Jennifer Saunders

Jennifer Saunders0:00

Hello, I'm Kirsty Young, and this is a podcast from the Desert Island Discs archive. For rights reasons we've had to shorten the music. The programme was originally broadcast in nineteen ninety six, and the presenter was Sue Lawley.

Presenter0:32

My Castaway this Christmas is a writer and comedian. As a child, she appeared to have no ambitions to become either funny or famous, and only achieved both after she met her equally well-known stage partner while they were training to be teachers. Together, they created a series of highly popular television comedy shows. But when her partner took a year off, my Castaway decided to go it alone, writing and starring in a situation comedy that has become a BBC classic. She plays Edina, the champagne-swilling mother of a straight-laced daughter who with her friend Patsy, equally bibulous and not averse to the odd snort of Coke, make mayhem in the grand style. Most people find it absolutely fabulous. She is Jennifer Saunders. It's true, isn't it, Jennifer, that AbFab came about by default, really, back in what was it, 92, because you performed without dawn.

Jennifer Saunders1:25

Yeah.

Jennifer Saunders1:26

Yeah, I mean we had both taken the ear off. I mean we both sort of

Jennifer Saunders1:30

decided that

Jennifer Saunders1:31

We love doing French ensembles, but you know, we just needed some time.

Jennifer Saunders1:35

to do other things, and the telephone didn't ring.

Jennifer Saunders1:39

The offers didn't pour in and you sort of had to keep employed. So, you know, agent ringing you a lot saying, Isn't there anything you can do, love?

Jennifer Saunders1:46

And eventually, I thought, well, I suppose I could write this character because I knew the character quite well.

Presenter1:52

Why don't you know the character well?

Jennifer Saunders1:54

Because it was one of the um sketches that Dawn and I did in French and Saunders, and I just felt that that character could go a bit further. You're not telling me Dawn played Patsy? No, Dawn played my daughter.

Jennifer Saunders2:06

She was obviously too old.

Presenter2:07

So it just developed but it was the first time without Dawn, really, wasn't it, that you'd done anything professionally?

Jennifer Saunders2:07

So it just developed.

Presenter2:13

Uh

Jennifer Saunders2:13

Yes, I mean we'd worked with a group called Comic Strip and made some half-hour films, you know, in the early eighties. But yeah, it was. It was the first time I'd done it. On your own.

Presenter2:20

On your own. Yes, completely. And it's been an incredible success. It's won BAFTAs and an Emmy and so on.

Jennifer Saunders2:22

Uh

Presenter2:26

You must have analyzed why. Why do you think people get hooked on these two women who swill bolly and snort coke, as I say? Where, as they say in the business, are are are the points of reference?

Jennifer Saunders2:37

Yeah.

Presenter2:38

Uh

Jennifer Saunders2:38

it's kind of wish fulfilment. I think people would like to live like that and I think

Jennifer Saunders2:42

We're quite strict on ourselves nowadays and what we allow ourselves to do and what we're told we should be doing, you know.

Jennifer Saunders2:48

How many units of alcohol, how many units of fat we're allowed to consume, and all this stuff. And I think people would actually kind of have more pleasure if they lived.

Presenter2:56

More like Adino Patsy. What we really want to know, of course, is how much of Jennifer Saunders there is in Edina. I mean is is is she the Mr. Hyde to your Dr. Jekyll?

Jennifer Saunders2:57

What we

Jennifer Saunders3:06

In a way, I suppose she is. I mean, she's.

Jennifer Saunders3:08

She didn't start out that way, but I've I think um the more I had to write, the more I used um um my own experience and minor neurosis. So

Presenter3:19

So what she has

Presenter3:23

More my mouthpiece in a way. So y you've been pretty slothful in your time, I understand, a bit like I you're a champagne drinker?

Jennifer Saunders3:28

Yeah.

Presenter3:31

I used to

Jennifer Saunders3:31

to be actually.

Jennifer Saunders3:34

Spoilt

Jennifer Saunders3:36

Because um every interview we tend to do or every photo session we do for the show, people just bring out loads of champagne. And you're always having to drink not this morning, I notice too, but what a refreshing change we are the corks aren't popping in here.

Presenter3:47

What a refreshing change we are.

Jennifer Saunders3:51

But um it has kind of ruined the thrill of champagne for me. But you're a wonderful mother, I'm sure. How old are your daughters? Three of them. Yep, um the youngest one is six and the two older ones are nine and ten. You've really done it.

Presenter4:04

All in one go, haven't you? I mean, in the past ten years, not only have you had all of this success, but you've also produced these three children. You must be exhausted.

Jennifer Saunders4:06

Yeah.

Jennifer Saunders4:13

It's it's a matter of w of becoming more organized, which I never was before. And I think that children force you to p to

Jennifer Saunders4:20

to organize your life and uh and sort yourself out a bit really.

Jennifer Saunders4:24

Tell me about your first record. Uh the first record is Moondance by Van Morrison.

Jennifer Saunders4:30

And I think I'd like to take it only because every time I hear it it's a very happy song and it's a very upbeat song. And I think if there's one thing I would require, it's it's something to make me stand up and move.

Speaker 14:43

Well it's a marvelous night for a moondance With the stars a pearl in your eyes

Speaker 14:50

Fantabulous night to make romance Neath the cover of October skies

Speaker 14:57

The leaves on the trees are falling to the sound of the breezes that blow.

Speaker 15:04

Yeah I'm trying to please to the calling Of your heart strength that plays up and low

Speaker 15:11

You know the nature

Presenter5:14

Van Morrison and the title song from his album Moondance. I said that um you and Dawn French Jennifer were training to be teachers in the very late seventies at the London Central School, was it? Central School speech and drama. Were you really? I can't imagine either of you.

Jennifer Saunders5:27

Dawn definitely w went there with the intent of becoming a teacher, and in fact was a teacher for a year.

Jennifer Saunders5:35

I went there, um, slightly in error actually.

Jennifer Saunders5:39

I had to go somewhere and I j I thought I'd go there because it was in London. I wanted to come to London definitely and um

Jennifer Saunders5:45

I saw that, you know, I saw, wow, you need English. I had English luckily and uh

Jennifer Saunders5:50

And I came along and it was more of an audition you kind of did to get in. You know, you had to know if a note was up or down, and you had to put the leotard on and not look completely dreadful in it. Somehow I don't know how, but somehow I got in. I even pretended I'd seen a play, I think, too.

Jennifer Saunders6:06

The rivals of something which I never had. I think I'd only ever seen Charlie's Aunt in Worthing. I think that was my only theatre experience up to that moment. But what about you and Dor?

Presenter6:14

And were you immediately?

Jennifer Saunders6:15

They attracted to each other as it were.

Speaker 36:17

Um

Jennifer Saunders6:19

Eventually attracting, yes. I mean, I think it it was repelling at first.

Jennifer Saunders6:23

She was very um

Jennifer Saunders6:27

I don't see.

Jennifer Saunders6:29

Bubbly is completely the wrong word.

Jennifer Saunders6:32

but very outgoing.

Jennifer Saunders6:34

And very um

Jennifer Saunders6:35

sort of organized and

Jennifer Saunders6:38

popular probably and and I think I was probably considered a bit

Jennifer Saunders6:42

laid back or sullen or, you know.

Jennifer Saunders6:46

And and at first I think there was not antagonism, but I think there was definitely was was no meeting of the minds then.

Presenter6:52

But when was the moment, then, that you came together, as it were?

Jennifer Saunders6:56

That was when we shared a flat together and realized that, uh, you know, we made each other laugh.

Presenter7:01

And you started mucking about.

Jennifer Saunders7:03

Yeah, just really laugh.

Jennifer Saunders7:07

I mean it was a great time to kind of dress up because it was sort of tail end of punk. So uh we used to dress up as as punks and think we could sit in the tube and frighten people and stuff. And we used to wear the most bizarre outfits. And frighten.

Presenter7:21

I mean

Jennifer Saunders7:21

He went out.

Presenter7:21

Uh

Jennifer Saunders7:21

No, it was so unfrightening, we were tragically unpunk.

Presenter7:24

You became the Menopause Sisters.

Jennifer Saunders7:26

Who were they? What did they do? For heaven's sake. Oh, they just pretended they could put safety pins through their ears and uh

Jennifer Saunders7:35

and sung songs at parties.

Jennifer Saunders7:37

I knew about three chords in the guitar and I think Dawn knew about two and we used to we used to sort of amuse people at parties.

Presenter7:43

At what point did you think hang on actually you know, there there's something more than just making our mates laugh, isn't it?

Jennifer Saunders7:52

That was probably about ten years into our career, I think.

Jennifer Saunders7:56

But seriously, so you know, seriously, I don't think we have a

Presenter7:56

So you say you know what?

Jennifer Saunders7:58

I think there was probably a moment about six years in.

Jennifer Saunders8:02

When you suddenly stop and you go, This is now what I probably am going to do for the rest of my life, or this is how I'm going to earn my living.

Presenter8:09

Yeah. I didn't think that that was a good idea.

Jennifer Saunders8:09

Until then it was a way of of just sort of

Jennifer Saunders8:13

Keeping going and having fun. But Dawn did go off and become a teacher. Yeah, she was a teacher. And you took to your bed.

Presenter8:16

The ocean

Jennifer Saunders8:18

I lived in a sort of shambolic house in Chelsea with a friend of mine.

Jennifer Saunders8:23

And yeah, we used to just hang hang out really and do crosswords and And we did nothing for months on end.

Presenter8:29

But one day, this I mean, the great turning point was you, was it not seeing an advert?

Jennifer Saunders8:35

Hmm.

Presenter8:36

In a paper.

Jennifer Saunders8:37

I saw it I think it was in the stage'cause we used to

Jennifer Saunders8:40

look at the adverts at the back of the stage. And one day we saw an advert for the comic strip, um which is a club in Soho.

Jennifer Saunders8:47

Who did you do? What was the act? Oh, we had two American women that we did, called Muriel and Diana.

Jennifer Saunders8:54

And I think they took us through the next five years, really. They were good acts. Google

Presenter9:01

What did they do?

Jennifer Saunders9:01

Oh, they were. I mean, it was at the time when the word moosely somehow was funny, you know. So, anything alternative, that whole idea of.

Presenter9:02

Yeah.

Jennifer Saunders9:09

Alternative London, alternative culture.

Jennifer Saunders9:12

Was just coming in and and people having therapy and all that kind of thing. So th it was kind of therapy muesley based act.

Jennifer Saunders9:20

Echo number two.

Jennifer Saunders9:21

I think I'd like to take one kind of majorly sad thing.

Jennifer Saunders9:25

For the time when you just think, Oh, there isn't a boat coming and you can just put it on and imagine that you might be about to die.

Speaker 39:40

We are singing long.

Speaker 39:47

Red soul dress

Presenter10:32

Part of the lacrymosa from Mozart's Requiem performed by the Vienna Philharmonic and State Opera Chorus, conducted by Istvan Kertes.

Presenter10:41

I am right in saying, aren't I, Jennifer Saunders, that that your becoming a comedy actor and writer was completely unpredictable. I mean, there's nothing in your background, your childhood, no performers in the family.

Presenter10:54

No, there's no I I think there are

Jennifer Saunders10:55

Nothing in his school.

Presenter10:58

Nothing in your school life that might have hinted at it. Did you do any school productions? Hockey.

Jennifer Saunders11:01

Dinner

Presenter11:03

You were a horse, I understand. In the sense that, you know, like young teenage girls can be, just mad on horses. That's what you're doing.

Jennifer Saunders11:05

And the same

Jennifer Saunders11:10

I was mad on horses. Oh, uh completely. No, I was absolutely pony mad. You were Lucinda Proud Palmer, were you?

Presenter11:15

Will Lucinda prop

Jennifer Saunders11:18

I would have liked to have been. That was my big ambition actually, was to become a three-day eventer and to to win badminton three-day event was my biggest ambition.

Jennifer Saunders11:26

Until really I was probably about sixteen or seventeen, it was my biggest ambition.

Jennifer Saunders11:32

I think I got my first pony when we were we were in Wiltshire and I had a friend who had a farm.

Jennifer Saunders11:37

And I think I persuaded my parents that

Jennifer Saunders11:40

That if I didn't go away to school, this is my perception of it, probably not theirs, that if I wasn't sent away to school.

Jennifer Saunders11:47

then, you know, they could probably afford to buy me a pony.

Jennifer Saunders11:51

And I I got a pony when I was about eleven, I think.

Presenter11:54

and went to the local co.

Jennifer Saunders11:54

Yeah.

Jennifer Saunders11:56

What would the school reports have said about you? How would they have described you?

Presenter12:00

Yeah.

Jennifer Saunders12:00

I don't think anything was too bad. I think generally it w it was a kind of apathy thing. It was a could try harder comment on most things. Bit sullen.

Presenter12:10

Yeah.

Jennifer Saunders12:10

Possibly.

Presenter12:11

But it is interesting, isn't it?

Presenter12:14

A l a lot of shyness, as you say, is all bound up in them. People who are unforthcoming in that way are usually just terrified, basically.

Jennifer Saunders12:23

I think there was a time when I was very shy, but um

Jennifer Saunders12:26

But generally I th I think, I mean, even if I look at photographs, I think I probably was actually just quite sullen.

Jennifer Saunders12:32

Uh

Presenter12:32

Lazy sound

Jennifer Saunders12:33

Yeah.

Presenter12:34

I've been a really attractive character with her jacket.

Jennifer Saunders12:35

active character with Merjacks.

Jennifer Saunders12:38

I was very happy in my head, I have to say, so I think I lived a lot in

Jennifer Saunders12:43

You know, in my head.

Presenter12:45

Strange that you should end up performing on the stage. And there are different uh um descriptions of you as uh being

Jennifer Saunders12:50

There are

Presenter12:55

Having stage fright and also being too relaxed on the stage. I mean, which is it? I happen to relax.

Jennifer Saunders13:00

Next I know that.

Jennifer Saunders13:02

I have had that problem.

Jennifer Saunders13:04

Which is when you lose concentration a lot and you can't afford to do that. It's an unusual problem, it is.

Presenter13:08

Yeah.

Jennifer Saunders13:11

It happened when I was in a in a play with Dawn, I do remember becoming too relaxed.

Jennifer Saunders13:15

And actually there was a moment when I had a prop, which was a m magazine I could read. It was about guns and shooting and things.

Jennifer Saunders13:22

And I remember one time when I actually started to read the magazine and get really into the magazine and I just couldn't think where we were in the play. Record number three. Um this is Blondie.

Jennifer Saunders13:32

It's from a a period when, you know, London just felt great and uh

Jennifer Saunders13:37

We were you were kind of young and you just didn't care. You had nothing to care about, no property, no nothing, didn't care.

Speaker 313:47

Hey, you better come to you.

Speaker 313:53

I didn't have enough.

Speaker 313:55

Uh

Speaker 314:01

Yeah.

Presenter14:12

Blondie and I didn't have the nerve to say no from their album Plastic Letters and uh and Memories of a Misspent Youth, Jennifer, yeah.

Jennifer Saunders14:19

Yes, great. I love it.

Presenter14:20

Aerial bending time, you said.

Jennifer Saunders14:23

Well, kind of strutting down the street time.

Presenter14:25

Back at the the comic strip in the comedy store, which is the beginning of when you stop bending aerials or whatever you do, Raymond's Review Bar as well, you know.

Jennifer Saunders14:33

Uh

Speaker 314:33

Uh

Jennifer Saunders14:33

Yeah.

Presenter14:36

That was the early eighties. Um what kind of stuff were you doing by then on s

Jennifer Saunders14:40

Dawn and I used to get props. We used to find a prop and find something funny to do with it. It was kind of fairly basic stuff.

Jennifer Saunders14:48

And how did it go down in the comic strip?

Jennifer Saunders14:51

Well, I think I think okay. I mean initially we're only on like I think midweek nights which which could be very poorly attended, luckily.

Jennifer Saunders14:58

So we embarrassed ourselves initially in front of very few people, and I think the acts probably our act got better.

Jennifer Saunders15:06

Initially, you see, we th were under the illusion that we had to change our act every night.

Jennifer Saunders15:10

Because we thought, well, people have seen it now. You know, there might only be 10 of them, but they've seen it. And we thought we had to think up something new.

Jennifer Saunders15:19

The material will thin very, very quickly. And then we develop the French and Saunders persona. Did you call it? Because otherwise what you do is you you bow and wait for people to realize that's the end. And then

Presenter15:25

Did you call it otherwise?

Jennifer Saunders15:30

That sound is heard. Otherwise you don't know how to end a sketch, you see.

Jennifer Saunders15:34

And uh so we had to develop something that would uh could link the sketches. And that's how French and Sawn was developed, really. But did you call yourselves that then? No, it was Alexey Sale who who made that up. We were thinking of

Jennifer Saunders15:47

Other names, you know, the other acts were The Outer Limits and Twentieth Century Coyote and we thought, Oh, we can't just have our names. We were thinking of things like kitchen tiles and

Jennifer Saunders15:58

Great, big and little, or

Jennifer Saunders16:00

Big and big or something. Anything with n in the middle seemed to be good at that time.

Jennifer Saunders16:05

And then I think um I think probably Alexi just lost patience and just called us French and Saunders and that was it then.

Presenter16:11

And in the next dressing room in one of these places was a sort of sweaty bunch, cold in the middle of the city.

Presenter16:18

Burnellson, Rick Mail.

Jennifer Saunders16:20

Honestly, they were they performed in

Jennifer Saunders16:23

A hot theatre night after night, and they never cleaned their suits.

Jennifer Saunders16:27

Did they wash?

Presenter16:30

It was fairly heaving in there. But you you ended up marrying one of them, Aide Edmondson, who was of course eventually in the young ones. Um um did you spot him immediately? You thought that sweaty smelly one because it was

Jennifer Saunders16:41

No, it was it was a five-year slow burn.

Jennifer Saunders16:45

And uh, you know, one thing led to another.

Jennifer Saunders16:49

Record number four. Record number four is Janice Joplin singing Cry Baby.

Jennifer Saunders16:53

I adore Janice Joplin and I think there could be n no more perfect situation than being completely alone so I could do my Janice Joplin impression on a rock looking out to sea.

Speaker 317:04

And if you need me, you know that I'll always be right.

Speaker 317:11

If you ever want me, come on, it's

Speaker 317:25

Mm-hmm.

Speaker 317:27

Oh, daddy like you always say to do

Presenter17:35

Janice Joplin and Cry Baby. The BBC took a a gamble on French and Saunders in the mid eighties, didn't it? And it it eventually paid off, but it was a slow start.

Jennifer Saunders17:41

Yeah.

Jennifer Saunders17:43

It was a very expensive article.

Presenter17:46

Effectively, therefore, you learned your trade on the hoof.

Jennifer Saunders17:49

On the hoof. Yeah.

Presenter17:49

On the job.

Jennifer Saunders17:50

I think you have to. I mean, I think it's harder nowadays to.

Jennifer Saunders17:54

The whole nature of television means that people t tend to

Jennifer Saunders17:58

I tend to judge quicker and take less risks and I think uh but if something isn't an immediate success then the chances of it getting a second series are probably slimmer than they were. It's not impossible, but I think it's a good idea.

Presenter18:08

It was always the BBC's great strength, wasn't it, though? That it was prepared to live with perhaps a couple of series that didn't take off, believing that eventually would.

Jennifer Saunders18:11

Yeah.

Jennifer Saunders18:15

didn't take off.

Jennifer Saunders18:18

wasn't great and uh

Jennifer Saunders18:21

Don't I look back on it and we're quite embarrassed. But we were very cocky then, and you know, you did go into it thinking, oh, we now do television, we've watched television.

Jennifer Saunders18:29

We know what to do and um we made some very big errors. We

Jennifer Saunders18:34

We were lucky that there was a time when the BBC did invest in us and did trust that we might make it eventually.

Jennifer Saunders18:40

Do you get the feeling you you you just squeezed in before they shut the doors? We did leap through that little loophole, I think, yeah.

Jennifer Saunders18:48

And it closed behind us.

Jennifer Saunders18:50

Next record. Um the next record is the prelude to Parsifor.

Jennifer Saunders18:55

But I must say I'm not a I'm not a fan of Parceful the whole of Parcel. I kind of I kind of cut off when the singing starts and the big people come on.

Presenter20:02

Part of the prelude to Wagner's Parsifau, played by the Concert Orchestra of Amsterdam conducted by Bernhard Heitink.

Presenter20:09

So you and Dawn, as you say, are safely on the inside and you signed a contract, a five year contract, back in ninety three, I think, for zillions of pounds. Well, not true.

Jennifer Saunders20:20

Say that we didn't uh

Jennifer Saunders20:22

We didn't get paid. It was actually from our we wanted the security actually of um of knowing that we had somewhere to to put programmes for five years, you know.

Jennifer Saunders20:32

Uh

Presenter20:32

To do what you initiated.

Presenter20:38

Uh

Jennifer Saunders20:38

Yeah.

Presenter20:38

you know, for safety. But but what I understand is that that you could, you know, do another series of Absolutely Fabulous if you felt you could write another one, or you could do another series of French and Sorters, or not, or do something else. It left you kind of free. You were

Speaker 120:50

Uh

Jennifer Saunders20:50

Here's some

Presenter20:53

Married to the B B C as it were, but within that marriage you could

Jennifer Saunders20:53

Yeah.

Presenter20:56

Move around a bit.

Jennifer Saunders20:57

Yeah.

Presenter20:57

That's what it was. Which is quite nice. It's writing, it's being a writer as opposed to a performer that gives you that strength, isn't it?

Jennifer Saunders21:04

Yes, I mean that it's a huge advantage. I think without that you're in the market, you know.

Presenter21:09

Uh

Jennifer Saunders21:10

You just have to do what you're told if you're just a performer.

Presenter21:11

Do what you're told if you're just a performer.

Presenter21:14

How do you and Dawn do it, right? Like, apparently you shut yourselves in a room together and nobody else is allowed in because you'd all be too embarrassed. Writing it, I mean.

Jennifer Saunders21:24

If you're writing as a double actic, it is kind of embarrassing sometimes because you have to

Jennifer Saunders21:29

make up characters and make up things that aren't particularly funny and you have to become other people and um if you have a a good relationship with the person you're working that's fine, it's not embarrassing, but um

Jennifer Saunders21:39

I wouldn't do it but it's strangers.

Jennifer Saunders21:42

Yeah.

Presenter21:42

So it sounds just not funny.

Jennifer Saunders21:42

The sum sh

Jennifer Saunders21:43

Uh

Presenter21:45

But Dawn obviously seems to be the secret in all of this. You know, she's a bit of a catalyst, isn't she?

Jennifer Saunders21:51

It's very different writing on your own to writing

Jennifer Saunders21:53

A sketcher or doing characters with Dawn, it's the best fun to sit in a room with someone and just make each other laugh. It's great. As long as you can.

Presenter22:02

continue to like each other, which you do.

Jennifer Saunders22:03

Yeah.

Jennifer Saunders22:04

What a

Presenter22:04

What about Joanna Lumley on Absolutely Fabulous? Is she any kind of cat? I know she doesn't write it with you, but but...

Presenter22:12

You know, it's kind of creative input there too.

Jennifer Saunders22:12

You know, it's not a creative

Jennifer Saunders22:14

Oh yes, I mean for for everyone who's in the show, and Jana particularly, I mean, she's she's sort of invented Patsy in a in a way.

Jennifer Saunders22:21

I mean, I wrote the lines, but

Jennifer Saunders22:24

That character came from her, really.

Jennifer Saunders22:26

But wait

Presenter22:26

When you're recording it, I understand you stay in character the whole time, don't you? You don't sort of Oh, we mess about a lot. I mean, it's not str Clean character.

Jennifer Saunders22:33

Uh

Presenter22:33

But are you messing about to amuse the studio audience or because oh really it's

Jennifer Saunders22:36

Yeah, to amuse the studio.

Presenter22:38

It's not because you personally need to stay in

Jennifer Saunders22:41

Yeah. All right.

Presenter22:42

Uh

Jennifer Saunders22:42

Tell you, no, not at all.

Jennifer Saunders22:45

It takes a lot to keep me in character. I have a.

Jennifer Saunders22:48

a sort of shallow level of concentration.

Presenter22:50

Uh

Presenter22:51

Have you worked on that or don't you think that's the only thing that's not?

Jennifer Saunders22:53

It's come by doing comedy, I think. I couldn't don't think I'd be very good at um doing anything particularly serious now.

Jennifer Saunders23:03

I've been doing is trying to find the funny possibilities in something and

Jennifer Saunders23:07

The funny possibilities in being very serious are

Jennifer Saunders23:11

Not great.

Presenter23:12

Not a great

Jennifer Saunders23:13

Record number six. Record number six is A Case of You by Joni Mitchell. I sort of came to Joni Mitchell late.

Jennifer Saunders23:21

I think I was put off initially. She just looked like a kind of skinny sixth former with a guitar, which is a sort of nightmare.

Jennifer Saunders23:27

And now I listen to her an awful lot.

Speaker 323:31

So sweet old I

Speaker 323:35

He saw you die.

Speaker 323:42

Still I'd be almighty, I will still be your mind.

Presenter24:00

Joni Mitchell and A Case of You from her Blue album.

Presenter24:04

So absolutely fabulous is absolutely over, is it?

Presenter24:07

No more say yes or never say never.

Jennifer Saunders24:11

No, I think I am saying never.

Presenter24:12

This time.

Jennifer Saunders24:13

Uh

Presenter24:13

Uh

Jennifer Saunders24:13

Yeah.

Presenter24:13

Uh

Jennifer Saunders24:13

Yeah.

Presenter24:13

He said it before.

Jennifer Saunders24:14

I did, but then I th I hadn't ruled out the possibility of of maybe doing a film.

Jennifer Saunders24:19

But that didn't work out, so I it became a T V special.

Jennifer Saunders24:22

But there's there's no more life in it.

Jennifer Saunders24:25

Okay.

Presenter24:25

And French and Saunders as a series is finished, but you do one-off specials? I think that's what probably what we'll do, is is specials.

Presenter24:34

So what are you going to do with your life now you're so rich and famous and successful?

Jennifer Saunders24:39

You have

Presenter24:40

Okay, ladies and gentlemen.

Jennifer Saunders24:40

You play Lady Macbeth, I think it's gonna live in bubble bath.

Jennifer Saunders24:43

Um

Jennifer Saunders24:45

I'd really like to write a film, I think,'cause it's a sort of next stage on, a sort of challenge, and I'd quite like to direct, really.

Jennifer Saunders24:52

No, would you? You don't strike me as the sort of person who likes

Presenter24:56

Telling other people what to do. I'm very good at it, I assure you. I am.

Jennifer Saunders24:59

Uh

Speaker 324:59

Yeah.

Jennifer Saunders24:59

Uh

Presenter25:00

I can be very bossy. How much do you fear the critics? Because you do, you know, people like you and Dawn get into a kind of no-win situation, don't you, where you've been so successful now for so long that they're just waiting for you to fall.

Speaker 125:09

Uh

Jennifer Saunders25:09

Yeah.

Jennifer Saunders25:15

Yes, they are. And, um

Jennifer Saunders25:19

I mean, I don't like bad criticism, you know, it I find it quite um quite hard to take and it makes me very cross.

Presenter25:26

But does fear of the critics stultify your creative what's it, as it were?

Jennifer Saunders25:33

Not fear of it, it's the anger that's, um

Jennifer Saunders25:36

It makes you feel if you've had a a bad review or or something.

Jennifer Saunders25:40

A non-constructively bad review.

Jennifer Saunders25:46

The next thing you write you're writing out of a feeling that you want to get back at them and show them you can do it and all the rest of it. Is that not a good thing? No, it's really not good.

Presenter25:52

Is that not a good thing?

Jennifer Saunders25:56

But you've you can't I can't do it f well, I can't do it from that.

Jennifer Saunders26:00

One of my favourite um singers of all time is Elvis Costello, and I've listened to him right from, you know, when I was at college up until now, and uh I think he's just terrific.

Speaker 326:16

To sand that love would never dare

Speaker 326:24

I'll watch out for you.

Speaker 326:28

I'll always feel it.

Speaker 326:33

In the hour of your distress, you need not feel it all

Presenter26:43

Elvis Costello and Sweet Pear from his album Mighty Like a Rose. Now, Jennifer, we normally uh prepare to cast you loose on the water at this stage, but as it's you and as it's Christmas, uh tell me instead what will you and your family be doing?

Presenter26:58

Adel be cooking.

Presenter27:00

Peter.

Jennifer Saunders27:00

Yeah. Yeah, Smith.

Jennifer Saunders27:04

I thought you might metamorphose into a human. I'm not the cook, you see. Aid's the cook.

Presenter27:05

Like metamorphose into a you know

Jennifer Saunders27:08

Really? And he he'll do the Christmas and uh is excellent at it, which is great. A great relief for me.

Jennifer Saunders27:16

Yes, now I make fires.

Jennifer Saunders27:18

I'm sort of log woman and firewoman. And I do decorations. I do the sort of decorating side. He does the the cooking side.

Presenter27:27

And the children

Jennifer Saunders27:27

Mm-hmm.

Jennifer Saunders27:29

Oh, the children have a great time. They decorate the tree and uh hope that they haven't just got a rotten tomato and a piece of string, which is what I told them I bought them for Christmas.

Presenter27:38

But you love your garden, which owes a lot to Vita Sackville West.

Presenter27:42

Is this true?

Jennifer Saunders27:43

Yes. I mean, I've I've

Jennifer Saunders27:46

Ador gardening now, which I never thought I would.

Jennifer Saunders27:48

Because um my parents used to love gardening and as a teenager to be you know woken up at ten o'clock in the morning by the sound of a wheelbarrow clanking up and down and I thought I'm never never gonna get into gardening and I completely have I absolutely love it. Tell me about your last record. Last record is um Emilou Harris. I have a great love for country music or a lot of country music um a lot of old-fashioned country music generally.

Jennifer Saunders28:17

I actually met Emily Harrison, so I was completely starstruck.

Speaker 328:21

Got him past that Brit Hidden Atlantic

Speaker 328:24

Gonna walk all over that pluck I get you

Speaker 328:29

But outside of Amarillo we found a drill tell you had often two jukebox and a pin-ball machine.

Speaker 328:38

Oh, I don't really know much more than before.

Speaker 328:45

Oh and real.

Presenter28:51

Emmelou Harris and Amarillo. Now, if you could only take one of those eight records, Jennifer, which one would it be? I have to say, I think it's probably would be

Jennifer Saunders28:59

The blondie, I think. Would it? Yes. The shouting in the streets.

Presenter29:02

The shouting in the streets, Johnny.

Jennifer Saunders29:05

Because I

Presenter29:06

Hanker after your lost youth.

Jennifer Saunders29:08

No, I find it very easy to

Jennifer Saunders29:11

To just sit.

Jennifer Saunders29:14

And it is a record that that could might inspire me to actually get up and walk and do something. What about your book?

Jennifer Saunders29:21

Um the book would be

Jennifer Saunders29:23

Freyr Stark's Traveller's Prelude.

Jennifer Saunders29:26

She's a great heroine of mine.

Jennifer Saunders29:29

Um

Jennifer Saunders29:30

And in the book is great descriptions of my two favourite places, which are which are Devon and Italy. And your luxury? My luxury would be the tribute heads by um Elizabeth Frink.

Jennifer Saunders29:44

which are sort of four.

Jennifer Saunders29:46

Massive head sculptures really.

Jennifer Saunders29:49

And the reason I thought I'd take them was not just because I have an audience and someone to talk to.

Jennifer Saunders29:53

But I think because I I I can very easily just sit and do nothing.

Jennifer Saunders29:59

And there might just be a moment when you just lose it and you just want to flap about in the sand like a a stranded fish. And I think they have there's a great dignity in them and a great sort of strength. I think they would they might sort of

Jennifer Saunders30:14

Inspire me to sort of remain sane. Jennifer Saunders, thank you very much.

Presenter30:19

Indeed, for letting us hear your desert island discourse and happy Christmas. And to you.

Jennifer Saunders30:31

You've been listening to a podcast from the Desert Island Discs Archive. For more podcasts, please visit bbc.co. uk slash radio four.