Willard White

Speaker 20:00

Hello, I'm Kirsty Young, and this is a podcast from the Desert Island Discs Archive. For rights reasons we've had to shorten the music. The programme was originally broadcast in nineteen ninety nine, and the presenter was Sue Lawley.

Presenter0:30

My castaway this week is an opera singer. In a difficult childhood in Jamaica, he learned to escape through singing. His rich talent took him to the Juilliard School of Music in New York, where he wrestled with French, Italian, and the cold weather to emerge on the stage of the city opera. Nearly twenty-five years ago, he came to Britain, and it was here at the English, Scottish, and Welsh national operas and at Covent Garden that he established his reputation as a leading bass baritone. He's played many famous roles, but his Porgy in the Gleinborn production of Porgy and Bess stands out as possibly his greatest performance. Singing, he says, is about reaching peace. It does something for my soul. He is Willard White. I don't know if you object to my saying Porgy was possibly your greatest performance, Willard, but I remember a critic at the time saying it was as if you were born to the role. You have a sort of sense of ownership about it.

Willard White1:22

No, I have no sense of ownership about it at all. It's something that I enjoy doing and.

Willard White1:27

It was an exploration that I found um very pleasurable, very painful in in many areas, but it was good.

Presenter1:34

Why painful? Because I know I mean there were stories of you actually weeping offstage at at certain points during it.

Willard White1:41

Yes, I broke down crying one day in rehearsals.

Willard White1:44

Because um the emotion was so great and it touches parts that um most other situations in your life don't allow you to touch.

Presenter1:52

It's'cause it's a a a wonderful story, isn't it? It it about this this terribly d decent but desperately crippled man who lives in a tenement in South Carolina, who falls in love with a local beauty and she messes him about something rotten. But how how did you play it? Because Gershwin, of course, wrote that that Porgy should uh be pulled around on a goat cart, didn't he?

Willard White2:13

He did, and um

Willard White2:16

When I did it at Leinbourne, the question between myself and Trevenant, well, Trevenant proposed the question, I felt it before, and he said, How do we do this? Do we want him on his knees? And I said, Well, um my knees are not the greatest knees in the world, and um I've heard of many injuries suffered by poor gis on their knees and he says, Great.

Willard White2:36

I don't want him on his knees because it kills the drama. I think it it inhibits the drama anyway.

Willard White2:41

I said, Okay, we'll find a way to do it.

Speaker 42:44

Hmm.

Willard White2:45

So, um I spoke with the props department and we um

Willard White2:50

devised, I suggested two sticks, one shorter than the other, to give a sort of twisted feature, and it was very acceptable.

Presenter2:58

But did you

Presenter3:00

You know, call on your experience at all, you know, your childhood in Jamaica and so on. Did did you feel something for the part, something from inside you?

Willard White3:09

Oh, yes, absolutely. Um one particular experience that I had was watching a man when I used to go to the market with my mother, stepmother.

Willard White3:18

In Kingston there was a man who used to get around on roller skates. That's all he had on a small piece of board, and he was so badly deformed he uh sat on this little device that he had put together and uh propelled himself through the streets, and he had a a very strong set of eyes, and if you had some money uh to give him, he'd be very grateful and he'd smile.

Willard White3:45

but never like he was begging or inadequate in any way and in this interpretation of Porghi, um there it came flooding back.

Presenter3:54

Hmm.

Presenter3:55

Another a great black dramatic role is, of course, Othello, which you couldn't play in operatic terms because Ferdi's Othello is a tenor, but you have played Shakespeare's Othello at Stratford. How different was acting as opposed to opera on the stage for you?

Willard White4:12

The acting is um pretty much the same about feeling, but the delivery um of the whole situation was

Willard White4:20

Quite a shock.

Willard White4:21

Having been sort of in the definite um guidelines of music where you have four beats or three beats to the bar and there is a conductor who's giving you the whatever tempo he decides that it should go out, uh you get to the situation with the play. And I remember actually the first read-through that um we had and Othello's first line was'tis better as it is.

Willard White4:43

And I thought

Willard White4:44

I could say it about fifty three different ways. Which one do I choose? Nobody's going to give me the cue. There's a long pause I could use before the line. How long do you wait? and so on and so forth. And suddenly I I felt a sort of imprisonment because what I dreamt as freedom

Willard White5:01

Was actually a huge restriction. You make the choice, the total choice.

Presenter5:05

Tell me about your first record.

Willard White5:08

My first record is one that I find uh quite amazing. It's an Elvis Presley um.

Willard White5:13

Well, a rendition, let's call it. It's an amazing situation where the performer is about to perform and

Willard White5:21

Something goes just a little bit off the plan.

Speaker 45:24

I do the chairs in your parlour Seem empty and bare

Speaker 45:33

Do you gaze at your ball head?

Speaker 45:38

And wish you had hair.

Speaker 45:41

Yeah.

Speaker 45:43

Filled with pain.

Speaker 45:45

Shall I come back?

Speaker 45:48

Look at

Speaker 45:50

Tell me, dear.

Speaker 45:52

Why you

Presenter5:56

What a trooper she was in the background there. Mrs. Presley and

Willard White5:58

Uh

Speaker 45:58

But yeah.

Presenter5:59

Are You Lonesome Tonight? Well, at least one version of it. But, Willard, you used to sing Elvis at school, I think, did you?

Willard White6:05

I did dabble a bit with the Elvis Preslip. And who else? Uh, Pat Boone, Dean Martin, Bing Crosby, Perry Como, Billie Eckstein. The the four tops I yeah, tried everything.

Presenter6:07

And who else?

Presenter6:18

You always then had a big voice, did you? You're always a big fella.

Willard White6:22

Well, yes, I was a big fellow, um big voice, yes. People used to um be scared of my voice. I I I didn't understand um why they were jumping sometimes when I would speak, you know, suddenly after a silence. Or like the first day in um high school. I was just thirteen and I had to give my name.

Willard White6:42

and all heads in front of me sort of went forward in this sort of ducking action as if something had hit them from the back, and uh then they turned and like a um conductor it said one, two, three, laugh and everybody laughed.

Presenter6:55

But at what point did you m make the transition then from'cause you were surrounded p by pop, as you say, and by reggae. At what point did you go classical?

Willard White7:05

Well, it was in school that um a music teacher started introducing classical music.

Willard White7:11

And um we dabbled, we had to take this diet, it was sort of forced feeding.

Willard White7:18

One day, though, I was singing out very loudly.

Willard White7:22

but hiding behind somewhere so that I wouldn't be noticed. And at the end of the class she

Willard White7:29

singled me out and said, Willard, I must speak to you.

Willard White7:33

and she entered me in a competition. I sang um of all things Valentine's Aria from Gunnel's Faust in English.

Presenter7:44

It's got quite high notes in it.

Willard White7:44

It's quite high note and I had to squeeze it out. And then I sang um

Willard White7:50

Where is Silvia? But in English also, who is Silvia?

Willard White7:54

And there was a joke. Who is? Sylvia? Is she?

Presenter8:01

And you won!

Willard White8:02

And I won and um I had a scholarship and I dabbled with it and then it turned into um a love for this way of expression.

Presenter8:12

Tell me about your second record.

Willard White8:15

Oh, um Nat King Cole singing

Willard White8:19

smile. And I remember one particular day that I was feeling very sore at my stepmother. So I started um singing.

Willard White8:30

Smile, though your heart is aching. My heart was aching.

Willard White8:35

And I didn't know exactly what I what it would do.

Willard White8:38

But I had been stirred by singing in the past, and this time I was using it as a definite attempt to just change my feeling about my experience.

Willard White8:50

and I started singing. It was low toned at first and slow.

Willard White8:56

But then something started to move inside me.

Willard White8:59

And it got louder.

Willard White9:02

And I found this whole melody changing in the tempo got stronger and so on, and then

Willard White9:09

my whole body was changed and I started using it as a tool almost uh at her. But then I thought, why use it as a tool? Just sing for me and and and I let it out and I sang louder and louder and

Willard White9:22

It was like a gear was engaged.

Speaker 49:24

That's the time you must keep on trying.

Speaker 49:32

Smile, what's the use of crying?

Speaker 49:38

You'll find that life

Speaker 49:41

Is still worthwhile.

Speaker 49:46

If you

Presenter9:48

Just smile.

Presenter9:52

Nat King Cole singing a smile.

Presenter9:54

So you you found your escape, Wylard. Singing kind of purged you. What was it I mean, you you've mentioned, you know, that there was a lot of pain in you. What was it in your family set up that brought about such unhappiness?

Willard White10:10

My longing was for my mother,'cause I didn't actually I spent my first, um, few years with my mother, but then I had to go to school.

Willard White10:18

In Kingston, a choice made by my parents without consulting me, but who consults a child?

Presenter10:24

So your mother was left behind you lay you were taken away, as it were, aged five. She was left in the countryside, and you were taken to Kingston.

Willard White10:31

Yeah. Um it was uh she was left behind in my eyes by running a little farm and my father was working in Kingston. And um that was the idea that in Kingston it would be a better school for me and I'd be with my father in the week anyway.

Presenter10:50

And then there was another woman that was your stepmother then. So you had sort of effectively.

Willard White10:50

And then

Willard White10:54

Yeah.

Willard White10:56

Well I mean, it wasn't my stepmother, so I mean, she my mother was still alive, my father hadn't married her, my father didn't marry either women, and this is one of the things that I lived with in my life that I was embarrassed by.

Willard White11:09

Um, I'm not embarrassed by it any more because all of these things in my life is what has brought me to where I am now, whatever you want to look at it and call it.

Presenter11:16

Oh.

Presenter11:18

But effectively you you were a little boy who'd been taken away from his mother, really, weren't you?

Willard White11:22

Yeah.

Presenter11:23

And that broke your heart.

Willard White11:24

That broke something.

Presenter11:26

Did they encourage you with your singing when they realized you had a talent?

Willard White11:31

I don't know if there was a realization that I had a talent. I sang and it was enjoyed. And.

Willard White11:37

The encouragement I had was from

Willard White11:40

was much later on when my when I said to my father that I wanted to explore singing further.

Willard White11:46

And he said, You like it?

Willard White11:48

Then try it, even though he wanted me to become a dentist.

Presenter11:51

Did he?

Willard White11:52

Yes.

Presenter11:53

But the catalyst in all of this, I gather, was, strange to say, um Evelyn Barbarolli, Lady Barbaroli, who came by, I think, at some point I don't know how or why, but said to you, You've got a talent, you ought to be doing something about it.

Willard White12:02

Uh

Willard White12:08

That was an important um catalyst, yes, but there are so many catalysts in in our

Willard White12:14

Lives and um but she certainly wrote a letter saying that this I'm at the age where something needs to be done.

Willard White12:22

I had just sung for her.

Willard White12:24

and um that I should go to England or America.

Willard White12:28

And in my mind, um, England was so far away, America was much closer, and also cheaper to get to.

Willard White12:35

So, um

Willard White12:36

Let's try America.

Presenter12:37

What did you do?

Willard White12:38

Yeah.

Willard White12:39

My father heard of a place called the Juilliard School of Music in New York.

Speaker 412:44

Hmm.

Willard White12:45

And um

Willard White12:46

I went to New York on the I think the thirty first of August.

Willard White12:53

I'm nineteen sixty eight.

Presenter12:56

With a one-way ticket.

Willard White12:58

with a one way ticket and a hundred dollars in my pocket, given by my father, both.

Presenter13:03

Record number three. Tell me about that.

Willard White13:05

Record number three. Um in my preparation for this great journey, one thing that was recommended was an aria from Don Carlos, El La Jamaimamo.

Willard White13:18

And I remember listening to Nikolai Gyarov singing this aria.

Willard White13:23

And um it actually just blew my mind.

Presenter14:25

Nikolai Giarov as Filippo singing Ella Gia mi mamo from Verdi's Don Carlos with the orchestra of the Royal Opera House conducted by Sir George Schulte. That's what you sang, Willard White, in your audition at the Juilliard School in New York, and you got in. They gave you a scholarship. They obviously recognised that you you know you couldn't afford it otherwise.

Willard White14:44

I yeah, I I don't know what the system was. Um, you know, lots of people are applying for scholarships.

Willard White14:51

Maybe they thought this poor boy from Jamaica needed some help.

Willard White14:55

I don't think they think like that. Th it's a talent maybe they recognize and they figure, well

Willard White15:01

That's it. But I had a girlfriend at the time who said to me that you know why you got a scholarship. It's because you're black.

Willard White15:10

I didn't believe that.

Willard White15:12

And I still don't believe that.

Presenter15:13

You nearly gave up and went home, didn't you, in those first six months?

Willard White15:18

Yeah, so um there are lots lots of difficulties um in New York.

Willard White15:23

For one thing, I'd never really heard a full orchestra, symphony orchestra, play and I'd never spoken Italian. Okay, I'd learnt um El L'Ajama Mamo phonetically with some assistance from somebody who had some knowledge of Italian and also listening to the record. But the standard that I found at the Juilliard was so daunting.

Willard White15:46

that I felt that I I just could not live up to this.

Presenter15:50

Because the other students were so much more practised than you. I suppose they could cite, read, and all the things that matter.

Willard White15:55

Oh yes, they they had everything. I mean, Juilliard is a f like a finishing school for young professionals to just do

Willard White16:02

the last leg before venturing into this big wonderful world waiting to, you know, embrace them.

Presenter16:10

And you were just starting.

Willard White16:11

And I was just starting.

Presenter16:12

And then there was the weather.

Willard White16:13

Well, the weather, I mean, coming from a s a country where you have daily sunshine and if it's overcast it's for a short time and a a heavy downpour of rain will take place and then it's sunshine again.

Speaker 416:21

Yeah.

Presenter16:21

I have

Willard White16:26

And to be in New York and seeing one day, complete day of overcast and

Willard White16:32

second day there was thick grey clouds and nobody was looking up thinking that the world was coming to an end, but just myself thinking that what's going on here? It's this is not normal. And then uh later on when it started becoming cool,

Willard White16:46

the sort of coolness that I had only experienced from a a fridge door left open in Jamaica or a block of ice that would be delivered to cool some drinks. I remember one evening going home from college and turning down A Hundred and Fifty fifth Street, going towards Riverside Drive. It was down a hill.

Presenter17:03

Two

Willard White17:05

and the wind was so strong and cold that I felt that I

Willard White17:10

must go home.

Presenter17:11

So why didn't you go? Where did you find the courage to stay?

Willard White17:16

The courage to stay came from I must go home, this is too much.

Willard White17:21

And then

Willard White17:23

But what will I say to my friends when I go home? Those who said, Oh, Willet, it's fantastic, you're going you're going to make it. Fantastic. Good luck, boy.

Willard White17:33

But not them so much, but how could I face myself?

Willard White17:39

And I thought

Willard White17:40

I must.

Willard White17:42

Try harder

Presenter17:44

Tell me about your next record.

Willard White17:48

My next record is from a great great performer, a great lady, whom I actually met face to face at the jewel yard, Maria Carlis. She was running master classes there, and I was one of the

Willard White18:03

the um participants and um she uh was very strong, very beautiful woman and um her artistry was is something that is still unmatched.

Speaker 418:20

Ho Je po fine core.

Speaker 418:28

Middle E swan o

Speaker 418:32

Il mio cori voi jaindor

Speaker 418:43

Safe Fiago

Speaker 418:47

Sitting though on the hillside

Speaker 418:56

La vinchero si lito vil soro.

Speaker 419:05

No durai I

Presenter19:16

Maria Callas singing Una voce pocofar from Rossini's Barber of Seville, with the theatre orchestra of La Scala Milan, conducted by Tullio Seraffine. Master classes with her apart. Did you ever have any kind of personal interchange at all? Did you ever sit down and just chat to her?

Willard White19:32

No, I didn't. Um there was one time I remember being in the lift and in walked the great Maria Kallas with um the president of the school at the time.

Willard White19:46

And I was so t she was so beautiful, so

Willard White19:51

Yes, so powerful, this aura that she carried and everything and she was smiling at me, and the President was there both smiling at me, and I I I just went out and before I could get something out they had reached their destination, the lift doors opened,

Presenter20:08

And you never spoke.

Presenter20:11

And then one day along came perhaps the next big catalyst in your life in the shape of Lord Harwood, who was then managing director of the English National Opera here.

Presenter20:21

What did he offer you?'Cause he heard you and he liked you, didn't he?

Willard White20:26

He heard me in New York, and he then mentioned me to

Willard White20:30

The agent that I still have, um Tom Graham.

Willard White20:33

And he said, Okay, well, come over to England and do some auditions.

Willard White20:41

One thing led to another. I had a meeting here with Lord Howard and talked about the contract, and so uh among other things I joined the English National Opera Company.

Willard White20:52

As a contract singer.

Presenter20:54

This was mid-seventies. And the parts have rolled in, well they rolled in from the beginning really, didn't they? From Monteverdi to Mozart to Shostakovich, from Seneca, Osman, Boris and so on. And eventually, of course, some years later, the Porgy. And you've sung too in, I know, Paul McCartney's Liverpool Oratorio. You've always kept it broad, haven't you? You've kept the range.

Willard White21:16

I kept a a a broad range, yes, because I didn't want to specialize. I wanted to sing.

Willard White21:23

Anything that I could sing.

Willard White21:26

And so I I accepted a a variety of jobs.

Speaker 421:29

Hmm.

Willard White21:30

Because, you know, there are people who talk about favorites, for example.

Willard White21:34

Um and I

Willard White21:36

I had difficulty finding a favourite.

Willard White21:38

and I thought that there was something missing, but I realized that if I had a fav favorite thing that I favorite opera that I ha would do,

Willard White21:46

Then I'd be missing it when I was doing something else.

Presenter21:48

Hmm.

Presenter21:49

Next record.

Willard White21:50

My next record.

Willard White21:53

Is um

Willard White21:55

from the Bach cello suites. And I find these suites liberating. The sound that that comes from the the cello and the way that Bach has has set up the melody is

Willard White22:09

It's something that is not held.

Willard White22:12

It's something that is freeing. Sometimes you don't know exactly which direction the melody will go.

Willard White22:19

And

Willard White22:20

It's some way that that speaks to the way I'd like to live and express music.

Presenter23:26

Pablo Casal's playing part of the prelude of one of Bach's suites for unaccompanied cello, suite number six, in D major. Um, Willard White, there was a great b brou ha at the ENO surrounding you in the mid eighties, um, when the offer of a role in Jonathan Miller's Rigoletto suddenly was taken away. You were de invited, as it were, and the GLC said that it was racism at work and threatened to withhold its grant from the ENO. Did you feel you were suddenly being rejected because of your colour?

Willard White23:55

No, not certainly it's not something new.

Presenter23:59

So you did think you were being rejected because of your colour?

Willard White24:03

It happens, you know, it it happens a lot in in in this life.

Willard White24:08

Um there are situations where because of your colour um you're just looked at in a different way.

Presenter24:14

In the world of opera.

Willard White24:15

In the world.

Presenter24:17

But I'm amazed that you say it it it's at work in the in the world of opera, really. I can't I find that very difficult to believe.

Willard White24:25

Don't get me on a track where I can say well you're not black.

Willard White24:29

You know, you don't know.

Willard White24:31

Yeah.

Presenter24:31

Mm-hmm.

Willard White24:31

Whether you find it difficult to believe or not, it's there.

Willard White24:35

Um and that's it.

Presenter24:36

So do you think sometimes when people are saying, look, dramatically, this is not going to work? I know you played in Eugene Onyegin once, didn't you, as The Prince and the the the Russian girl Tatiana marries the prince.

Speaker 224:48

S

Presenter24:49

And I think the Tatiana, the person playing that role, had difficulty, didn't she, with accepting.

Presenter24:55

The fact that you were black because she didn't think dramatically the young peasant girl would fall in love with a man who was black.

Willard White25:03

Yeah.

Presenter25:04

Do you believe that is racism, or do you accept that that was her dramatic objection for it, that it wasn't to do with you personally?

Willard White25:12

I accept that it was her objection I mean, dramatically, and so on. That's fine. Um it turned out that I was actually there personally. I'm not Prince Gremin she is not Tatiana it's a whole make believe world, and the colour business is not that important.

Willard White25:30

It is made to be that important is made as a stumbling block.

Speaker 425:33

Oh.

Willard White25:34

I haven't sort of lived my life focusing on on racism because it's very destructive.

Willard White25:40

But I know that there have been many situations where I mean, even people have thought of it kindly and not say, Well, you know, we can't have a Mephistopheles who is black because um it's fostering this feeling of of the black devil. I mean, you know, there is that too.

Willard White25:56

And so it's it's because of my colour. And now that's is that racism or what? What is it? What is that?

Willard White26:02

You know, um

Willard White26:04

I think in this world there is this wonderful fabric of colors.

Willard White26:08

And um maybe it's easier for me to say so because I'm of a certain distinctive quality that makes me noticeable and um

Willard White26:18

in a in a in a field of um

Willard White26:22

White people

Willard White26:24

I stick out. But I also stick out in Jamaica there. I don't know what it is about me.

Willard White26:29

But, um I don't blend very easily.

Willard White26:34

And it's very important in this world that we

Willard White26:39

appreciate our differences and make a a valid contribution to whatever aspect of life we're dealing with.

Willard White26:47

and the differences are fantastic.

Presenter26:49

Record number six.

Willard White26:51

Number six, um, Cesare Sieppe singing.

Willard White26:54

De Vienna la finestra, the serenade from Don Giovanni. I find this particularly interesting because.

Willard White27:02

The way he sang it and when I heard it many years ago,

Willard White27:07

I thought, what a challenge that is because it's very difficult to sing.

Willard White27:12

And that is one of the things that I'd have to um equip myself to in order to perform in this world of opera.

Speaker 427:21

Bienia Lafin estra for meotestoro Verbienia cum sola biam.

Speaker 427:47

Ser meamidora quietly.

Speaker 427:57

The hunting wind. More.

Presenter28:03

Oh

Presenter28:13

Cesare Sieppe singing De Vieni alla finestra come to the window from Mozart's Don Giovanni, with the Vienna Philharmonic conducted by Josef Kripps, and that was recorded in nineteen fifty five.

Presenter28:24

You're about to sing in the London Jazz Festival, Wyllard, in a a tribute to Paul Robeson. Is he somebody who perhaps originally inspired you?

Willard White28:35

The inspiration goes back to Jamaica. A friend of mine, Denzel Southwood Smith, played a recording of I think it was a piece called Trees.

Willard White28:45

which I haven't heard since, and so maybe I think that I had the title wrong, but uh it was fairly clear in my head, trees. I thought, wow

Willard White28:54

This is terrific, and he is black.

Willard White28:57

You know, um this is one encouragement,'cause I hadn't heard a a black man singing that sort of repertoire, ballad, or anything like that before. So I thought, well, this is nice, um, yes.

Willard White29:10

I like that. Yes, therefore I can do it too. So from that point, from that standpoint, um, he was an inspiration.

Presenter29:18

Did your father ever come and see you sing in public? You know, in opera?

Willard White29:22

In opera, no, he never heard me and my mother never heard me either. Um my mother couldn't read and write and she um certainly wouldn't find it possible to sign a passport document to get the required papers. And I have to say that

Willard White29:42

As a young boy, young man, I was also embarrassed.

Willard White29:46

Um the fact that my my mother was

Willard White29:50

Like this.

Presenter29:51

Illiterate.

Willard White29:51

Illiterate.

Willard White29:53

But now

Willard White29:55

I recognize that illiteracy is

Willard White29:59

is just one of these things that can happen in this life. My mother was the most beautiful, wonderful, generous person that I've ever known.

Willard White30:09

She didn't find the need to say I love you.

Willard White30:16

And I never told her I loved her.

Willard White30:19

It was just there.

Willard White30:21

My mother would make a meal, for example, as as I look back now and she and she wouldn't say Time to eat. She'd say, You're hungry?

Presenter30:32

But she never

Presenter30:33

knew or understood her son's great talent.

Willard White30:36

No, I I spoke with her about it. Um, I remember once when I was back in Jamaica and she was still alive and um it they were making a big fuss about my being there and doing some concert and she she didn't particularly want to come. To to dress up and to go to a public function like that

Willard White30:58

Um, it was just too much for her.

Speaker 431:00

Hmm.

Willard White31:00

It's not something that she longed for anyway. I would say it's too much. It's not it wasn't her burning desire.

Presenter31:09

Echo number seven

Willard White31:12

Record number seven.

Willard White31:14

In my days in in New York, in the early days when I had to listen to a lot of classical music in order to train my ears to appreciate the style, one of the things I listened to um was um Mozart's uh s piano concerto in C major, and I remember even dancing to it.

Presenter32:35

Robert Cadesu playing part of the andante from the piano concerto number twenty one with the Cleveland Orchestra conducted by George Sell.

Presenter32:43

So tell me, Willard White, about you on a desert island, left to your own devices, no one to help you, no one to console you, completely alone.

Presenter32:52

Could you cope?

Presenter32:54

practically and psychologically.

Presenter32:57

Would you be all right?

Willard White32:59

I would be desperately lonely at the start.

Willard White33:05

But I'm a survivor, and I would find ways of coping. Yes.

Presenter33:11

and as you sit there on the beach at sunset.

Presenter33:15

Looking back across it all, your life, your career.

Presenter33:19

Any great regrets?

Willard White33:22

A life lived does not need regrets.

Presenter33:26

Last record.

Willard White33:28

My last record is a very well special rendition. It's

Willard White33:37

It's moved me to tears, um, the first time I

Willard White33:41

Not real the first time I heard it, but I was actually looking out on a particular scene.

Willard White33:47

It struck me that.

Willard White33:49

There is always this choice between the horrible world for many of us and the wonderful world.

Speaker 433:57

I see trees of green.

Speaker 434:01

Red and rose is June.

Speaker 434:04

I see them blue.

Speaker 434:08

Fabi and you.

Speaker 434:10

And I think to myself.

Speaker 434:15

What a wonderful world!

Presenter34:23

Louis Armstrong's and What a Wonderful World. If you could only take one of those eight records, Willard, which one would you take?

Willard White34:31

That stumped you, isn't it?

Presenter34:31

That stumped you, isn't it?

Willard White34:34

You know, there's something um quite special about music without words. It leaves a r leaves room for you to

Willard White34:42

Just allow your imagination to.

Willard White34:46

to go.

Willard White34:47

So maybe I'd take the mozzare.

Presenter34:49

What about your book?

Willard White34:51

A book called The Power of Positive Thinking.

Willard White34:55

by Vincent Peel, I think was the is the author.

Willard White34:59

And that I would take with me.

Willard White35:02

As a reminder

Willard White35:04

In this desolate time.

Willard White35:06

that there is a possibility to turn.

Presenter35:09

Yeah.

Willard White35:10

At next corner.

Presenter35:11

And what about a luxury?

Willard White35:14

Luxury

Willard White35:15

I think I'd take seeds.

Presenter35:17

Willard White, thank you very much indeed for letting us hear your desert island discs.

Willard White35:22

Thank you, Sue.

Speaker 235:31

You've been listening to a podcast from the Desert Island Discs Archive. For more podcasts, please visit bbc.co.uk slash radio four.