23

Yeah, they gave me well, they gave me a thing that encompasses a bow and arrow, a samurai sword, and a samurai helmet.

Presenter17:32

Double-edged farewell.

Sir Peter Bonfield17:33

So no, this was because uh going into the telecoms business they thought I'd need a hard hat because this is a tough business.

Presenter17:39

They were right.

Sir Peter Bonfield17:39

I would definitely need a sword to fight off all the competition. I'd need the backup bow and arrow. So they got that right.

Presenter17:46

But you don't go around chopping off people's heads. Again, I read about you that you don't sack people. You know, you you you don't sort of move them on unless they agree to go, as it were.

Sir Peter Bonfield17:55

Well, I'm one of these, I suppose to a certain extent I'm good old-fashioned. If somebody's got the hand of the till and they're doing a very bad job, you know, against the company ethics and principles, then yeah, I'm tough as anybody. But I'm a great believer that actually that there's a great deal of good in many people. It's up to the management to try and find out where that is. And of course, everybody might not fit in one particular slot at one time, but they've got a life to live. You've got to move them on to make sure that they can do the best that they can do, as they say.

Presenter18:24

But you must have had to do some of that in this restructuring that you've you've been doing. You must have had to exert your powers of persuasion or chop somebody's head off. You have, haven't you?

Sir Peter Bonfield18:32

Yeah, but I think it's just do I chop people's head off? Actually, I think everybody that I've moved on from a company, I still have very good personal relationships with, so and that's the style that I want to develop. So yes, they might have to go, but there's different ways of doing it.

Sir Peter Bonfield18:45

Next record. Yeah, my next record is Don McLean and American Pie. This again comes back to say my American roots, but it's got a great line in it to take my Chevy to the levee and the levee was dry. And years ago I used to drink with my friends in the electronics business in the levee in Dallas, so I know all about this.

Presenter19:05

And what is the levee?

Sir Peter Bonfield19:06

Well, the levee actually is the is the side of a river. Take your Chevy to the Levee is to drive your car to the river bank. It comes out better the Chevy to the Levee. The Levee in Dallas was a pub.

Speaker 419:16

I started singing High, buying this American pie Drove my Chevy to the levee, but the levee was dry. Them good old boys were drinking whiskey and rye, And singing This'll be the day that I die

Speaker 419:31

This'll be the day that I die.

Presenter19:35

Don McLean, an American Pie. So let's talk about BT, Peter. It hasn't had a good press for some months now. The feeling is that it's been outpaced by younger and nimbler companies. Vodafone's a very good example. Is the restructuring that you've announced an admission that, in fact, it has been going moving too slowly? It hasn't been up at this technological cutting edge?

Sir Peter Bonfield19:58

Well, no, I think it's part of an ongoing process that I've been working with my management team on now for some years to keep the change going. BT has changed enormously. Since privatisation in 1984, we've cut the workforce by half. 130,000 people left the company. It's grown like topsy. It's now international. We've moved it significantly into the international field. But you've missed a few.

Presenter20:21

But you've missed a few tricks along the way, haven't you?

Sir Peter Bonfield20:23

I think any company always misses some tricks, but it's actually a much better company than some people would anticipate. And what we've tried to do in this restructuring is to say that within BT we've got a budding vodafone, we've got a budding this company and a budding this company. Look at the constituent parts instead of the perceived monolith of BT.

Presenter20:44

Yes, but it's how you get them out, and it is as if they've been stuck in that monolith, as it were. People have talked about the sort of civil service bureaucracy of it. It's all in there, but it it hasn't been properly exploited. That's the accusation.

Sir Peter Bonfield20:54

This is part of the liberalization process and I think that we have moved the company on enormously. It's much more internationally focused now than it ever was. But these things take time to change. It's a big company and it would take time to change. Is it complete to the change yet? No. Is it changing rapidly? Yes.

Presenter21:12

But l let's just be specific, and there are so many issues we can't talk about them all, but I think one that everybody knows about is that Dixon's invented FreeServe, for example, which was free access to the Internet, left you way behind. That's now a a small company, very, very young, worth seven billion pounds. Shouldn't B T have done that?

Sir Peter Bonfield21:29

Yeah, actually BT invented the free access into the internet with a thing called BT click free. But it took so t long to get it through the regulator that we were bypassed by FreeServe. So a lot of the innovation actually has come from BT. The part of the market in which we operate sometimes doesn't come through quickly enough for us.

Presenter21:51

But are you going to do that now? Because Gordon Brown said not long ago, earlier this year, didn't he, that he wanted uh access to the Internet to be palved, I think, in price by two thousand and two.

Sir Peter Bonfield22:01

Yeah, what they've said is that they would like the telephony charges and the Internet access charges to be at the lowest end of the group of seven countries within two years. If you do the assessment of the basket of currency now of telephony, we are way, way at the bottom of the pile now, very, very competitive rates in the UK. And I think that within two years we'll be there on the Internet. At the moment, off peak, it's still cheaper in the UK than in the United States.

Presenter22:24

And the low and off p

Presenter22:27

Okay, and what about the other issue? Because again, we can only choose a couple. What about the issue of ADSL? That's this kind of broadband way in which we can receive

Sir Peter Bonfield22:36

Fast access, yeah.

Presenter22:36

Very fast access and television pictures into the homes, down the telephone lines. Again, the accusation is that you haven't invested in that enough, that you haven't seen the potential of it.

Sir Peter Bonfield22:40

Yeah.

Sir Peter Bonfield22:44

No, since you haven't seen it.

Sir Peter Bonfield22:46

Not quite true, actually. BT was one of the early inventors of ADSL.

Sir Peter Bonfield22:51

Well, twenty five percent of the United Kingdom's lines at the moment are ADSL enabled, more than any other country in the world. Fact. So I think some of these things it's part of fact, part of fiction. It's up to us in the company to project this outside. But we are not behind in this rollout of this technology, and I think we're actually doing quite well.

Presenter23:10

So you can put your hand on your heart and say that the allegations made against you are wrong, are they? That you really are exploiting all the vast resources.

Sir Peter Bonfield23:18

Well could we do more? Could we move faster? Sure, but we're not as far behind as some people think. ADSL rollout is now going quickly. We've met all the objectives that we've set. It's big technology. It's a huge investment. We're putting a massive amount of investment in it. And I think that we'll see the long-term benefits of that. So from an engineering point of view, I don't think that we're doing anything wrong. We could always go fast, and we obviously will.

Presenter23:42

Next record, number six.

Sir Peter Bonfield23:44

Well my next record is from a s a singer called Stacey Kent, Close Your Eyes. Stacey Kent is a new singer from my point of view. I think she's a very, very talented singer. So on my desert island I would always like to think of the new up-and-comers and I hope that she makes a big impact on the world.

Speaker 424:02

Close your eyes.

Speaker 424:06

Put your head on my shoulder and sleep.

Speaker 424:11

Close your eyes.

Speaker 424:15

And I will close mine.

Speaker 424:20

Close your eyes.

Speaker 424:24

Let's pretend that we're both counting sheep.

Presenter24:29

Yeah.

Speaker 424:30

Yeah.

Presenter24:32

Stacy Kent singing Close Your Eyes. It is a complete revolution, though, really, this, isn't it, Peter Bonfield, that we're experiencing. I mean, I read that last year, for the first time in history, the amount of information, data, email, all that sort of stuff going down telephone lines was greater than the voice.

Sir Peter Bonfield24:49

Yeah, I think that's what it makes it so interesting, which is why I'm so fascinated with the whole industry. This is a revolution. And a lot of people say, well, technological revolution, you know, it impacts the nerds and the propeller heads, as it used to call them in the United States. This will now impact everybody. The internet, mobility, this broadband thing that we were talking about is going to impact everybody. And I think that now...

Presenter25:10

In what sense? I mean, we're gonna it's this it's home shopping

Sir Peter Bonfield25:11

Pull out it.

Sir Peter Bonfield25:12

It's home shopping, it's now sending emails, it's now the ability to send your home movies from your grandchildren around to granddad and grandmother in a few years. Well, actually, by the end of this year, everything on the move with these new mobile phones, these new whack phones coming out now, you can get your emails on the move. This is going to change everything.

Sir Peter Bonfield25:36

Change that. Government will change because obviously access to government information is all going to be much more relevant and easier to do. Industry will change, we're seeing the banking sector change, it changes all my industry completely on its head.

Presenter25:49

Exactly. And it erodes your core business. It erodes everything that we think BT has been about, this sort of solid, reliable telephone business.

Sir Peter Bonfield25:57

Yes, the voice business is not growing very much at all. All of the growth is in broadband, internet and mobility, these new areas. And that's what we're still pushing ahead at. Part of the reason why we're pushing ahead with this restructuring. We have to change the company to get positioned for this growth and exploit it. Great fun, but obviously quite challenging.

Presenter26:17

Sure, and that's the point, isn't it? I mean, you had to change, you've been forced to change. Have you done it soon enough? Or are you and people were beginning to say that the unthinkable could happen, B T could be taken over.

Sir Peter Bonfield26:28

I think BT is a a quoted company on the exchange, and any quoted company on the exchange can be taken over, unless the company has a golden share.

Presenter26:36

But you were beginning to look more like a takeover target.

Sir Peter Bonfield26:39

Well, I'm not there was discussions about it, but I'm not sure. You'd have to anybody who came in and do a hostile takeover of BT would have to pay a huge amount of money.

Presenter26:47

Yeah.

Sir Peter Bonfield26:49

Yes, but in the end, it's up to the shareholders. So from my point of view as a manager and my management team, the people working for us, we just have to say, hey, that can happen, spurs us on to say, you know, if we do a good job, create value, it might not happen on our watch.

Presenter27:01

Are you sure this is good, enjoyable fun? Sounds like extremely stressful business to me.

Sir Peter Bonfield27:06

Uh

Presenter27:06

No, it's good fun.

Sir Peter Bonfield27:07

No, this is alright.

Presenter27:08

Okay, I believe you. Number seven.

Sir Peter Bonfield27:11

Yes, my next record is Handel's water music. I think I'm my Handel to me is great. I think he's one of my favourite composers. And of course I'm a water person. So the combination of one of my best composers with my best hobby is great. And I think I'm right in saying this is the first time that Handel used the French horn in any of his music. And of course my oldest friend in Dallas is still a horn player, so I still like horn music. So this has got a great combination.

Presenter28:42

The Academy of Saint Martin in the Fields, conducted by Sir Neville Mariner, playing part of the hornpipe from Sweet No. Two of Handel's Water Music. So you're all right on a on a desert island, Peter. You're water sports man. Um good on your own, used to it? Could cope?

Sir Peter Bonfield28:56

Oh yeah, definitely good on my own. Could cope.

Presenter28:59

Cool, cool.

Sir Peter Bonfield29:00

Oh, definitely can cook. How do you cook? I'm a barbecue person, and I'm probably the best barbecuer in the world, even though I saved myself myself. But I was trained early on in Texas. I was obviously a good Boy Scout.

Presenter29:02

Podi cook

Sir Peter Bonfield29:14

My mum and dad uh always insisted that we were in the scouting brigade, so I'm pretty self-sufficient, I think.

Presenter29:20

You're practical, engineer by training, all that. But you'd have uh no company in both senses of the word. You'd have nobody with you on this island.

Sir Peter Bonfield29:29

I actually don't mind being uh alone. In fact, I'm alone very infrequently, so the times when I'm alone, um I uh relish it actually. So I think I'll be okay. How long I'd be o okay for, I'm not sure.

Presenter29:39

How long

Presenter29:41

Well, quite. And nothing to run, no company. Um I mean, you get bored out of your mind.

Sir Peter Bonfield29:46

Yeah, I think that uh that Borden would creep in early. I think this would be some worry, yes.

Presenter29:51

Tell me about your last record.

Sir Peter Bonfield29:53

Well, my last record, I guess, would come back to the island. You'd have to have some spiritual backup, you'd have to have something that you could do yourself. And as I can't sing, I can certainly learn to chant. And the piece I've chosen is Vinny Creatus Spiritus, which is they're all basically hymns, but I think it would take me back to my inner roots, my religious childhood. My mother and father were very religious type of people. In fact, my whole family has got that sort of background. And I like it, and it reminds me of Christmas.

Speaker 430:23

Venique at all spiritus mente so one hom visita.

Sir Peter Bonfield30:24

We clearly are told.

Sir Peter Bonfield30:28

Let's go ahead and

Speaker 430:32

Impresu per da gratino, ve du cre dasini pecora.

Sir Peter Bonfield30:44

V D is

Speaker 230:45

Yeah.

Sir Peter Bonfield30:45

Yeah.

Sir Peter Bonfield30:48

Monday morning

Speaker 430:52

Once viribuzi ninis carit stretzviri tarinis otzir.

Speaker 431:04

Tous tri for me smoother, text rede audigi.

Speaker 431:14

Turitro mil sunkatris ser monerita masculi.

Presenter31:24

The Gregorian chant Veni Creator Spiritus sung by the choir of the Vienna Hofboard Capella. If you could only take one of those eight records, Peter.

Sir Peter Bonfield31:33

I think it'd have to be Dom McLean because it's really loud, it's quite long, and I think I've got good memories of that one.

Presenter31:41

Of taking your Chevy to the levee.

Sir Peter Bonfield31:43

Right.

Presenter31:43

And um what about your book as well as the Bible and Shakespeare?

Sir Peter Bonfield31:46

I'd like to take a book on celestial navigation. When I was in Texas, it's true that the stars at night are big and bright.

Presenter31:49

Yeah.

Speaker 231:50

Yeah.

Sir Peter Bonfield31:55

And there's a lot of them. And I'd like to lie on my beach and look up and try and decide how the sailors of old and navigators of old actually ever did navigate. And of course, that might be useful down the road.

Presenter32:06

No, no, in theory only. In theory only, and your luxury.

Sir Peter Bonfield32:08

In theoretical

Sir Peter Bonfield32:11

My luxury would be a windsurfer. I say I just love all water sports since the time my father built us a little eleven plus dinghy when I was a a child. So I'd have to do that and it would probably keep me sane, keep me fit, and it'd be good in the sunshine.

Presenter32:29

Sir Peter Bonfield, thank you very much indeed for letting us hear your Desert Island discs.

Sir Peter Bonfield32:32

Thank you very much.

Speaker 232:41

You've been listening to a podcast from the Desert Island Discs archive. For more podcasts, please visit bbc.co. uk slash radio four.