Ken Dodd

Speaker 10:00

Hello, I'm Kirsty Young, and this is a podcast from the Desert Island Discs Archive. For rights reasons, we've had to shorten the music.

Speaker 10:08

The programme was originally broadcast in nineteen ninety, and the presenter was Sue Lawley.

Presenter0:30

My Castaway this week is a comedian. He made his professional debut thirty-six years ago at the Empire Theatre, Nottingham, from where his mastery of the art of variety carried him unerringly to the top. Fellow comics admire his ability to hold an audience. The audiences, in their turn, have supported him loyally through countless stage, television, and radio shows. He is the great jester, whose rapid jokes, hilarious antics, and sentimental songs have won him the affection of millions. But like all jesters, he's had his share of troubles too, which he's had to weather in the light of fierce publicity. They're behind him now. That loyal audience is still in front. He is, of course, the king of the Diddy Men, the squire of Notty Ash, Mr Ken Dodd.

Presenter1:12

You're a man, Ken, who who finds it difficult to turn his back on an audience. What are you going to do on the desert island with nobody to play to?

Ken Dodd1:18

Well, uh yes, that that is I must admit, I would be uh absolutely desolate.

Ken Dodd1:24

Yes, I I cannot imagine myself just being on my own.

Presenter1:27

Can you tell yourself Jones?

Ken Dodd1:28

Yes, I would I think I could go through all my routines and uh lots of other people's routines, I think, and tell myself jokes and stories.

Presenter1:32

There's hell.

Presenter1:37

But do you laugh at yourself?

Ken Dodd1:38

Uh I would think so, yes. I would think that's the first thing uh any any comic has to be able to do.

Presenter1:43

You're a true Brit, Ken, and uh and and a true Northerner still. I mean, do you still feel less than at home down south?

Ken Dodd1:45

Okay.

Ken Dodd1:47

Still feeling

Ken Dodd1:49

Oh, no, I love I love London. I think London is absolutely su marvellous, wonderful, exciting. Theatres, shops. But the North is the North, after all, and uh

Presenter1:58

And you've never moved out of the family home in Notty Arch?

Ken Dodd2:00

I live in Notty Ash, yes, proud to,'cause I love the people, you see. The people of Merseyside are absolutely wonderful. They've got this tremendous sense of humour, and we're always laughing. Everything's a joke.

Presenter2:09

Can that really be true?

Ken Dodd2:10

It is, yes, everything's a joke. In Liverpool the supreme optimists, they see humour and laughter in every situation, whether it's a football match or the um there's a a German executive of Ford's once came over to get some work experience at Hale Wood and he was told always wear his badge because he said now, you see Herr Schmidt, they've got to know who you are at all times. They're very funny people. He said, Funny? Well, never mind, just wear the badge. So he's going along the factory floor and he comes to two two fellows and he said, Not then, he said, Do you know who I am?

Presenter2:10

Uh

Ken Dodd2:38

This was his puppin. He said, Do you know who I am? He said, Hey, Charlie, come over here. There's a fellow over here who doesn't know who he is.

Ken Dodd2:44

So that's the sort of thing that happens all the time.

Presenter2:47

Come on, let's get down to business. What sort of music do you need on the desert island? I love all kinds of things.

Ken Dodd2:50

I love all kinds of things.

Ken Dodd2:52

I love going to operas because I like to sing along with the choruses, you know. And I like ballet. Unfortunately, no matter how near the front I get, I can never hear the words. And I never know which side's winning. But I do like nice music and I like nice songs. So I would like a vocalist who I admire and have admired for many years called Pericomo. And this is a song called For the Good Times.

Ken Dodd3:13

In my imagination I would I would be remembering the happy days, the wonderful, wonderful happy days of childhood with my mother and father and my brother and sister in Notty Ash when we ran wild over the fields and my hobbies were digging holes and setting fire to my coat and falling out of trees and sending away forth to this place in London for itching powder and stink bombs. The happiest childhood anybody could possibly have.

Ken Dodd3:38

Hear the whisper

Speaker 23:41

Of the raindrops.

Speaker 23:43

Blowing soft across the window

Speaker 23:51

And make believe you love me one more time

Speaker 23:59

For the good times

Presenter4:03

Pericomo and for the good times.

Presenter4:06

So let's talk about that very happy childhood, Ken. Your your dad was a a a coal merchant.

Ken Dodd4:10

Coal merchant, yes.

Presenter4:11

His own business. Yes, and I was

Ken Dodd4:12

Yes, and I was a coal man for a while with my brother. They were they were very happy times. I used to we used to write jokes and make up songs and

Presenter4:19

But you started off wanting to be a ventriloquist in

Ken Dodd4:21

Well, I I was as I say, I was one of those little boys. I used to read this wonderful intellectual magazine, this paper called The Wizard.

Ken Dodd4:28

And I used to write away for these itching powders and things like a C bacroscope, which is one of the things for when I was eight years old. It's a thing you put in your eye and you can see if an assassin is creeping up behind you, which is very important when you're eight years old. And I read this advertisement one day. It said, Fool your teachers, amaze your friends, send six stamps, become a ventriloquist. So I did, didn't I? Yeah, you'll do it. And learn how to throw your voice. So this tickled me no end. So I sent away with this little booklet and I became a ventriloquist. Well, I thought I was anyway. Did you perform?

Speaker 14:47

Yes.

Presenter4:57

Did you perform?

Ken Dodd4:58

Oh, yes, yes. My father wrote the scripts and I got a ventriloquial figure for uh a birthday present. And my first appearance was at uh

Ken Dodd5:06

I'd be about eight or nine years old at St. Edward's Orphanage, and uh from that I the father superior gave me half a crown. Three months later I did a show for the Parent Teachers' Association at Nottias School, and the headmaster gave me a shilling. And I learned there you said I had to learn a very, very important lesson in show business. You have to learn to take a cut gracefully.

Presenter5:25

Tell me a bit more about your parents. Your father, I've read somewhere, was rather like Albert Tatlock in Coronation Street. Is that fair?

Ken Dodd5:33

Oh, I don't think so. Like Albert Hutler. Oh, Albert Hutler was quite uh quite a gentleman. No, my dad was a wonderful man. Oh, he was marvellous. He's as I say he was a musician, he had his own dance band, he ran the coal, the coal merchants' business.

Presenter5:46

And he liked to flutter on the horses. Oh yeah.

Ken Dodd5:48

Oh yes, oh yes, he was a he was a punter. He wasn't a gambler, he wasn't a gambler. There's a difference, you see. A gambler is one of these the the bookies love them, the ones who go into the betting shop and put fifty quid on a horse. That's that's crazy. Now my dad used to do all these permutations later on in his life, of course, when he had the time.

Presenter6:03

What about your mum? Tell me about that. Discrete.

Ken Dodd6:04

She was a lovely lady. She was quite small. She was a mini mum.

Ken Dodd6:08

And uh she gave us the most precious thing I think any parent can give any child. That was that she spoke to us, she talked to us. We used to spend hours and hours just talking to my mum, and she we'd talk about her childhood and her schooling and uh she was quite a brainy lady and uh she would just talk to us and I think that's why we're, you know, we're quite so happy.

Presenter6:26

I wonder what your mum would think of her kinney to day?

Ken Dodd6:29

I was very proud when I was able to.

Ken Dodd6:32

invite her to the Palladium. So she saw a couple of uh royal shows at the Palladium and I remember just before I I said uh goodbye to her, she she was very thrilled because we were going to the the royal Christmas household party at Windsor Castle and uh that was very nice, yes. She was only a little lady but she had a heart as as big as Notty Ash.

Presenter6:53

We better have your second record, I think.

Ken Dodd6:55

It's Al Jolson, and I think Al Jolson was the greatest showman that ever played a light entertainment stage. And I know this is shared by a lot of other people, because practically every comedian or every light entertainer all started off doing Jolson impressions. Whether your name is Des O'Connor or Max Bygraves or oh, every comedian all starts rock-a-bying a baby with a Dixie Melgie. But he was a superb showman. And so Al Jolson singing Mammy, I think would be a double tribute.

Speaker 27:36

Yeah.

Ken Dodd7:38

Mammy

Ken Dodd7:42

My, my little mammy, the sunshine's east and the sunshine west.

Speaker 27:42

R

Ken Dodd7:49

But I know where the sun shines there.

Ken Dodd7:54

It's on my merry I'm talking about.

Ken Dodd7:57

Wonderful. You see the dynamism is with the word. I know it sounds terribly corny now. All this mammy, mammy, don't you know me, mammy? But you can imagine what that did to an audience. Even today, you know, a a live audience. I know they're they're brought up on all sorts of electronic noises and synthesizers, but a good song is still a good song, you know. I know I love live audiences and when we I know a tear jerker when I hear one and there's no subject. If you want an audience on their feet, you have to make them cry first.

Speaker 18:06

Oh, even

Presenter8:24

People say if they haven't seen you live, then they haven't seen you, as it were, that you're best live. Do you feel that?

Ken Dodd8:30

Well, I I think uh an audience relationship with an artist is absolutely wonderful. Gracie Fields used to say it was like a silver thread between the performer and the audience. A lot of uh posh people say it's uh rapport. And I call it building a bridge.

Presenter8:43

I call it building.

Presenter8:45

Will you bombard people with jokes? I mean, can you still feel that audience? Although you're I mean, you're hardly waiting for the laughs, you're joking through them.

Ken Dodd8:52

Well, I don't do jokes. I don't do m well, of course I do jokes. I don't do more than about half a dozen jokes in the whole bit. Most of it's just talking to them and talking one lioness and building and and really talking about things that's irrelevant. But being a comic, I wanted to be a comic when I was about fourteen. How does one comede? What is being funny? So I had to sort of look back into my mind, and my idea of being funny was to be a clown, to be a burlesque. And I used to watch these singers in those days using On the Road to Mandalay, and that stuck me that that was ready for sending up. So I used to do that, and All Together and Floral Dance, and Granada, those sort of songs. And that was my idea of burlesque. I used to call myself Professor Jaffal Chuckabutti, operatic tenor and sausage nutter. And that was my idea of fun.

Presenter9:39

But was this part time while you were sort of humping the coal? Yes.

Ken Dodd9:41

Yes, yes. I was uh I I met a a marvellous lady in Liverpool called Hilda Fallon, who this lady's uh has a a a piece of magic. She can bring people bring people out as it were. She can make entertainers out of people. I went round with her uh round various places, and first of all concerts and then clubs. You can learn a lot in clubs.

Presenter10:01

What did you look like then when you were doing those early working mentality?

Ken Dodd10:04

I my idea was for being fun, as I say. I used to wear a a frock tail coat and a a pair of my old coal man's boots and my shirt hanging out, my hair parted in the middle. But you had the teeth. Oh, the teeth, yes, well the teeth, that was part of a that was part of a trying to be different. But I wanted to try and ride my bike with my eyes shut. And you can, oh yeah, for about six yards.

Presenter10:13

Yeah,

Ken Dodd10:23

Then boom the curb, over the handlebars, and landed flat on my.

Presenter10:27

and the teeth came forward, and they've stayed there ever since.

Ken Dodd10:30

I could have had them straightened, you see.

Ken Dodd10:33

Well, I I asked all my friends. My agent nearly had a heart attack.

Ken Dodd10:38

And they said, Oh, it wouldn't be you, Doddy, without your sticky out teeth. So I stuck.

Presenter10:38

But

Presenter10:43

It wouldn't be you without the tickling stick, either. Where did that come from?

Ken Dodd10:45

Well, that's the jester's prop. In the old days, you see, the jester of old used to have all these various props. He had a slap stick, which is two pieces of wood making that slapping sound. He had a fool's license. He was able to do and say things that nobody else dared do. He could hit the King over the head with the bladder on a stick, with his bladder. And it was very, very funny.

Presenter11:03

A pig's bladder, it wasn't his bladder.

Ken Dodd11:04

I was going to say, you've screwed the joke for me. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. There's always one, you see.

Presenter11:05

Keep room

Ken Dodd11:10

The joke is he could hit the king over his head with his bladder, and it was very funny if he'd been on the lager the night before. That's the joke. You've just ruined it.

Presenter11:20

I apologise, does it happen often?

Ken Dodd11:22

Yes, it does actually. Yes, the audience is trying to be one jump ahead of them.

Presenter11:22

Uh

Presenter11:26

But come on, let's get back to this tick because you used to sell those ticklings.

Ken Dodd11:29

Well no, this it started off as a a feather dust to begin with and I used to say it was a tickling stick, partly because the first thing you have to do when you uh gonna go on a stage any anywhere, because you get a bit excited and uh hyped up, is you have to control your hands. So the first thing you do is grab a prop.

Ken Dodd11:44

Now, my props were to hold the tickling stick, and that that sort of anchored you down for a bit.

Presenter11:49

Time for some more music, I think.

Ken Dodd11:51

I would like another

Ken Dodd11:53

Vocalist who I have great respect for, and I think is a wonderful song stylist, Frank Sinatra, and his song called You Make Me Feel So Young. Because I wanted to remember all the the happy times and the wonderful times of when I was a teenager and all the

Speaker 111:56

Wonderful.

Ken Dodd12:09

The boys being be boys will be boys, there was half a dozen of us. We had our own singing group called The Crows, and we used to sing songs, and then I started into show business.

Speaker 212:21

You make me feel so young.

Speaker 212:25

You make me feel so spring has sprung And every time I see you grin I'm such a happy Individual, the moment that you speak.

Speaker 212:40

I wanna go play hide and seek

Speaker 212:44

I wanna go and bounce the moon just like a toy balloon.

Presenter12:50

Thanks, Sinata. You make me feel so young. Tell me about humour and how portable it is. I mean, does what makes them laugh in Glasgow make them laugh in Bournemouth?

Ken Dodd12:59

The greatest thing that ever happened for uh comedians was Coronation Street. We found that it it was all a fib, that the uh the Southerners didn't mind in fact, not didn't mind, they adored the uh the terrace houses and the Lancashire accent, because it was very, very popular in Bournemouth.

Presenter13:17

But you analyze it, don't you, Ken? You you try to work out

Ken Dodd13:20

Well, as I say, I I I

Presenter13:20

BAAA.

Ken Dodd13:22

really fell in love with comedy when in my teens and I used to go to all sorts of my dad used to say, If you want to know anything, go to a library. So I used to go to all libraries and look up the word laughter, comedy, and that's where I I started this uh sort of research and I went right back to Aristotle and um

Ken Dodd13:40

He said that comedy laughter was a buttled mill wheel.

Ken Dodd13:44

I know this gentleman. And Freud and Schopenhauer and Bergson.

Presenter13:48

And now you've got your own library on the subject, haven't you?

Ken Dodd13:50

Oh yes, yes, I have uh I I collect uh comedy books and uh anything, anything to do with comedians.

Presenter13:56

How many have you got?

Ken Dodd13:57

I almost have mm I hope I've got ten thousand.

Presenter14:00

Ready?

Ken Dodd14:00

Yes, I hope so. Perhaps you should write your own. Well, one of these days perhaps. I'd like to write a book about comedy and about humor, because I think in the years I've learned quite a lot. They they write some people say there are only seven original jokes and I think there's I think there's twenty seven, twenty seven formulas.

Presenter14:15

Let's have your fourth record.

Ken Dodd14:16

When I turned professional in 1954, I was a s what they call a stand-up comedian. You're the one who goes on just before the Liberty horses to warm the audience up. And so I was a stand-up comedian. I did quite well. I started at Nottingham Empire in 1954 and I played Sunderland and Middlesbrough and Barnsley and then the House of Terror, Glasgow Empire, which for English comedians was, they used to say, Away haim and bile your head. First time I went on there, the manager said, Now, no football gags and you'll get the bird on Friday night. So on Friday night, terrified went on the stage shaking, my hair all over the place, my eyes popping. And my first line in those days to a Glasgow audience was, I suppose you're all wondering why I've sent for you.

Ken Dodd14:59

One man uncoiled himself from the second row with a bot half a bottle of whisky on in his hand, and he looked at me and said, Grapes, what a horrible sight and fell back into his seat. That was my first laugh, and probably my only laugh. So I got a couple more and got off as fast as I could.

Ken Dodd15:15

But like most comedians, I used to finish with a When you're smiling, when you're smiling, If your face wants to laugh, well, let it you know, that sort of a comic song. Uh but I I listened to people like David Whitfield, and I saw that he was very popular with Carami, I thought to myself, I could sing songs like that, you know.

Ken Dodd15:33

Choir boy? So I came to London and I saw a wonderful man called Jimmie Phillips, and I said, I want to make a record. He said, Well, what sort of a song? Well, I said, I like um Oh, he's noisy, I don't think that's uh I don't think that's pop material. Listen to this He played a a melody.

Ken Dodd15:48

It was called Monqueur et unvillain. I said, that's beautiful. And there were two lyrics. One was Violets and Violins.

Ken Dodd15:56

Been Crosby recorded, huh?

Ken Dodd15:58

and another one called Love is Like a Violin.

Ken Dodd16:01

And uh nobody was more surprised than me when it got to number one. So uh I'd like to hear Frank Chaxfield and his orchestra because they do a lovely job on Lovers Like a Viola.

Presenter16:37

Frank Chuxfield and his orchestra playing Love Is Like a Violin for Ken Dodd to sing to on his desert island'cause he's too modest to take his own version.

Ken Dodd16:44

I I must admit, uh I sing it a lot slower than that, and uh and I try to make it mean a lot more than that, but uh it's still a it's a beautiful song, and it's a beautiful melody.

Presenter16:55

Tell me about your support team. Who and what do they consist of? What keeps your show on the road?

Ken Dodd17:00

I've always had a very, very close family who have always helped me and supported me. Both my parents and all my family, and a lot of other people who I loved very much.

Ken Dodd17:12

We we we we got him,'cause you're two people, you see. You're you're Ken Dodd, the ordinary fellow from Notre Ash, and you become y there's another one, there's a Ken Dodd who is on the stage. He's quite different than me, honestly. Totally different man. But they they all got Ken Dodd too.

Presenter17:26

But we think we know the Ken Dodd that's on the stage. I mean, tell me about the one that isn't there. The one that lives in this house in Naughty Ash. What's he like?

Ken Dodd17:30

One that lives

Ken Dodd17:31

I keep my personal life and my private life very, very much very close to my heart because I think it's only fair to your family and your friends not to uh embarrass them.

Presenter17:52

But you've let bits out over the years and the the one bit that came out was I think it was you who said of yourself that you can be quite difficult to live with. You're a bit of a loner.

Ken Dodd17:53

Yeah.

Ken Dodd18:01

You've got to say that, haven't you? You've got to say that. Always always throw a journalist a tidbit.

Presenter18:06

So it's not true.

Ken Dodd18:07

Doe.

Presenter18:09

You are easy going, wonderful, ever smiling, ever optimistic.

Ken Dodd18:12

No, no, I think I'm completely normal. No, I think I'm normal. I think I'm I'm probably liverish in the morning, and uh full of the joys of spring about three o'clock in the morning when I should be going to bed.

Presenter18:14

Yeah.

Presenter18:22

But you like to be loved, Ken.

Ken Dodd18:24

Oh yes, very much so. Very much so.

Presenter18:25

Millions of people across the land, I'm sure, love you. I think I know, love you.

Ken Dodd18:29

Yeah.

Presenter18:30

Very nice.

Ken Dodd18:30

Um

Ken Dodd18:32

Uh as I say, your life is full of uh uh triumphs and excitement and then there are other times when there are sad times, when when there's bereavements and and difficulties and things like that. And it's a quite amazing I think we're very, very lucky, uh show business people to have so many kind and thoughtful and really nice people who who pray for you and send you letters and and really really

Ken Dodd18:55

It it gets right to you and you're you're very grateful.

Presenter18:58

But in spite of all of that love that I know you feel from audiences across the land and all those people who've prayed for you when you've been in trouble and so on, you still, beyond all of that, need one person to love, don't you? There has to be somebody special in your life for you.

Ken Dodd19:08

Oh, it has to be.

Ken Dodd19:10

Oh yes, and and I have I have yes, I have a a a a great love in my life, yes, a very, very special person, yes, oh yes, who uh I love very much, yes.

Presenter19:19

We better have your fifth record in that case.

Ken Dodd19:20

Well, in uh yes, it's uh love, it's all about love.

Ken Dodd19:24

Nutkin Cole to me was a great great song stylist. I'd like to hear him sing I Wish You Love.

Ken Dodd19:33

I wish you bluebirds.

Ken Dodd19:39

It will spring.

Ken Dodd19:42

To give your heart

Ken Dodd19:45

A song to sing

Ken Dodd19:49

And then a kiss.

Ken Dodd19:52

But more than this.

Ken Dodd19:56

I wish you love.

Presenter19:59

Natkin Cool, and I wish you love.

Ken Dodd20:01

I wish you love. Oh, yes. Sorry. Sorry, I thought you were speaking to me.

Presenter20:05

You said just now there were two Ken Dodds. Oh yes. Um I'm still interested in the other Ken Dodd and why he doesn't why he's not interested in the kinds of trappings of success that many showbiz people are.

Ken Dodd20:18

Oh, I many show businesses I don't know I don't know that show business people do live this glamorous and uh you know exciting jet setting life. I think most of them are so shattered when they've done their show, all they want to do is uh go home and uh you know close the front door and uh you know read a book or put the video on or the television.

Presenter20:36

Yes, but they usually shut the front door on on quite a large house with spacious grounds and probably a swimming pool in it if they've made the sort of money you've made.

Ken Dodd20:43

Yeah.

Ken Dodd20:47

Well, this is quite a large house, a large Georgian house, and uh I've got a uh a a couple of little uh other places that uh I can pop off to.

Presenter20:56

But no villa in Spain.

Ken Dodd20:57

No, no, because I thi I love travelling all over the world. I wouldn't want to be restricted to one place.

Presenter21:03

So what gives you the greatest pleasure to spend your money on? What do you like buying?

Ken Dodd21:08

Uh

Presenter21:08

See

Ken Dodd21:08

Gadgets, I love gadgets, and uh and and books, I like books.

Presenter21:13

So when people say that Kendar lives a very frugal existence, you would dispute that.

Ken Dodd21:19

Oh

Ken Dodd21:20

Time of my life. No, I love I love food. I first discovered nice food when I came into show business. I discovered the uh the joys of uh

Ken Dodd21:28

Of eating and uh how I've got the paunch to prove it. Yes, oh no, I love and I love travel. I love travelling, yes.

Presenter21:36

Let's have your sixth record.

Ken Dodd21:38

I love tenors. For my money the greatest tenor of all, because he had such warmth in his voice, as well as uh technical uh

Ken Dodd21:47

Prowess was uh Gilly. So, could I have something we should I'd like to perhaps couple this with the fact that uh I am a clown, of course. I am a clown, I'm very proud to be. Uh we've got uh the two sides of the clown, of course, and clowns often conclude their comedy performance with a a tearful earful. So, on with the mottley would be would lovely.

Ken Dodd22:14

Hello for joy for the

Ken Dodd22:38

Yeah.

Ken Dodd22:39

Yeah

Ken Dodd22:46

Uh

Ken Dodd22:47

Tell me all

Speaker 122:49

Yeah.

Ken Dodd22:55

Are gonna be on the

Ken Dodd22:58

Yeah.

Ken Dodd23:00

Uh The Irish in Gunnar. Uh

Presenter23:04

Beniamino Gigili singing Vesti la Giuba on with the Motle from Leoncavallo's Pagliacci with the orchestra of La Scala Milan.

Ken Dodd23:13

Beautiful.

Presenter23:14

On with the motley being the clown's uniform.

Ken Dodd23:15

Yes, the clown, yes. And uh clowns, you know, we've uh we've got some great some great clowns. I I once worked with uh I've worked with Charlie Caroli. I've worked in uh in Blackpool Tower Circus, In the Ring.

Ken Dodd23:27

Um

Presenter23:28

But what about when you're sitting in the dressing room and you've got the motley on?

Ken Dodd23:32

Yes.

Presenter23:32

Do you feel nervous still?

Ken Dodd23:33

Always, always, yeah. How nervous. Very nervous. I always get nervous. Before a show. The big Palladium jobs. You get you get very nervous, yes. The first time I played the Palladium, I remember sitting in this Yellow Rolls-Royce, the g one out of the film Mieno Genevieve, and sitting on the revolve, and it's sort of appears to drive in. So I had to be in the Rolls before the curtain went up.

Presenter23:34

How nervous

Ken Dodd23:53

And the first time I was so terrified was when I got out of the Rolls Royce, but the wall of applause, because the people who were rooting for me from all over the country had turned up.

Presenter24:03

Is that the moment then when when all those nerves drain away or just or do you still remotely?

Ken Dodd24:07

No, when you get on you feel better, you don't. No, you don't. It's just and your your your top lift goes stiff and and and and sticks to your teeth and you start going, How will how well? And you find yourself talking all sorts of rubbish.

Ken Dodd24:20

But um when it's going there's no sensation, there's no ecstasy like standing on the stage and seeing an audience rock with laughter.

Presenter24:27

Well now there are endless jokes Ken about your going on too long, not not getting off the stage. Do you do that on purpose?

Ken Dodd24:32

Too fun.

Ken Dodd24:34

Too long, Ms. Lawrence. Too long. Should we try to rephrase that?

Presenter24:38

That's what they say.

Ken Dodd24:39

Let's start again.

Presenter24:43

Right, there are endless jokes about your performances going on perhaps a little longer than they're scheduled.

Ken Dodd24:48

Not longer. A lot longer.

Presenter24:49

Yes, yes, yes.

Ken Dodd24:53

Yes, I do do a long show. Why?'Cause I enjoy it, and'cause it's uh you shouldn't break up a good party.

Presenter24:55

Pooh why?

Presenter24:59

But what about the Mac?

Ken Dodd25:00

Maxim that says you should always leave an audience wanting more. Like a lot of other maxims, sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. We always and I always say to the audience, give in. They always say, No! That's right, okay, off we go.

Presenter25:12

Well now psychiatrists might say that the desire not to stop telling their jokes, uh not getting off the stage is all born of insecurity, wouldn't they?

Ken Dodd25:20

Oh yes, I think all I think all comedians are insecure, because you're only as good as your last laugh.

Presenter25:24

Would you worry that the magic might suddenly go away?

Ken Dodd25:28

Oh yes, I think so, yes. I think all the comedians are conscious of the fact that you're treading a tightrope all the time and uh a joke is like a a watch mechanism. There can't be one word too many, one word too uh l and it's all a rhythm. Each word has to be a very special word in a very special place with a very special rhythm.

Presenter25:45

Some more music, I think.

Ken Dodd25:46

I think the best song that has been written in the last ten years is I Just Call to Say I Love You. I think it's a s absolutely superb song, sung superbly by Stevie Wonder, and I'd I'd like to hear that, please.

Speaker 125:59

I just called

Speaker 126:02

Just say

Speaker 126:04

I love you.

Speaker 226:08

Uh

Ken Dodd26:08

I just go.

Ken Dodd26:11

To say how much I care.

Ken Dodd26:16

I just go.

Ken Dodd26:19

To say

Ken Dodd26:21

I love you.

Ken Dodd26:25

And I mean it from the bottom of my heart.

Presenter26:31

Stevie Wonder, and I just called to say I love you. You're a bit, Ken, like Gina Lolla Bridgeta. Your age differs according to which book you read. Is this.

Ken Dodd26:38

Is it

Presenter26:39

Would you like to take this opportunity of putting the record straight?

Ken Dodd26:42

I think uh I'd like to remain this permanent thirty-five. Jack Benny was thirty eight, or thirty nine was he, thirty nine for a long time, and and I think I shall stay thirty five for a long, long time.

Presenter26:52

There's a six in there, so perhaps you're thirty-six.

Ken Dodd26:54

Thirty six. That's probably that's more, I guess, thirty six, yes, I'm probably I'm forgetting.

Presenter26:58

And still as stage-struck as ever, obviously.

Ken Dodd27:00

Yeah

Presenter27:00

So despite the fact you're you're thirty six, you're still not thinking of retiring for women at all?

Ken Dodd27:00

Yeah.

Ken Dodd27:05

No, no, no, I've got a very busy uh schedule this year. We're going to the Palladium in the autumn. I want to put a really big show back on at the Palladium. They've had musicals now for the past seven or eight years. I want to show what a really big, spectacular Palladium show is like. I want to show to all these young fellas and all these girls what a really big show is. You know, sixteen beautiful girls and a theatre orchestra and special acts from all over the world, men diving off a 200-foot pole into a wet flannel, that sort of thing.

Presenter27:33

It strikes me that there's still part of you that's never grown up, really.

Ken Dodd27:35

Oh no, no, I'm still a sort of a still a a boy comedian. I I think uh show business I think is such a wonderful business that uh you you it really is the happiness business and uh probably you may get a false sense of life, perhaps uh all would wanting to make people laugh and always want to be surrounded by laughing people, but it's a great it's a great life and I enjoy every second of it. Yeah. Uh

Presenter27:56

Let's have the last ring.

Ken Dodd27:57

All the records so far have all been male, all men. I'm not a chauvinist pig,'cause I do uh I I love the ladies and we've had some great lady comedians. I think uh the the greatest must have been the Queen, must have been Lucille Ball.

Ken Dodd28:11

And then down the years, uh Joan Davis and uh Hilda Baker and uh Marty Kane, we have uh great lady comedians and great lady vocalists. Now I was gonna say what's all this got to do with Elizabeth Schwartzkopf. It's got a lot to do with Elizabeth Schwatzkopf, because she is a great comedian as well. She came on this programme and chose eight of her own records. So and if you think what Schwatzkopf means, her real name is Betty Blackhead. That's her real of course it is, Schwartz Kopfhead. Her real name is Betty Buckhead. She's not kidding anybody. But she ha she is a beautiful singer. She's a beautiful singer. Beautiful voice. When you think these real singers uh spend a lifetime training their glottis, training their their their voice into a beautiful instrument. And I think people like Gili and

Speaker 128:38

Every

Ken Dodd28:59

The pavarotti and

Speaker 129:01

Betty Blackhair.

Ken Dodd29:02

Betty Blackhead laid on a beautiful So can I have Elizabeth Swatkoff singing Imchambre Separe?

Speaker 129:17

Achtzurives and

Speaker 129:26

Our birth shall pay and all the banks of thee on our seat for

Presenter29:41

Elizabeth Schwarzkopf with the Philharmonial Orchestra conducted by Otto Ackermann, singing Im Chambre Seppare from Der Oppenbaal by Richard Huberger. Now, do you know which of these eight records is your special favorite? Which one if you could only take one, which one would you take?

Ken Dodd29:55

If you could

Ken Dodd29:58

Oh, well now. I think it would be uh

Ken Dodd30:02

For the good times. Your imagination would be so important. Your imagination on a desert island when you're on your own. Or indeed we all we're all on desert islands sometimes in our lives. And uh you have to. It's your memories that really uh you start leafing through and uh remembering all the happy times, all the good times. So I think the good times. Remember the bad times too? Oh, really? You've got to remember the bad times, but you celebrate the bad times by saying, Well, the good times are here,'cause every day is a good day. I think in your life, I think you you wake up every morning thinking, Isn't this marvelous? What a wonderful life.

Presenter30:34

Do you believe?

Ken Dodd30:35

Are you

Presenter30:35

Are you really that optimistic, genuinely? Yes, genuinely. Or is that just a matter of time?

Ken Dodd30:36

I don't know.

Ken Dodd30:37

Yes, generally. Or is that for the most part? Yes, I am, yes. I think every day is a good day, and if you can't do something good for yourself, wouldn't do it for somebody else.

Presenter30:43

What book would you like, Ken? You've got the Bible, and you've got the complete works of Shakespeare. You're allowed another one.

Ken Dodd30:49

I think I'd have to have the uh the Times World Atlas because then, being on a desert island, I could look at the uh atlas and remember all the marvellous places, wonderful places I've visited, all the people I've met, and all the people I hope to meet and all the places I would like to go. So the Times Atlas.

Presenter31:05

And the luxury.

Ken Dodd31:06

Could I have some scented soap, please?

Presenter31:09

You made it? Yeah.

Ken Dodd31:09

Do you need it? Yes. Well, yes, I think everybody does. I'd like a box full of soap.

Ken Dodd31:13

Yes,'cause I enjoy soap. There's one particular one I like. It's it's that the the green one that gives you a schoolboy complexion.

Ken Dodd31:20

Oh really?

Presenter31:21

Have you used it recently?

Ken Dodd31:22

Isn't it? Always, always. That's why I look at perennial thirty-five.

Presenter31:25

Ken Dodd, you can have your soap, and thank you very much indeed for letting us hear your desert islanders.

Ken Dodd31:30

Thank you, Lady Sue.

Speaker 131:38

You've been listening to a podcast from the Desert Island Discs archive. For more podcasts, please visit bbc.co.uk slash radio four.